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ufojoe

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#15 : February 24, 2010, 10:01:24 PM

Joe has brought up a gas station that had tapes confiscated before, but it does not have a clear view of the impact site. Even if it did, it is likely the footage would not be that useful due to most security cameras of that sort are focused on the business.. not a building about a half mile away ( not to mention we're not talking about high def or even decent standard def cameras in most cases). Simple enough to use Google Maps to see the location of the Pentagon to see there's really not anything in the area that had an angle to see the plane coming in from the river. There's Arlington Cemetary to the west and some parks and the Potomac to the east.

Fine. Release the videos and let us decide if they're worth watching. Very simple.

DynaMike Glennon

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#16 : February 24, 2010, 09:57:12 PM


"I remember getting a call from the Fire Commander that they were not sure they were going to be able to contain the fire. I said we've had such terrible loss of life the smartest thing to do is pull it and they made that decision to pull. Instead we watched the building collapse".


You are awfully good at not stating the facts there genius. You might want to replay that audio and get the peanut butter out of your ears, alot of what you said that he mentioned was right except for one important word that you may have intentionally misheard at the end of the above statement. He did'nt say "instead" we watched the building collapse, he said "than" we watched the building collapse after they had made the decision to pull it, which they did. HUGE DIFFERENCE! Nice try though! Take care bye bye now!

Biggs3535

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#17 : February 24, 2010, 09:12:56 PM

Does this help any?
I sware it will take George W to come out and say 9/11 was a false flag attack for people to believe it, even than I don't think people will still believe it. Wake up!

You "sware?"

You might want to stop talking down to people when "swaring."


mjs020294

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#18 : February 24, 2010, 08:36:37 PM

I still believe two big purple dragons disguised as passenger planes destroyed the twin towers......and I will believe that until the day I die no matter what.   8)


dalbuc

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#19 : February 24, 2010, 08:33:38 PM

Why did they denie "pulling" it after admiting that they did. Saying that it collapsed all by itself due to fire damage and debris.

They didn't "pull" the building in any fashion, it fell on its own.

Silverman in that video says, and I'll transcribe for you, "I remember getting a call from the Fire Commander that they were not sure they were going to be able to contain the fire. I said we've had such terrible loss of life the smartest thing to do is pull it and they made that decision to pull. Instead we watched the building collapse".

Again, what part of the English language do you not understand that that paragraph isn't clear to you? The building isn't gonna hold up so they aren't gonna save it and then it falls down? Pretty basic verbs and sentence structures.

How about the fact that you take his word as authoritative and ignore the important part which says there is a raging and out of control fire and the building is in danger of collapse meaning you don't need to blow it up?

Finally, there's nothing in the dictionary that defines "pull" as a demolition term (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/pull) and the only site I can find dealing with it specifically (http://www.demolitionforum.com/means-methods/854-term-pull-used-demolition.html) denies it is a term dealing with explosives and I'm not sure he's going to be "up" on all the hip lingo of the demolition crowd.



All posts are opinions in case you are too stupid to figure that out on your own without me saying it over and over.

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#20 : February 24, 2010, 07:40:42 PM

Why did they denie "pulling" it after admiting that they did. Saying that it collapsed all by itself due to fire damage and debris.

spartan

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#21 : February 24, 2010, 07:24:43 PM


Did you even watch the video slick? Do I need to write it on a chalkboard like Glenn Beck does to his dumbed down viewers? Are you that dumbed down too?

I did, and coincidentally enough there is an excerpt in the link I provided about "pulling building 6". What it does is show that this "documentary" conveniently edits out the part where the construction worker shows the camera crew that they are in fact going to "pull" it. Yes, pull as in attach huge metal ropes to the building and PULL it down because they thought using explosives would be too dangerous.

Also, picking on bits and pieces of terminology that can have multiple meanings is a bit loose to put it mildly. I sometimes go to the bathroom to "pull  it" but I aint talking about demolishing the place. Then again if I'm not careful..... not wanting to brag or anything ...

spartan

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#22 : February 24, 2010, 06:33:12 PM

Oh and the small matter they "pulled' the building because of the non existent damage and raging fires that weren't raging. Can't have it both ways.

Interesting expansion on the pull and other stuff:

http://www.debunking911.com/pull.htm

Too much to cut and paste.

DynaMike Glennon

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#23 : February 24, 2010, 06:36:44 PM

Does this help any?
I sware it will take George W to come out and say 9/11 was a false flag attack for people to believe it, even than I don't think people will still believe it. Wake up!


"Apes(AKA Dalbuc) read philosophy Otto, they just don't understand it...."

They make a big deal that the leaseholder said to pull it down and yet ignore the context which is that the NYFD told him they couldn't save the building due to an uncontrollable fire and he said not to risk more lives and just pull it down - but then it went ahead and collapsed on it's own without any more help.

I swear if Dalbuc can walk and breath at the same time I'd be shocked.

Did you even watch the video slick? Do I need to write it on a chalkboard like Glenn Beck does to his dumbed down viewers? Are you that dumbed down too?

dalbuc

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#24 : February 24, 2010, 06:24:25 PM

Does this help any?
I sware it will take George W to come out and say 9/11 was a false flag attack for people to believe it, even than I don't think people will still believe it. Wake up!


"Apes read philosophy Otto, they just don't understand it...."

They make a big deal that the leaseholder said to pull it down and yet ignore the context which is that the NYFD told him they couldn't save the building due to an uncontrollable fire and he said not to risk more lives and just pull it down - but then it went ahead and collapsed on it's own without any more help.

I swear if you can walk and breath at the same time I'd be shocked.

