Measuring Explosiveness: Suh vs McCoy

[JM2]

I would love to hear a detailed explanation from Mayock as to why he ranks McCoy higher. I've heard the gloss over "he is a better pash rusher then Suh" comment, but would like him to add some real detail there.

From what I saw on film, McCoy shoots a lot of gaps and then misses the tackle. Does he simply lack instincts? - If so, that's not good. I would like to see Mayock take both highlights and lowlights, on film, of both payers and spell it out. As of now, I'm with the majority of the posters here in that I don't see how McCoy could possibly be ranked higher then Suh, but come on, Mayock is the man. He should be able to make a convincing argument if he truly believes McCoy is better.

[Doug09]

Suh shows in college he can get to the QB but he does it by a bull rush, some experts believe he wont be able to bully the OG's in the NFL like he did in college, McCoy relied more on his first step and pass rushing moves and with some more coaching will be a beast.

I'm thinking it will be a lot easier to teach McCoy's pass rushing moves to Suh than it will be to teach Suh's strength to McCoy.

Just like it was for Gaines?

[Booker Reese]

I've stated this on the Insider board, but I figured that I'd throw it over here as well...

I've never really watched Suh or McCoy, or really any other DT play... I just don't find focusing in on college defense to be all that entertaining.  That being said, there's just too much statistical data out there that really scares me about taking McCoy if Suh is gone.  Comparing McCoy's last 2 years against Odrick, Price, Alualu, and Houston... I'm not impressed AT ALL.  I don't even know what really separates him from these other guys.  Alualu seems to be the best tackler in the bunch.  I think I'd rather the Bucs trade out of #3 as long as Suh is not there, reguardless if McCoy is there or not.

No offense, but if you haven't watched and are just comparing numbers, then of course you don't see what separates McCoy from the others (not including Suh here obviously). Seriously, Houston? Not in the ball-park.

[leeroybuc93]

Obviously Suh's statistics blow McCoy's out of the water.  I imagine all those who have McCoy ranked higher simply believe his game will translate better to the NFL.  The same way scouts don't think Tebow will be able to bowl over people, they don't think Suh will be able to throw them aside.  He plays similarly to Albert Haynesworth but he doesn't have the same size.  They probably question what he will be if his strength is neutralized.

[TBayXXXVII]

I've stated this on the Insider board, but I figured that I'd throw it over here as well...

I've never really watched Suh or McCoy, or really any other DT play... I just don't find focusing in on college defense to be all that entertaining. That being said, there's just too much statistical data out there that really scares me about taking McCoy if Suh is gone. Comparing McCoy's last 2 years against Odrick, Price, Alualu, and Houston... I'm not impressed AT ALL. I don't even know what really separates him from these other guys. Alualu seems to be the best tackler in the bunch. I think I'd rather the Bucs trade out of #3 as long as Suh is not there, reguardless if McCoy is there or not.

No offense, but if you haven't watched and are just comparing numbers, then of course you don't see what separates McCoy from the others (not including Suh here obviously). Seriously, Houston? Not in the ball-park.

No one has ever given me any info as to what it is/was about McCoy that makes him a better prospect than the others.  Still waiting...

[Larry Brackins]

I've heard people say McCoy gets off the ball faster than any lineman they've seen in a long time.  

[Larry Brackins]

I've stated this on the Insider board, but I figured that I'd throw it over here as well...

I've never really watched Suh or McCoy, or really any other DT play... I just don't find focusing in on college defense to be all that entertaining. That being said, there's just too much statistical data out there that really scares me about taking McCoy if Suh is gone. Comparing McCoy's last 2 years against Odrick, Price, Alualu, and Houston... I'm not impressed AT ALL. I don't even know what really separates him from these other guys. Alualu seems to be the best tackler in the bunch. I think I'd rather the Bucs trade out of #3 as long as Suh is not there, reguardless if McCoy is there or not.

No offense, but if you haven't watched and are just comparing numbers, then of course you don't see what separates McCoy from the others (not including Suh here obviously). Seriously, Houston? Not in the ball-park.

