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Thomas

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: March 26, 2010, 05:17:01 AM

I'll buy that explanation. It was sold very well. So... I guess getting rid of Gruden was part of their plan for emulating (Patriots?) winners in this league.

PWNASAURUS

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#1 : March 25, 2010, 09:10:28 AM

This will not fit with the Grudenista agenda I don't believe but who knows.


The first paragraph of your first post in this thread proves you don't have a clue what you're talking about. Our drafting has been poor since Dungy took over, I see you conveniently "forgot" to mention that. Nah, to you it's all Gruden.


It's funny how our greedy owners can make excuse after excuse over why they don't spend money and fools like you eat it up. Wonder what their excuse is about not spending money on ManU. It's all about their greed, nothing more..anyone who believes otherwise is a damn fool.

Bad Dungy drafts + losing 6 High draft picks on Keyshawn/Gruden + bad Gruden drafts = the mess we're in right now

Question: Does making MAJOR CUTBACKS at OneBucPlace support "this new propaganda bit/building a championship team"...or does it reinforce the view that "some people are just looking at bottom line PROFITS"? �And why did the PublicRelations guy quit???






I can agree with that, although you have to also add into your equation the Glazer's not spending money. There are zero teams in the NFL today who could consistently win games without FA, not a single one.
COLTS win 12 games every year, Pitt does pretty well too.

Question:
What do both of those teams have that the Bucs don't????

                 Answer: good owners
LMAO. The Glazers have been some of the best owners in the NFL since they bought the Bucs. 100x better than Culverhouse. Again What do owners have to do with the Drafting of the team???

Question to Joel Glazer by Sp Times, "Why announce you're not going to be active in free agency?"

Answer: Yes, we could go out and sign a couple of 29- and 30-year-old free agents. But I don't know what that does for us long term. That could get us back in that mediocrity of 7-9, 8-8, 9-7 and that cycle we're really not interested in. That's not going to win us a championship. It may feel a little better. I'll go through a lot less criticism, no question about that. But that's fool's gold. We're not in the business of fool's gold. We're in the business of winning championships.

You heard it from the Horse's mouth. The Boss. If you want to continue to believe otherwise that's on you. I choose to be a realist and look beneath the surface. Yes the Bucs have been one of the lowest spending teams but why?

Question to Owner: How did we get there?
Answer from owner: I start with going back further and looking at drafting. We believe that drafting is the lifeblood of sustained success long term. We have not done as good of a job as we need to do drafting over the last several years. That's the first seed that gets planted or the cancer that starts early on that you don't fully see until time goes forward.

Question to owner: It is reported if there was a salary cap, the Bucs' player cost would be $79 million. That's $30 million below the 2009 salary floor. Why not invest that $30 million in the team?

Answer from owner: The big money for all teams is spent by re-signing your own guys. The draft picks generally come cheaper. Then you re-sign them. And those are the big contracts. Again … you go back five years and look at the drafts we had, and the lack of some draft picks a little further back. Those are all guys — four, five, six, seven, eight people — whose contracts would have been coming up in the last two or three years, who all would've gotten nice, big contracts. Contracts I would be happy to be sitting here writing because that would mean we drafted well, we had good players and we're re-signing them to long-term deals. So we have this void the last three or four years. It doesn't take very long to spend $30 or $40 million in the National Football League.

Pretty much exactly what Me, FRG, and others have been trying to explain to you knuckle heads but still "No we're cheap. We have Bad owners."

Do me a favor and blame the people responsible, The people who ran our "Football Operations" the last several years and drafted these crappy players that put us where we are.


PWNASAURUS

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#2 : March 25, 2010, 09:17:33 AM

3-13
Thanks for those great draft picks Gruden. Clayton, Cadillac, and Gaines gonna lead us to the superbowl. Here we come.


PWNASAURUS

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#3 : March 25, 2010, 09:16:26 AM

The Glazers could not just come out and say everyone sucks and we got bad players and Gruden/Allen couldn't draft worth a lick. They fired who they needed to fire, cut who they needed to cut, and made a plan to rebuild. They took the high road last season and didn't throw anyone under the bus but now all the out-crying and whining has forced them to come out and answer these questions and throw Gruden/Allen under the Bucs for their Personel decisions and basically say that they have a bunch of scrubs on the team who don't deserve big money, that is true, and maybe rub some guys the wrong way.


LoganBucs37

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#4 : March 25, 2010, 09:37:26 AM

3-13
Thanks for those great draft picks Gruden. Clayton, Cadillac, and Gaines gonna lead us to the superbowl. Here we come.

3-13. Get used to the losing.

