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jbear

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#15 : June 16, 2010, 01:21:55 PM

And understand this, no matter how many different ways the Bucs try to call him fat when the subject of his play comes up, Donald Penn is a premier left tackle in the NFL.

I stopped reading here, and why I really don't put a lot of stock into White's stuff. Joe Thomas, Jake Long, Jared Gaither, Michael Oher, Ryan Clady, Jason Peters, etc. are "premier left tackles" in the NFL. Donald Penn isn't.

Thats funny since Jason Peters essentially is an older version of Donald Penn.  Not saying Penn is quite that good but, he's a very good LT and worked his way up from being undrafted just like Peters did.  Peters even left the Bills in a similar contract dispute to how this is shaping up.  Its uncanny really, the Bucs are begining to look like the Petersless Bills of 08 - 09'.  Not sure if thats where I'd like to be if I'm the Bucs.




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#16 : June 16, 2010, 01:24:58 PM

And understand this, no matter how many different ways the Bucs try to call him fat when the subject of his play comes up, Donald Penn is a premier left tackle in the NFL.

I stopped reading here, and why I really don't put a lot of stock into White's stuff. Joe Thomas, Jake Long, Jared Gaither, Michael Oher, Ryan Clady, Jason Peters, etc. are "premier left tackles" in the NFL. Donald Penn isn't.

Thats funny since Jason Peters essentially is an older version of Donald Penn.  Not saying Penn is quite that good but, he's a very good LT and worked his way up from being undrafted just like Peters did.  Peters even left the Bills in a similar contract dispute to how this is shaping up.  Its uncanny really, the Bucs are begining to look like the Petersless Bills of 08 - 09'.  Not sure if thats where I'd like to be if I'm the Bucs.





PETERLESS BILLS!!!! HAHAHA!



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#17 : June 16, 2010, 01:29:58 PM

Dont forget that supposably this FA will be flooded with talent and Penn might be the 3rd or 4th option for teams looking for a LT.
I don't think the market will be nearly as lucrative for Penn as some seem to think. Almost all teams have an established left tackle or a young prospect they're not ready to give up on. There will likely be 3-4 left tackle candidates in the draft in 2011 and it's possible Marcus McNeill, Jammal Brown, and others will be free agents. And no one is going to sign Penn to play right tackle because he's such a lousy run blocker, so I don't see him having too many options.

FRG is the most logical poster on this board.  You guys just don\'t like where the logical conclusions take you.

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#18 : June 16, 2010, 01:33:27 PM

Even if he isn't a premier guy in your eyes. Heck in anyone's eyes, what do we have behind him right now?


That's a horrible reason to sign someone to a long-term deal.  It's a great reason, however, for a one-year deal, which is exactly what he has been offered.


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#19 : June 16, 2010, 01:34:27 PM

Shawn King just pointed out that D Joseph, Trueblood, and Penn will be unrestricted fa's next year. -Great. I can just imagine us scrapping together the money to underpay 1 of the three at best.. ugh





None of those guys are worth big deals


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#20 : June 16, 2010, 01:36:15 PM

Dont forget that supposably this FA will be flooded with talent and Penn might be the 3rd or 4th option for teams looking for a LT.
I don't think the market will be nearly as lucrative for Penn as some seem to think. Almost all teams have an established left tackle or a young prospect they're not ready to give up on. There will likely be 3-4 left tackle candidates in the draft in 2011 and it's possible Marcus McNeill, Jammal Brown, and others will be free agents. And no one is going to sign Penn to play right tackle because he's such a lousy run blocker, so I don't see him having too many options.

Free Agency will be what it always is.  Most of that flood will return to their teams.  Penn won't.  Not the way he's being treated now.  Left Tackles that can play at the level Penn does just don't hit FA...  I'm sure a Jerry Jones type owner will remember Ware getting shut down for two games...

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#21 : June 16, 2010, 01:36:34 PM

what has he done for the Bucs lately?

Nothing to warrant a long-term contract.


And what will happen if he's not there for all but 6 games?  

Who knows, but he won't make himself any money by doing that.



Thats funny since Jason Peters essentially is an older version of Donald Penn.

Now, that is funny.  Jason Peters is an All-Pro and 3-time Pro Bowler.  Donald Penn, well, isn't.



I don't think the market will be nearly as lucrative for Penn as some seem to think.

It won't be.


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#22 : June 16, 2010, 01:55:02 PM

Even if he isn't a premier guy in your eyes. Heck in anyone's eyes, what do we have behind him right now?

Without knowing what Penn is looking for it is difficult to come to a conclusion. If Penn is looking for $10 mil a year over 5 years is it worth paying him that figure just because there isn’t anyone behind him? That’s a bad reason to overpay a guy. Maybe he’s looking for a more reasonable deal. We don’t know.

The biggest problem likely is that the Bucs have been hesitant or cannot pay bonus (guaranteed) money. Penn’s seasonal average cannot go up more than 30% so any really big number would need to be paid via a bonus usually paid immediately. The Bucs aren’t or can’t do that.