No one has ever given me any info as to what it is/was about McCoy that makes him a better prospect than the others. Still waiting...

Explosive first step. Dude is gonna make a living in the other teams backfield.

[Doug09]

I've stated this on the Insider board, but I figured that I'd throw it over here as well...

I've never really watched Suh or McCoy, or really any other DT play... I just don't find focusing in on college defense to be all that entertaining. That being said, there's just too much statistical data out there that really scares me about taking McCoy if Suh is gone. Comparing McCoy's last 2 years against Odrick, Price, Alualu, and Houston... I'm not impressed AT ALL. I don't even know what really separates him from these other guys. Alualu seems to be the best tackler in the bunch. I think I'd rather the Bucs trade out of #3 as long as Suh is not there, reguardless if McCoy is there or not.

No offense, but if you haven't watched and are just comparing numbers, then of course you don't see what separates McCoy from the others (not including Suh here obviously). Seriously, Houston? Not in the ball-park.

No one has ever given me any info as to what it is/was about McCoy that makes him a better prospect than the others.  Still waiting...

Explosive off the snap, penetrates well, a rolodex of pass rushing moves, great motor and intangibles, and great vision. Just to name a few. Find me a DT prospect with all of those characteristics.

[Larry Brackins]

I've stated this on the Insider board, but I figured that I'd throw it over here as well...

I've never really watched Suh or McCoy, or really any other DT play... I just don't find focusing in on college defense to be all that entertaining. That being said, there's just too much statistical data out there that really scares me about taking McCoy if Suh is gone. Comparing McCoy's last 2 years against Odrick, Price, Alualu, and Houston... I'm not impressed AT ALL. I don't even know what really separates him from these other guys. Alualu seems to be the best tackler in the bunch. I think I'd rather the Bucs trade out of #3 as long as Suh is not there, reguardless if McCoy is there or not.

No offense, but if you haven't watched and are just comparing numbers, then of course you don't see what separates McCoy from the others (not including Suh here obviously). Seriously, Houston? Not in the ball-park.

No one has ever given me any info as to what it is/was about McCoy that makes him a better prospect than the others.  Still waiting...

Explosive off the snap, penetrates well, a rolodex of pass rushing moves, great motor and intangibles, and great vision. Just to name a few. Find me a DT prospect with all of those characteristics.

Mmmhmm.

[leeroybuc93]

People always talk about receivers who have "football speed."  McCoy is kind of the same thing to me.  Suh is bigger and meaner but McCoy clearly gets off the ball faster.  He is more explosive on film despite what Suh's numbers at the combine say.  

[TBayXXXVII]

I've stated this on the Insider board, but I figured that I'd throw it over here as well...

I've never really watched Suh or McCoy, or really any other DT play... I just don't find focusing in on college defense to be all that entertaining. That being said, there's just too much statistical data out there that really scares me about taking McCoy if Suh is gone. Comparing McCoy's last 2 years against Odrick, Price, Alualu, and Houston... I'm not impressed AT ALL. I don't even know what really separates him from these other guys. Alualu seems to be the best tackler in the bunch. I think I'd rather the Bucs trade out of #3 as long as Suh is not there, reguardless if McCoy is there or not.

No offense, but if you haven't watched and are just comparing numbers, then of course you don't see what separates McCoy from the others (not including Suh here obviously). Seriously, Houston? Not in the ball-park.

No one has ever given me any info as to what it is/was about McCoy that makes him a better prospect than the others.  Still waiting...

Explosive off the snap, penetrates well, a rolodex of pass rushing moves, great motor and intangibles, and great vision. Just to name a few. Find me a DT prospect with all of those characteristics.

Most, not all, of those things that you mentioned, I've heard being referenced to Alualu and Odrick as well.

[Doug09]

I've stated this on the Insider board, but I figured that I'd throw it over here as well...