Gas $4 a gallon, Thank you all who voted for the Socialist.

LoganBucs37

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#5 : March 25, 2010, 09:12:38 AM

3-13

Gas $4 a gallon, Thank you all who voted for the Socialist.

PWNASAURUS

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#6 : March 24, 2010, 02:40:45 PM

Fuess what? It's exactly what some of us have been telling you guys for months but didn't want to listen. Player Payroll comes from Drafting Good players, developing them, and then signing them for the longterm. Bucs lack of Drafting in the Jon Gruden era was horrible with almost no players worthy of a re-up and a bunch of washed up street FA equals low spending. If you want to continue to not blame Gruden's drafting than that is your problem and you will endlessly look for an answer you will never find.

http://blogs.tampabay.com/bucs/2010/03/bucs-vp-joel-glazer-says-financial-commitment-in-bucs-has-not-been-less-since-purchase-of-manchester.html

...Glazer said a history of poor NFL drafts, which coincidentally paralleled with the purchase of the soccer club, is partly responsible for the low Bucs payrolls. Simply put, the biggest expense for a team is re-signing players to long-term extensions and the drafts -- beginning when the team traded four picks for coach Jon Gruden -- have failed to produce star players.

"I always like to take a couple steps back and give the totality, the total picture, the total plan,'' Glazer said. "I always find that when it gets explained to people, they say, "Okay, I understand that. That makes sense. Now I get it.

"The big money for all teams is spent by re-signing your own guys. You draft somebody, the draft picks generally come cheaper, then you re-sign them and those are the big contracts. Again, you have to go back five years. You go back five years and look at the drafts we had, and the lack of some draft picks a little further back. Those are all guys -- four, five, six, seven, eight people -- whose contracts would have been coming up in the last two or three years -- who all would've gotten nice, big contracts. Contracts I would be happy to be sitting here writing because that would mean we drafted well, we had good players and we're re-signing them to long-term deals. So we have this void the last three or four years. We haven't had those.

"It doesn't take very long to spend $30- or $40-million in the National Football League. That's re-signing guys. It didn't exist on the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. There's no draft picks we wanted to keep.

"Number two, go back to the beginning of last year. There was a reason we made some changes. We made some changes because we recognized we had aging core group of individuals that was not sustainable. We were headed off a cliff here. That cliff did come, but we said we'd better be proactive to this than reactive in dealing with this. When I say proactive, it meant a plan. Number one, we have to start bringing in some young talent on this team. It's time for some of the older people to move on so some of the younger people get an opportunity to come in, grow, develop and become part of the team. And that has been the plan, that we've got to start building the base with young talent.

"If you look at the teams that have had sustained success, it's the teams that have done it and got it right.

"With that being the plan, letting older veterans go, a void of draft picks from previous years, making a conscious decision to go that route, the way the NFL has been is there are some years your spending is up and a series of years your spending is down. Then hopefully, you go back up. We are in that period right now.

"There are unique opportunities when they do come up, we'll take advantage of them. Kellen Winslow is an example. That's a guy who fit the profile. Younger, talented. You make a trade for a second-round pick. I think that would've cost us a million dollars last year and we turn it into a guy we're paying $7-million to.''

Glazer said the team made a conscious decision not to be big players in free agency, which consisted of mostly older players.

"Yes, we could go out and sign a couple of 29- and 30-year-old free agents. But I don't know what that does for us long-term,'' Glazer said. "That could get us back in that mediocrity of 7-9, 8-8, 9-7 and that cycle we're really not inteested in. That's not going to win us a championship. It may feel a little better. I'll go through a lot less criticism, no question about that. But that's fool's gold. We're not in the business of fool's gold. We're in the business of winning championships.''


alldaway

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#7 : March 24, 2010, 02:44:00 PM

Quote
"There are unique opportunities when they do come up, we'll take advantage of them. Kellen Winslow is an example. That's a guy who fit the profile. Younger, talented. You make a trade for a second-round pick. I think that would've cost us a million dollars last year and we turn it into a guy we're paying $7-million to.''

K2 is a proven player unlike a 2nd round pick, but his point stands.

PWNASAURUS

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#8 : March 24, 2010, 02:46:07 PM

This will not fit with the Grudenista agenda I don't believe but who knows.


