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alldaway

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#15 : March 15, 2007, 11:58:19 AM

It is based on the circumstances. You can't let your whole staff go in a one or two year period. One of the big reasons Marty got canned is for letting so much of his staff go, he lost some key position assistants who would have replaced Phillips and Cameron. I think it is a good policy if someone is up for promotion to let them interview...if the organization can afford it. But you can't loose your D-line coach, LB coach, and secondary coach all in the same year.

The league is watered down already with coaches and player movement being so prevalent as it is.  Anymore than that and it would be a very big concern.

The Chargers were practically gutted. 


Itchalot

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#16 : March 15, 2007, 12:00:30 PM

I agree that coordinators should have a different tier, but Marinelli was an assistant head coach. They gave him that title so that he could have a promotion even with Kiffin around. Assistant head coach should be at the same tier as DC or OC.

No, because that is not a real title. No one hires you because you are the assistant head coach. It is a fake title teams use to give guys more money. Have you ever seen an assistant head coach/position coach want to turn down the coordinator role? Of course not, everyone knows it is a bump up but the owners don't want to raise the salary bar for all position coaches so they add that title on and claim that that's why they are getting more jack.
If the money is real then the title is real.  That doesn't mean Marinelli wouldn't rather be the DC, but on the organization chart Marinelli was higher up.   The whole title is "fake" as you put it, but thats the purpose, so you can keep a coach happy by paying him more and giving him a promotion if you don't have a coordinator spot for him, but in return that coach has to expect that if he's being paid like a coordinator then he is also on the same tier.

The importance is up to the organization.  For teams with a defensive head coach, the defensive coordinator is probably less important than the assistant head coach if they even have one.  If the Bucs decided to have an offensive coordinator while Marinelli was here that person certainly wouldn't have been as high up on the pecking order as Marinelli.


Booker Reese

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#17 : March 15, 2007, 12:33:06 PM

I agree that coordinators should have a different tier, but Marinelli was an assistant head coach. They gave him that title so that he could have a promotion even with Kiffin around. Assistant head coach should be at the same tier as DC or OC.

No, because that is not a real title. No one hires you because you are the assistant head coach. It is a fake title teams use to give guys more money. Have you ever seen an assistant head coach/position coach want to turn down the coordinator role? Of course not, everyone knows it is a bump up but the owners don't want to raise the salary bar for all position coaches so they add that title on and claim that that's why they are getting more jack.

Well, that "fake title" lead 2 position coaches (Herm/Rod) straight to a HC job without stopping at coordinator. How many other position coaches in this league have gone straight to HC? I'm not sure I know the exact answer, but I'm sure it's very few.

If Rod didn't like the fake title, he always could have signed a short deal like Tomlin did.

Again, we have no problems with this happening to players, but for some reason when a coach is involved everybody goes crazy. I'm a free market guy, but the NFL is not a free market league.

vipmark

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#18 : March 15, 2007, 08:57:52 PM

Never really seen her before, Shivver...

*********************

She works for the NFL Network, Jennifer Allen (i think).  On yesterday's episode of NFL Total Access, she interviews coaches wives, Ms. Gruden, Ms. Del Rio, Ms. Fox and Ms. Edwards.  Holy CRAP, John Fox's wife looks like a werewolf!  Ms. Gruden is kinda brash and loud mouthed, just like Johnny!!!!


I did not see the interview with Cindy Gruden but please believe me, Cindy is the nicest, sweetest person I have ever met. I have never known her to be loudmouthed or brash. I could go on and on about how great she is .....I hope you all will take my word on this.

flyinbuc

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#19 : March 15, 2007, 09:22:33 PM

I'm am in the dark on this. Is this just the Bucs? If it is a league wise activity then why the slam on bruce specifically

dbucfan

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#20 : March 15, 2007, 10:24:09 PM

I am gonna sound so damn republican. 

If they don't want to fulfill the contracts they sign then why sign them.  Let them be at risk employees and if they get fired then they don't get paid. 

