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dbucfan

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#15 : October 06, 2010, 02:50:14 PM

1sparkybuc wrote:
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Raw Is A Buffoon wrote:
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Gruden took an underachieving team and went 12-4 and won a Super Bowl.  Now that's an achievment.


An achievement largely dependent on the Defense(ranked #1) he inheirited from Tony Dungy and run by Monte Kiffin. Gruden's offense was 18th in the league.

Granted, there would be no Lombardi trophy in Tampa without Jon Gruden, but he is also responsible for the shipwreck that Raheem Morris inheirited. Dominik and Morris snagged a franchise QB with their very first pick in their very first draft. Gruden/McKay/Allen couldn't do it in 7 years, not even a mediocre run-of-the-mill QB. Rejects and long shots can't get it done. That's why he was fired.


Someday this conversation topic will leave us - but until it does we are stuck.

1.  Of course the D was better - good picks, good FA pick and all the money was spent on the defensive side of the ball - under Dungy and Gruden
2.  Of course Gruden was required to bring the SB in - Tony could not get an OC he liked and could run an offense that could win.
3.  The mess left - some of it - hell a lot of it was poor drafting with Gruden and Allen - add to that cap hell left by McKay, and then financial constraints with FA at the end of Allen/Gruden's tenure and the state the buccs were at wasn't great.  Improvement in last year's draft was pretty much offset by the terminations of experienced team members - for whatever reason.
4.  Allen and Gruden were fired - what an interesting statement.  Let's see - Allen and Gruden were under the impression they would have access to the full cap number and were anxious to go FA shopping - they get fired? and Dominic and Raheem get little to no money for FAs - they do get to make a trade - and keep AB.  Buccaneers are safely under the cap - to the point where they did get to the floor.
5.  Allen and Gruden should have been fired for not getting a Franchise QB AND a stud UT during their tenure.  Not sure that was the case - not a bit sure.

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

Biggs3535

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#16 : October 06, 2010, 03:09:16 PM



X Factor

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#17 : October 06, 2010, 03:11:25 PM

Capt_Chaos wrote:
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yet he had an average higher than Favre, Brady ( who won the SB the year before ) and  McNabb

oh, Plus he won a superbowl


Brad Johnson actually was absolutly horrible, until Gruden taught him how to throw a pass. Then with Gruden's Defensive genius got a mediacore group of defensive players to play above their heads. I mean without the defensive mastermind Gruden the defense was average at best. What is completely shocking to me though is with Gruden's Defensive genius and topping that with his offensive genius he couldn't have a .500 record in 6 years following the Super Bowl year. But we did have 2 playoff appearences in those 6 years, even though they were 1st round playoff embarassing losses I don't get why we canned him. He was on the brink of making Jeff Garcia a SB winning QB...

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#18 : October 06, 2010, 03:13:41 PM

dbucfan wrote:
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4.  Allen and Gruden were fired - what an interesting statement.  Let's see - Allen and Gruden were under the impression they would have access to the full cap number and were anxious to go FA shopping - they get fired? and Dominic and Raheem get little to no money for FAs - they do get to make a trade - and keep AB.  Buccaneers are safely under the cap - to the point where they did get to the floor.

Who were they going to sign?

FRG is the most logical poster on this board.  You guys just don\'t like where the logical conclusions take you.

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#19 : October 06, 2010, 03:26:08 PM

Raheem of coarse, because he's the only person that could make a difference


X Factor

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#20 : October 06, 2010, 03:28:35 PM

Capt_Chaos wrote:
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Raheem of coarse, because he's the only person that could make a difference


You know I thought the same thing... He is the only Gruden guy left, we need more Gruden Disciples coaching this team.

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#21 : October 06, 2010, 03:28:55 PM

dbucfan wrote:
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Winning three road games in a row is an achievement regardless of whom they played.

While that might be at the top of Heemy's resume I doubt it would even make Gruden's.


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#22 : October 06, 2010, 03:32:36 PM

Raw Is A Buffoon wrote:
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dbucfan wrote:
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Winning three road games in a row is an achievement regardless of whom they played.

While that might be at the top of Heemy's resume I doubt it would even make Gruden's.

 

Come on Java, we all know Gruden hand picked Raheem. Raheem's nickname should be Gruden Jr.  I mean Raheem has the chest  bump, and Gruden had the fist pump - they are like the same coach.

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1sparkybuc

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#23 : October 06, 2010, 08:22:51 PM

Capt Chaos, it's spelled "course", not coarse. Are you really that ignorant?Are you really that rude? Were you raised in a whorehouse? There is nothing inaccurate in my statement. The offense ranked 18th in the league. The defense ranked 1st overall and his only input was about the Raider offense just before the SB. Other than that, Kiffin ran the show. Dungy never would have won a SB in Tampa, but never would have either if he had to start where Dungy did. Proof of that is he started out with a league champion and never got even close again. The last playoff game he won was the SB. The Redskins got some help from the officials but it should never have been that close. The Defense did their part. They shut Washington down all day. Gruden and Simms stunk it up.
Gruden left this team in shambles. No offense, no defense, and very few players to build on. Dungy at least left a QB and a world class Defense.

If the Bucs win this Sunday, it will be 4 road wins in a row. I feel quite comfortable in saying, Gruden never did that and likely never will. In his new job he has an audience, and that's all he ever wanted. He gets paid to look at himself in the moniter. I'm guessing you tune in at every opportunity.

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#24 : October 06, 2010, 08:36:42 PM

I lost all respect for Gruden when he ruined Alstotts career.  That guy played the game the way it was supposed to be played.  I am not a big fan of Raheems either.  He's got this team going in the wrong direction.  He seems to think it's cool to let these guys act like rap video thugs.


Hate

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#25 : October 06, 2010, 09:04:31 PM

Biggs3535 wrote:
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Raw Is A Buffoon wrote:
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Under Gruden.


You must really like that position.


LOL... there must be a lotta room under there

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 I thought Lovie said he wanted quickness & speed, even at the QB position?

dbucfan

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#26 : October 06, 2010, 09:39:17 PM

Raw Is A Buffoon wrote:
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dbucfan wrote:
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Winning three road games in a row is an achievement regardless of whom they played.

While that might be at the top of Heemy's resume I doubt it would even make Gruden's.

That's an interesting point.  Here's another.  Jon Gruden has left Tampa... and he is not going to be back.

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant
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