Pick6

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#9 : March 24, 2010, 02:59:48 PM

more or less what i've felt was going on.  a cheap team is one that lets its homegrown players leave instead of paying them when they become good.  a team that drafts poorly has nobody worth retaining, and for all the excitement leading up to free agency, the best players almost always end up getting re-signed by their teams and never hit the market.

i think our list of players on the roster worth signing to new contracts as long term starters goes thusly:
tanard jackson
aqib talib
davin joseph

borderline:
ruud (depending on how he does with DTs in front of him or after a position change)
arron sears (if he comes near being his old self)
geno hayes (need more of a track record)


that's not alot of new deals in the next 3 years, hopefully we have more difficult decisions to make in the seasons that follow due to some good drafts
i will be upset if the glazers don't jump into the fray next year when a bunch of talented 6th year guys should be breaking free

PWNASAURUS

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#10 : March 24, 2010, 03:15:23 PM

Fuess what? It's exactly what some of us have been telling you guys for months but didn't want to listen. Player Payroll comes from Drafting Good players, developing them, and then signing them for the longterm. Bucs lack of Drafting in the Jon Gruden era was horrible with almost no players worthy of a re-up and a bunch of washed up street FA equals low spending. If you want to continue to not blame Gruden's drafting than that is your problem and you will endlessly look for an answer you will never find.

http://blogs.tampabay.com/bucs/2010/03/bucs-vp-joel-glazer-says-financial-commitment-in-bucs-has-not-been-less-since-purchase-of-manchester.html

...Glazer said a history of poor NFL drafts, which coincidentally paralleled with the purchase of the soccer club, is partly responsible for the low Bucs payrolls. Simply put, the biggest expense for a team is re-signing players to long-term extensions and the drafts -- beginning when the team traded four picks for coach Jon Gruden -- have failed to produce star players.

"I always like to take a couple steps back and give the totality, the total picture, the total plan,'' Glazer said. "I always find that when it gets explained to people, they say, "Okay, I understand that. That makes sense. Now I get it.

"The big money for all teams is spent by re-signing your own guys. You draft somebody, the draft picks generally come cheaper, then you re-sign them and those are the big contracts. Again, you have to go back five years. You go back five years and look at the drafts we had, and the lack of some draft picks a little further back. Those are all guys -- four, five, six, seven, eight people -- whose contracts would have been coming up in the last two or three years -- who all would've gotten nice, big contracts. Contracts I would be happy to be sitting here writing because that would mean we drafted well, we had good players and we're re-signing them to long-term deals. So we have this void the last three or four years. We haven't had those.

"It doesn't take very long to spend $30- or $40-million in the National Football League. That's re-signing guys. It didn't exist on the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. There's no draft picks we wanted to keep.

"Number two, go back to the beginning of last year. There was a reason we made some changes. We made some changes because we recognized we had aging core group of individuals that was not sustainable. We were headed off a cliff here. That cliff did come, but we said we'd better be proactive to this than reactive in dealing with this. When I say proactive, it meant a plan. Number one, we have to start bringing in some young talent on this team. It's time for some of the older people to move on so some of the younger people get an opportunity to come in, grow, develop and become part of the team. And that has been the plan, that we've got to start building the base with young talent.

"If you look at the teams that have had sustained success, it's the teams that have done it and got it right.

"With that being the plan, letting older veterans go, a void of draft picks from previous years, making a conscious decision to go that route, the way the NFL has been is there are some years your spending is up and a series of years your spending is down. Then hopefully, you go back up. We are in that period right now.

"There are unique opportunities when they do come up, we'll take advantage of them. Kellen Winslow is an example. That's a guy who fit the profile. Younger, talented. You make a trade for a second-round pick. I think that would've cost us a million dollars last year and we turn it into a guy we're paying $7-million to.''

Glazer said the team made a conscious decision not to be big players in free agency, which consisted of mostly older players.

"Yes, we could go out and sign a couple of 29- and 30-year-old free agents. But I don't know what that does for us long-term,'' Glazer said. "That could get us back in that mediocrity of 7-9, 8-8, 9-7 and that cycle we're really not inteested in. That's not going to win us a championship. It may feel a little better. I'll go through a lot less criticism, no question about that. But that's fool's gold. We're not in the business of fool's gold. We're in the business of winning championships.''


Oh so those "washed up street FA" that helped win that Super Bowl mean nothing huh?? And Rah Rah had a great draft?? We shall see..........
How many of those 2002 FA's were true star players and could be considered a young core of the team???? I'll say zero. Would the 2002 FA's added to this current group of Bucs make us a Superbowl champion or even a contendor???? NO NO. Why didn't Gruden's FA in other years not even get us a playoff win???