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#23 : June 16, 2010, 02:58:35 PM

Dont forget that supposably this FA will be flooded with talent and Penn might be the 3rd or 4th option for teams looking for a LT.
I don't think the market will be nearly as lucrative for Penn as some seem to think. Almost all teams have an established left tackle or a young prospect they're not ready to give up on. There will likely be 3-4 left tackle candidates in the draft in 2011 and it's possible Marcus McNeill, Jammal Brown, and others will be free agents. And no one is going to sign Penn to play right tackle because he's such a lousy run blocker, so I don't see him having too many options.

Free Agency will be what it always is.  Most of that flood will return to their teams.  Penn won't.  Not the way he's being treated now.  Left Tackles that can play at the level Penn does just don't hit FA...  I'm sure a Jerry Jones type owner will remember Ware getting shut down for two games...


Im also sure a Parcels type manager will remember him being a revolving door against Wake as well. Penn isnt even in the top 20 LTs IMO.



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#24 : June 16, 2010, 03:13:58 PM

Dont forget that supposably this FA will be flooded with talent and Penn might be the 3rd or 4th option for teams looking for a LT.
I don't think the market will be nearly as lucrative for Penn as some seem to think. Almost all teams have an established left tackle or a young prospect they're not ready to give up on. There will likely be 3-4 left tackle candidates in the draft in 2011 and it's possible Marcus McNeill, Jammal Brown, and others will be free agents. And no one is going to sign Penn to play right tackle because he's such a lousy run blocker, so I don't see him having too many options.

Free Agency will be what it always is.  Most of that flood will return to their teams.  Penn won't.  Not the way he's being treated now.  Left Tackles that can play at the level Penn does just don't hit FA...  I'm sure a Jerry Jones type owner will remember Ware getting shut down for two games...
I genuinely think Jammal Brown will hit the market. New Orleans just won the Super Bowl with him on IR and within the last month gave $50 million to Jahri Evans when they could have easily given it to Brown, too. They just drafted a LT in the 2nd round likely to develop in 2010 and take over in 2011.

As for Marcus McNeill, he's pulling the same act Penn is right now, despite making two pro bowls and receiving overall less compensation than Penn has since 2006. If you think Penn won't be retained, what makes McNeill any different? San Diego is pretty stingy with extensions unless you play quarterback.

FRG is the most logical poster on this board.  You guys just don\'t like where the logical conclusions take you.

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#25 : June 16, 2010, 03:32:48 PM

Penn's best option is to sit it out until the final 6 games.  I think that's the limit to get a year's credit.  Then, he goes to UFA...


Nope, he will only have 5 accrued years even if he gets credit for this year. If no CBA, he will be a RFA again next year. If they get a new CBA, they could always franchise him. His hands are pretty much tied at this point.

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#26 : June 16, 2010, 03:46:03 PM

Penn's best option is to sit it out until the final 6 games.  I think that's the limit to get a year's credit.  Then, he goes to UFA...


Nope, he will only have 5 accrued years even if he gets credit for this year. If no CBA, he will be a RFA again next year. If they get a new CBA, they could always franchise him. His hands are pretty much tied at this point.

I had forgotten he actually ends up with an extra 2 years of RFA because of the CBA in it's last season.

This makes it even more interesting.

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calicojack

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#27 : June 16, 2010, 03:48:32 PM

Penn's best option is to sit it out until the final 6 games.� I think that's the limit to get a year's credit.� Then, he goes to UFA...


Nope, he will only have 5 accrued years even if he gets credit for this year. If no CBA, he will be a RFA again next year. If they get a new CBA, they could always franchise him. His hands are pretty much tied at this point.

I had forgotten he actually ends up with an extra 2 years of RFA because of the CBA in it's last season.

This makes it even more interesting.

No.  That is a Final Year rule.  This is the Final year, not next year...

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#28 : June 16, 2010, 04:28:59 PM

Even if he isn't a premier guy in your eyes. Heck in anyone's eyes, what do we have behind him right now?


That's a horrible reason to sign someone to a long-term deal.  It's a great reason, however, for a one-year deal, which is exactly what he has been offered.

So if you're not going to sign him to a long term deal, why hold the guy hostage with this"under the rules" crap.  Dude no matter how the Penn haters spin this it's not on the player.  If they hate the guy as much as some of you do why haven't they made a move to secure this "upgrade" everyone is looking for? You know the guy thats sooooooo much better than the "bag of rocks" Penn is to quote one of our famous posters... He couldn't have been in the draft as we didn't even sniff and olineman on draft day. So you're going to play hardball with the best choice you have at LT?  I'm sure Freeman will thank the FO for letting Donald's backup get "valuable" reps.... 

Without Carl Nix it feels like our running game just took a death blow to the face!


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#29 : June 16, 2010, 06:08:09 PM

Shawn King just pointed out that D Joseph, Trueblood, and Penn will be unrestricted fa's next year. -Great. I can just imagine us scrapping together the money to underpay 1 of the three at best.. ugh

Add to that....we have no depth!! Who is our starting Oline next year? Someone has MAJORLY screwed the pooch on the Oline.

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