All posts are opinions in case you are too stupid to figure that out on your own without me saying it over and over.

cyberdude557

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#25 : February 24, 2010, 06:23:38 PM

GAITHERSBURG, Maryland — The National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST) has released its long-awaited report on the collapse of World Trade 7 following the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001. "Our take-home message today is that the reason for the collapse of World Trade Center 7 is no longer a mystery," NIST lead investigator Shyam Sunder told journalists at this morning's press conference in Gaithersburg, Md. "WTC 7 collapsed because of fires fueled by office furnishings. It did not collapse from explosives or from diesel fuel fires."

Conspiracy theorists have long pointed to the collapse of the 47-story structure as key evidence that the U.S. government orchestrated or abetted the 9/11 attacks. No planes struck the building, and the commonly available views of the exterior didn't show significant damage. Yet, at 5:20 pm, 7 hours after the collapse of the Twin Towers (WTC 1 and 2), WTC 7 rapidly fell in on itself. Since WTC 7 housed Secret Service and CIA offices, conspiracy theorists claimed that the building was destroyed in a controlled demolition in order to obliterate evidence of the U.S. government's complicity in the terrorist attacks. "It is impossible for a building to fall the way it fell without explosives being involved," stated actress and TV personality Rosie O'Donnell of ABC's The View in March 2007. "For the first time in history, steel was melted by fire. It is physically impossible," she said.

Today's report confirms that a fire was, indeed, the cause. "This is the first time that we are aware of, that a building taller than about 15 stories has collapsed primarily due to fires," Sunder told reporters at the press conference. "What we found was that uncontrolled building fires—similar to fires experienced in other tall buildings—caused an extraordinary event, the collapse of WTC7." The unprecedented nature of the event means that understanding the precise mechanism of the collapse is important not just to answer conspiracy theorists' questions, but to improve safety standards in the engineering of large buildings.

The final report describes how debris from the collapse of WTC 1 ignited fires on at least 10 floors of WTC 7 at the western half of the south face. Fires on Floors 7 through 9 and 11 through 13 burned out of control, because the water supply to the automatic sprinkler system had failed. The primary and backup water supply to the sprinkler systems for the lower floors relied on the city's water supply. Those water lines were damaged by the collapse of WTC 1 and 2. These uncontrolled fires in WTC 7 eventually spread to the northeast part of the building, where the collapse began.

After 7 hours of uncontrolled fires, a steel girder on Floor 13 lost its connection to one of the 81 columns supporting the building. Floor 13 collapsed, beginning a cascade of floor failures to Floor 5. Column 79, no longer supported by a girder, buckled, triggering a rapid succession of structural failures that moved from east to west. All 23 central columns, followed by the exterior columns, failed in what's known as a "progressive collapse"—that is, local damage that spreads from one structural element to another, eventually resulting in the collapse of the entire structure.


The report clarifies a number of widely debated issues concerning the collapse, particularly the role of the building's many diesel fuel tanks and the importance of structural damage from falling WTC 1 debris. Both of those factors have been cited by investigators as possibly contributing to the collapse; the 2006 Popular Mechanics book Debunking 9/11 Myths: Why Conspiracy Theories Can't Stand Up to the Facts mentions both hypotheses. However, the final NIST report downplays both scenarios, concluding that the diesel fuel stored in tanks (and intended to power backup generators) did not burn long enough or hot enough to account for structural failures. And, while debris damage to WTC 7's southern exterior was considerable (and initiated the destructive fires), the collapse originated in the northeast portion of the building. In fact, the report concludes: "Even without the structural damage, WTC 7 would have collapsed from fires."

The report determines that the actual culprit in the collapse was the combustion of ordinary building furnishings: "These uncontrolled fires had characteristics similar to those that have occurred previously in tall buildings." If the sprinkler system in WTC 7 had been working, it is likely that "the fires in WTC 7 would have been controlled and the collapse prevented." The report also suggests that current engineering standards for coping with fire-induced thermal expansion need to be re-examined, particularly for buildings like WTC 7 that have long, unsupported floor spans. A key factor in the collapse, NIST concluded, was the failure of structural "connections that were designed to resist gravity loads, but not thermally induced lateral loads." According to Sunder: "For the first time we have shown that fire can induce a progressive collapse."

Spurred by conspiracy theorists' questions, investigators did look specifically at the possibility that explosives were involved. "Hypothetical blast events did not play a role in the collapse of WTC 7," the report states, adding that investigators "found no evidence whose explanation required invocation of a blast event." Moreover, the smallest charge capable of initiating column failure "would have resulted in a sound level of 130 dB [decibels] to 140 dB at a distance of at least half a mile." Witnesses did not report hearing such a loud noise, nor is one audible on recordings of the collapse.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/research/4278874.html

DynaMike Glennon

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#26 : February 24, 2010, 06:10:44 PM

Does this help any?
I sware it will take George W to come out and say 9/11 was a false flag attack for people to believe it, even than I don't think people will still believe it. Wake up!

spartan

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#27 : February 24, 2010, 05:54:42 PM


Didn't realize there were fires raging inside there, too ... It just looks like the perfect rigged implosion of a building.

This help any?

BucsBullsBolts

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#28 : February 24, 2010, 05:24:12 PM



What the hell was the "official" explanation for WTC 7 collapsing??

This gaping big hole in the lower 23 floors.



Oh that and the 6 hours fires had been raging.

Didn't realize there were fires raging inside there, too ... It just looks like the perfect rigged implosion of a building.

spartan

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#29 : February 24, 2010, 05:07:57 PM



What the hell was the "official" explanation for WTC 7 collapsing??

This gaping big hole in the lower 23 floors.



Oh that and the 6 hours fires had been raging.
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