The 2002 team had a core of Veteran players who were drafted in the same time span and grew together. Then FA were added beginning with BJ in 2000.


jaybuc88

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#11 : March 24, 2010, 03:07:37 PM

Fuess what? It's exactly what some of us have been telling you guys for months but didn't want to listen. Player Payroll comes from Drafting Good players, developing them, and then signing them for the longterm. Bucs lack of Drafting in the Jon Gruden era was horrible with almost no players worthy of a re-up and a bunch of washed up street FA equals low spending. If you want to continue to not blame Gruden's drafting than that is your problem and you will endlessly look for an answer you will never find.

http://blogs.tampabay.com/bucs/2010/03/bucs-vp-joel-glazer-says-financial-commitment-in-bucs-has-not-been-less-since-purchase-of-manchester.html

...Glazer said a history of poor NFL drafts, which coincidentally paralleled with the purchase of the soccer club, is partly responsible for the low Bucs payrolls. Simply put, the biggest expense for a team is re-signing players to long-term extensions and the drafts -- beginning when the team traded four picks for coach Jon Gruden -- have failed to produce star players.

"I always like to take a couple steps back and give the totality, the total picture, the total plan,'' Glazer said. "I always find that when it gets explained to people, they say, "Okay, I understand that. That makes sense. Now I get it.

"The big money for all teams is spent by re-signing your own guys. You draft somebody, the draft picks generally come cheaper, then you re-sign them and those are the big contracts. Again, you have to go back five years. You go back five years and look at the drafts we had, and the lack of some draft picks a little further back. Those are all guys -- four, five, six, seven, eight people -- whose contracts would have been coming up in the last two or three years -- who all would've gotten nice, big contracts. Contracts I would be happy to be sitting here writing because that would mean we drafted well, we had good players and we're re-signing them to long-term deals. So we have this void the last three or four years. We haven't had those.

"It doesn't take very long to spend $30- or $40-million in the National Football League. That's re-signing guys. It didn't exist on the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. There's no draft picks we wanted to keep.

"Number two, go back to the beginning of last year. There was a reason we made some changes. We made some changes because we recognized we had aging core group of individuals that was not sustainable. We were headed off a cliff here. That cliff did come, but we said we'd better be proactive to this than reactive in dealing with this. When I say proactive, it meant a plan. Number one, we have to start bringing in some young talent on this team. It's time for some of the older people to move on so some of the younger people get an opportunity to come in, grow, develop and become part of the team. And that has been the plan, that we've got to start building the base with young talent.

"If you look at the teams that have had sustained success, it's the teams that have done it and got it right.

"With that being the plan, letting older veterans go, a void of draft picks from previous years, making a conscious decision to go that route, the way the NFL has been is there are some years your spending is up and a series of years your spending is down. Then hopefully, you go back up. We are in that period right now.

"There are unique opportunities when they do come up, we'll take advantage of them. Kellen Winslow is an example. That's a guy who fit the profile. Younger, talented. You make a trade for a second-round pick. I think that would've cost us a million dollars last year and we turn it into a guy we're paying $7-million to.''

Glazer said the team made a conscious decision not to be big players in free agency, which consisted of mostly older players.

"Yes, we could go out and sign a couple of 29- and 30-year-old free agents. But I don't know what that does for us long-term,'' Glazer said. "That could get us back in that mediocrity of 7-9, 8-8, 9-7 and that cycle we're really not inteested in. That's not going to win us a championship. It may feel a little better. I'll go through a lot less criticism, no question about that. But that's fool's gold. We're not in the business of fool's gold. We're in the business of winning championships.''


Oh so those "washed up street FA" that helped win that Super Bowl mean nothing huh?? And Rah Rah had a great draft?? We shall see..........

escobar

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#12 : March 24, 2010, 03:07:58 PM

This will not fit with the Grudenista agenda I don't believe but who knows.


The first paragraph of your first post in this thread proves you don't have a clue what you're talking about. Our drafting has been poor since Dungy took over, I see you conveniently "forgot" to mention that. Nah, to you it's all Gruden.


It's funny how our greedy owners can make excuse after excuse over why they don't spend money and fools like you eat it up. Wonder what their excuse is about not spending money on ManU. It's all about their greed, nothing more..anyone who believes otherwise is a damn fool.

ktownbuc47

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#13 : March 24, 2010, 03:18:16 PM

The Glazer boys thank you for drinking.


Why do you necessarily have to be wrong just because a few million people think you are?

Pick6

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#14 : March 24, 2010, 03:18:57 PM

Oh so those "washed up street FA" that helped win that Super Bowl mean nothing huh?? And Rah Rah had a great draft?? We shall see..........

those guys were brought in after we had drafted a core of players who could compete for a championship.  the bigtime signings of keyshawn, brad johnson, and simeon were all a response to being a TD away from the superbowl in '99 with a core of players very much in their prime.  if you added keyshawn and simeon rice at their peak to this roster, you'd still have a 3rd or 4th place team in this division
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