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Fitz66

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: July 28, 2010, 09:22:54 AM

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/07/27/georgia-university-tells-student-lose-religion-lawsuit-claims/?test=faces

Looking past the debate on whether or not people are born gay or not (seriously, lets not discuss that), I am totally in favor of what Augusta State Univ did.  She's going to graduate school to be a school counselor and, while there, has been the BucsGuru or the school. 

IMO, the school has the right to say who fits their standards for a degree and who does not. If they don't feel 100% confident in someone's way of thinking, they shouldn't have to give them a degree and send them out to counsel our kids.  If she was going to school for her CPA or something, it would be different. 

Thoughts?
(this should be fun)


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lyronmewis

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#1 : July 28, 2010, 10:56:15 AM

I disagree with their decision because it's a slippery slope. If the girl was passing and staying out of trouble, then she should get her degree. Should an economics student not get his degree because he's a monetarist when the school only wants an image of Keynesian ideology? I think her counselling would be extremely biased and hurtful in some cases, but to me that's up to the discretion of her future employer.

Fitz66

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#2 : July 28, 2010, 11:00:59 AM

I agree to an extent and see the "where does it end" argument - but these kinds of things need to be contained on a case by case basis. 

The difference in the economics statement is that economists are never put in a situation where they're counseling kids with issues. One day, there could be a kid who wants to come talk to his counselor about this because he can't talk to his/her parents about it.  What in the world is she going to say?  "Kid, this is a choice".  Bam, emotionally scarred for life.

It would be up to her future employer if employers were legally allowed to ask about these things before hiring.  They're not. 



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Skull and Bones

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#3 : July 28, 2010, 11:35:07 AM

it's been slow around here.  threads about homosexuality and religion are always good for 2 pages.  this incorporates both.  nice.


Fitz66

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#4 : July 28, 2010, 11:57:46 AM

it's been slow around here.  threads about homosexuality and religion are always good for 2 pages.  this incorporates both.  nice.
haha, not intended to play off of that.  Was hoping to hear what people think about the schools decision, not argue the girls beliefs.


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corruptpirate

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#5 : July 28, 2010, 11:58:48 AM

That is a state school that just ordered her to change her religious views. A private religious school I understand, but not a state school being supplemented by tax dollars. It has now crossed over to discriminating against religion.

Fitz66

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#6 : July 28, 2010, 12:05:20 PM

That is a state school that just ordered her to change her religious views. A private religious school I understand, but not a state school being supplemented by tax dollars. It has now crossed over to discriminating against religion.
They didn't order her to change her religious views (despite the headline of the article), they told her that she couldn't be in the Counseling program. 



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anterrabae33

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#7 : July 28, 2010, 12:11:45 PM

I don't usually chime in on political topics because it's just too much gray area but....

I think it is wrong of them to do this:

A) Because if anything, this problem should have been rooted out when she originally got there
B) It seems unconstitutional to make someone change their religious beliefs

I think its right of them to do this:

A) While it seems unconstitutional, some rights are very debatable when looked into specifics
B) This girl will be in charge of people's well beings. Her religious views could be a direct catalyst to someone harming themselves or others.


I'll try and leave it at that.

BucsGuru

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#8 : July 28, 2010, 12:34:10 PM

Either the school is attempting to be socially/politically correct by forcing her to change her beliefs in order to obtain a degree, or she has obviously pissed off a homosexual teacher/dean.

In either case, it is entirely wrong by one single definition.  Regardless of what any person on the face of this earth believes, we have as a society attempted to enforce our laws/standards based upon facts/information that are agreed upon as a whole/majority, rather than a minority.  Until homosexuality can be proven to be a physical condition that a person is born with, than it is impossible to enforce such laws/rules such as this.  Her religious views should be excluded from the conversation; period.  They are assuming, like most people do, that through her profession, she would become unprofressional and attempt to convert the belief of another.  It's the same way some people believe that I hate gay people because of how I believe about the act of homosexuality.  As if I or her would brow beat a homosexual with a bible and pour oil other them in an attempt to change them?  I cannot change anyone other than myself. 

However, I will say this; this is exactly what the homosexual community desires.  That those who will not accept their lifestyle be called bigots and ignorant.  This will not end with homosexuality.  It will lead to other minority groups attempting to gain acceptance just as they have.  The box is fully open.

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#9 : July 28, 2010, 12:40:30 PM

The school didn't seem to have a problem with the way she counsels so to my understanding, she only communicated her beliefs in the classroom and nonprofessional settings. There are lots of people who have controversial beliefs that are able to function professionally.

As for the code of ethics, The school's only responsibility is to teach it to students and test the students. Whether or not she follows it doesn't matter as long as she passes her examinations. It is up to her to face the consequences if she doesn't adhere to it in the professional world.

By giving her the ultimatum, it is subtly saying that her beliefs are not followed in the school.

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#10 : July 28, 2010, 12:52:59 PM

It seems to me that ASU is contridicting their own Mission Statement in regards to diversity of background and itself discriminating against this student. Furthermore, the university seems to be able to determine beforehand that this women would not act in a professional manner, which is the core of the Code of Ethics, and is acting as future thought police that she would, in fact, always discriminate against certain individuals. . Acting professionally means that you can act in a manner that best effects your clients, regardless of personal beliefs.

"This mission is based on the value of a liberal arts education for students who are diverse in ethnicity, background, age, and preparation."

\"The budget should be balanced; the treasury should be refilled; public debt should be reduced; and the arrogance of public officials should be controlled.\" -Cicero. 106-43 B.C.

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#11 : July 28, 2010, 04:41:37 PM

She will win lost of money very soon!


Fitz66

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#12 : July 29, 2010, 04:56:53 PM

Well the precedent is set:
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/07/28/court-university-expel-student-opposes-homosexuality/


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#13 : July 29, 2010, 05:50:09 PM

Fitz,

We discussed this last night in church and I had a feeling the Augusta State student will be denied as well.  It is absolutely unbelievable. 

What's more, is that someone mentioned earlier that this should be a matter between the counseler and her patient.  If she feels like she cannot help an individual who comes to her based upon circumstances that go against her faith, she could and should simply refer them to another counselor. 

Now that one school has already dismissed a student for standing behind her belief, the pattern will be followed for sure across the country...in public schools no less funded by who?  CHRISTIAN TAXPAYERS!?  What is even more disturbing is that this could very well lead to theological schools losing accreditation due to teaching of their faith. 

Tell me again who the "minority" is??

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#14 : July 30, 2010, 12:07:39 AM

it's been slow around here.  threads about homosexuality and religion are always good for 2 pages.  this incorporates both.  nice.
haha, not intended to play off of that.  Was hoping to hear what people think about the schools decision, not argue the girls beliefs.
well the constitution doesn't give us a right to an education. this girl has the right to her opinion and to voice them but not with a school's endorsement. that being said she is all the way to the end so she will have all that expense with nothing to show. also many people like myself that think homosexual acts are morally wrong (like fornication (though that is now more common than purity), adultery (also common now although most people admit it is wrong on some level), lying, etc, etc. perhaps she could agree to send any student with such issues to a specialist rather than handle the case herself.

"The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money." Alexis de Tocqueville
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