But if you sign a contract why in the world would they expect to be cut loose for a promotion to the teams competitor?  That concept simply is assine. 

Sorry Dal, but I don't see the logic, nor the reason you are only addressing Bruce Allen.  I realize he has said no to some requests to be released but I assume they are not changing a league rule only bc Bruce Allen has not released a couple of coaches who wanted to leave prematurely.  Maybe I am wrong on the idea that folks other than Allen have enforced contracts - but on the contract concepts I am pretty sure that is the reason they are used.  I will do x job for y dollars for a set period of time.  Both sign, it is binding.  End of "controversy".  If you want out of a contract find a buy out or some other term in the contract to be free of it, if there is not one - well, live it out.  No sympathy here.

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

BucFanMatt

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#21 : March 15, 2007, 10:33:01 PM

Based on results, I don't think you can argue that the Bucs' policy regarding assistant coaches is holding guys back.  They've been turning out head coaches like a factory for a while now, and there doesn't seem to be any slow down since Bruce took over.

\"Those who would trade freedom for security deserve neither\" -- Benjamin Franklin



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#22 : March 15, 2007, 11:05:31 PM

Based on results, I don't think you can argue that the Bucs' policy regarding assistant coaches is holding guys back. They've been turning out head coaches like a factory for a while now, and there doesn't seem to be any slow down since Bruce took over.

i believe after Barry, it'll come to a screeching hault.

dbucfan

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#23 : March 15, 2007, 11:12:10 PM

What policy is the BFM - the one where a coach signs a contract that guarantees a certain amount of money for a specified time?  What does the coach argue?  I know I am an adult (with or without an agent) who knowlingly signed a contract that gave me and my family security (money) for a set period of time, all of which I thought was fair. But now, I have a chance to work for your competitor for more money so let me go without compensation so I can make more money, even though you fulfilled your end of the contract.  Is that the policy you think should be removed.

Like I said, if they want to be at will employees fine, don't sign the contract.  Or only one year contracts.  Then is it all good, but if they want the security of the multi year deal - what the heck is all of this???

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

karen anderson

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#24 : March 15, 2007, 11:35:30 PM

Muir won't be a HC?? ::)



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#25 : March 15, 2007, 11:37:04 PM

Ideally when Major Applewhite takes over as the youngest HC ever, and Kyle Shanahan is his OC, maybe Simms can have some success?

karen anderson

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#26 : March 15, 2007, 11:59:00 PM

Yea, sure, RJ.

Bucs Capacitor

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#27 : March 16, 2007, 12:50:28 AM

What is it with you guys and other people's sisters?? ;-)

gone

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#28 : March 16, 2007, 12:15:00 PM

Frankly I want Bruce Allen (or whoever the GM is) to use whatever legal means necessary to make
the team better.  He wouldn't be doing his job if he says 'well..I want to be a nice guy about it' and look
the other way. And you can bet  if he did there would someone post 'WHY IS HE LETTING THESE GUYS GET
AWAY'.


Actually, that's exactly what the trib did this year.  They bashed the Bucsfor not letting Barry go with Rod, and also bashed them for letting Rod go and not doing "everything in their power" to keep him.  Cummings, not 2 seperate reporters either.

And as has been pointed out, you sign a contract, you are expected to fulfill it.  The Buc's fulfilled their half, you need to fulfill yours.  If it isn't makeing you happy a few years later, well, you should have had more foresight. 

Not to sound dramatic, but without consistent contractual law, the entire economy of the world would collapse.  You CAN'T function without people being able to rely on the contract you signed.  That's why we HAVE contracts, to ensure 2 parties both keep their word...

FartMan

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#29 : March 16, 2007, 01:31:19 PM

I'm not necessarily for letting asst. coaches go where ever they want.  I am for opening the competition for them.  Pay them more money.  Even allow teams to trade them.  Let teams get something for their loss of continuity.

They Bucs are hard asses when it comes to coaches contracts, they also pay assistant coaches better than most teams.
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