I've never really watched Suh or McCoy, or really any other DT play... I just don't find focusing in on college defense to be all that entertaining. That being said, there's just too much statistical data out there that really scares me about taking McCoy if Suh is gone. Comparing McCoy's last 2 years against Odrick, Price, Alualu, and Houston... I'm not impressed AT ALL. I don't even know what really separates him from these other guys. Alualu seems to be the best tackler in the bunch. I think I'd rather the Bucs trade out of #3 as long as Suh is not there, reguardless if McCoy is there or not.

No offense, but if you haven't watched and are just comparing numbers, then of course you don't see what separates McCoy from the others (not including Suh here obviously). Seriously, Houston? Not in the ball-park.

No one has ever given me any info as to what it is/was about McCoy that makes him a better prospect than the others.  Still waiting...

Explosive off the snap, penetrates well, a rolodex of pass rushing moves, great motor and intangibles, and great vision. Just to name a few. Find me a DT prospect with all of those characteristics.

Most, not all, of those things that you mentioned, I've heard being referenced to Alualu and Odrick as well.

Does either possess all the skills that McCoy has? They may have one or two, but McCoy is more complete, sorry.

[TBayXXXVII]

I've stated this on the Insider board, but I figured that I'd throw it over here as well...

I've never really watched Suh or McCoy, or really any other DT play... I just don't find focusing in on college defense to be all that entertaining. That being said, there's just too much statistical data out there that really scares me about taking McCoy if Suh is gone. Comparing McCoy's last 2 years against Odrick, Price, Alualu, and Houston... I'm not impressed AT ALL. I don't even know what really separates him from these other guys. Alualu seems to be the best tackler in the bunch. I think I'd rather the Bucs trade out of #3 as long as Suh is not there, reguardless if McCoy is there or not.

No offense, but if you haven't watched and are just comparing numbers, then of course you don't see what separates McCoy from the others (not including Suh here obviously). Seriously, Houston? Not in the ball-park.

No one has ever given me any info as to what it is/was about McCoy that makes him a better prospect than the others.� Still waiting...

Explosive off the snap, penetrates well, a rolodex of pass rushing moves, great motor and intangibles, and great vision. Just to name a few. Find me a DT prospect with all of those characteristics.

Most, not all, of those things that you mentioned, I've heard being referenced to Alualu and Odrick as well.

Does either possess all the skills that McCoy has? They may have one or two, but McCoy is more complete, sorry.

I don't know... I'm only asking the question.  It just seems to me that there are a lot of things pointing in the direction of McCoy that imply he'll be a bust.

[Doug09]

I've stated this on the Insider board, but I figured that I'd throw it over here as well...

I've never really watched Suh or McCoy, or really any other DT play... I just don't find focusing in on college defense to be all that entertaining. That being said, there's just too much statistical data out there that really scares me about taking McCoy if Suh is gone. Comparing McCoy's last 2 years against Odrick, Price, Alualu, and Houston... I'm not impressed AT ALL. I don't even know what really separates him from these other guys. Alualu seems to be the best tackler in the bunch. I think I'd rather the Bucs trade out of #3 as long as Suh is not there, reguardless if McCoy is there or not.

No offense, but if you haven't watched and are just comparing numbers, then of course you don't see what separates McCoy from the others (not including Suh here obviously). Seriously, Houston? Not in the ball-park.

No one has ever given me any info as to what it is/was about McCoy that makes him a better prospect than the others.� Still waiting...

Explosive off the snap, penetrates well, a rolodex of pass rushing moves, great motor and intangibles, and great vision. Just to name a few. Find me a DT prospect with all of those characteristics.

Most, not all, of those things that you mentioned, I've heard being referenced to Alualu and Odrick as well.

Does either possess all the skills that McCoy has? They may have one or two, but McCoy is more complete, sorry.

I don't know... I'm only asking the question.� It just seems to me that there are a lot of things pointing in the direction of McCoy that imply he'll be a bust.

Care to share what these things are that point in the direction of him being a bust?

[TBayXXXVII]

I heard things like...

1. He isn't strong enough to power through OLines in the NFL like he did in college.
2. Not a good pass rusher (though good at stopping the run).
3. If his quick 1st step is ineffective... he will be ineffective.