Welcome, Guest
Pewter Report  >>  Boards  >>  The Red Board (Moderators: 3rd String Kicker, PRPatrol)  >>  Topic: Is Freeman the best Bucs QB ever....... right now? « previous next »
Page: 1 2 3

michael89156

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 12070
Offline
: November 14, 2010, 12:25:35 AM

Tampa Bay Buccaneers quarterback Josh Freeman rising to the top
By Gary Shelton, Times Sports Columnist
In Print: Sunday, November 14, 2010


  Top 10 NFL quarterbacks

1. Peyton Manning

2. Tom Brady

3. Drew Brees

4. Philip Rivers

5. Ben
Roethlisberger

6. Aaron Rodgers

7. Matt Ryan

8. Eli
Manning

9. Josh Freeman

10. Carson Palmer




Top 5 QBs to build around

1. Josh
Freeman

2. Matt Ryan

3. Mark Sanchez

4. Sam Bradford

5. Joe Flacco





Top 5 Bucs quarterbacks

1. Doug Williams

2. Josh Freeman

3. Brad Johnson

4. Jeff
Garcia

5. Trent Dilfer




Better than Mark Sanchez. Better than Tony Romo. Better than whatever is left of Brett Favre. Logic tells you it is awfully early for a measurement, of course. And still, here Josh Freeman is. Already. His resume pretty much consists of two half-seasons, and there are still memories to make and improvements to pursue. He is just getting started. And yet, when you mention the top quarterbacks of the NFL, it does not take long to get to his name.

Better than Joe Flacco. Better than Michael Vick. Better than Donovan McNabb, certainly in the final two minutes.

He has grown from an unpopular draft choice to an awkward rookie to the face of his franchise with the speed of a deep pass. He is better on third down than on second and better in the fourth quarter than the third, and if the Bucs can build around him, you get the feeling he will be better tomorrow than today.

That said, Freeman looks pretty good these days, too.

Better than Matt Schaub. Better than Carson Palmer. Better than the comedy stylings of Jay Cutler.

Freeman has found success in a microwave. His quick rise has been almost historic. Sure, there have been young quarterbacks succeed before Dan Marino, Ben Roethlisberger, Matt Ryan and Flacco come to mind but usually, those players were on playoff-ready rosters with good defenses and solid running games. Rarely do you see a young quarterback grow up as his offense does and still be successful.

There are times, when the offense is moving and Freeman is making big plays, that you cannot help but wonder even now where Freeman ranks among his peers. This is what we do, after all. We watch. We rank. We discuss.

So how good is Freeman, at this precise moment? At age 22? With only 18 games under his belt?

He is one of the top 10 quarterbacks. Right now.

He is the No. 1 quarterback in the league you would want to build a franchise around. Today.

He is destined to be the best quarterback in the history of the Bucs franchise. And it might happen any day now.

Yes, this sounds bold, and yes, this sounds a tad premature. The temptation is to still think of Freeman as an apprentice finding his way around the huddle. And in some ways, that is true. But when you see his poise in the pocket, when you see the way his teammates look to him in important moments, when you see him make a big play, it becomes more and more obvious that Freeman has arrived.

No, he is not Peyton Manning, and no, he is not Tom Brady. He is not Drew Brees or Philip Rivers or Roethlisberger. He lacks their experience, and he lacks their accomplishments. He's still chasing Eli Manning and Aaron Rodgers and Ryan.

And who else?

Bottom line: I have him ninth, a half-step ahead of Palmer, who has bigger things to worry about what with his receivers making up pass routes as they go. That means Freeman is ahead of 23 starting quarterbacks. Also, he is in the passing lane.

At this point, there is only one knock against Freeman: His age. It is just so soon to accept him as being among the top third of NFL quarterbacks.

But watch him throw. Watch him run. Watch his poise. Watch what he does on third down (where his completion percentage rises almost 6 points). Watch what he does in the fourth quarter (where he has led his team to victory six times in his eight wins). Watch him get better. (Last year, he threw 18 interceptions in nine games; this year, he has five in eight.) Listen as coach Raheem Morris talks about the "it" factor when he describes Freeman.

Remember why the Bucs moved up to pick Freeman in the 2009 draft? Because general manager Mark Dominik likened him to the five-tool rankings you hear about with baseball players who are able to do everything.

"He's a five-tool quarterback," Dominik said.

As such, he also might be the most desirable young quarterback in the NFL. Ask yourself: If you were going to start a franchise with a young quarterback let's say 26 and younger whom would you prefer?

Given Ryan's start, he's in the argument. Flacco, too. And Sanchez and Sam Bradford and, if he can ever stay healthy, Matt Stafford. Ah, but can any of those run the way Freeman can? Think about this: Nine times this year, Freeman has run on third down and made the first down. That includes one on third and 16, two on third and 11, one on third and 9 and four on third and 4.

More questions about the other young quarterbacks: Could any of them have pulled off eight victories with this team? With this running game? With this defense?

So, yeah, if I'm building a team, I start with Freeman.

Ah, but what if the discussion isn't about building a team but defining a franchise?

Let's be honest. The Bucs haven't exactly studied a lot of greatness when it came to their quarterbacks. A lot of guys have come, and a lot of guys have left.

I still can't rank Freeman ahead of Doug Williams yet. True, Williams completed only 47 percent of his passes as a Buc, and his rating was only 66. But he was much of the reason for the early success of the Bucs, and he made the playoffs three times. If you doubt Williams' impact, ask one of the old Bucs what happened to the franchise once he left.

If Freeman continues to improve, and if the Bucs continue to improve around him, the designation is just a matter of time. You know it, I know it, and wherever he is, Jack "The Throwin' Samoan" Thompson knows it.

Granted, Freeman still has some growing to do. He can be more accurate. He can make opponents pay more dearly for blitzing him. But it has been a long time since anyone questioned whether he belonged.

The best part? He's 22. The improvement shouldn't be done yet.

For a great quarterback, after all, being considered among the top 10 shouldn't be enough. Having the best future isn't the point. And being the best Bucs quarterback of them all is kind of being the toughest guy at the Star Trek convention.

It shouldn't be enough. Not for Freeman, and not for the Bucs.

After 18 games, however, you have to admit it looks like a pretty good start.

jerseybucsfan

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 13637
Online
#1 : November 14, 2010, 01:13:42 AM

Shelton is like that ugly girl who if you dim the lights and play the right music every so often is good looking.
Every once in awhile he gives us one of these gems, reminding us how much fun it used to be to read about the Bucs beyond Pewter Report. The SPT and the Trib weren't always this way. Nice job, Gary.
Let's hope he and his cohorts can continue to see the good of what this franchise is and hopefully is becoming.

In Verner We Trust

1sparkybuc

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 7269
Offline
#2 : November 14, 2010, 09:09:48 AM

Doug Williams would not rank in the top 20 of Buccaneer QBs in intelligence. He did not play smart. His game was velocity and ignored touch. He threw short passes like he was daring the receivers to catch them. John McKay would say "Well they caught them at Grambling".

Freeman is easily in the top 5 in intelligence, even at this early stage of his career, and he already knows when touch is required. Doug Williams had a great Defense that carried the team to the NFCC in 1979. He couldn't even manage one single TD against the Rams. Put Freeman on that team and the Bucs would have had their Lombardi trophy thirty years ago. Put Doug Williams on this team and Suh would be starting for the Bucs today. They would also be 2-6 instead of 5-3.

The only other Buccaneer QB I would even consider building a team around is Steve Young, and yes I know we didn't draft him. Of the players we drafted, Vinnie would be the next choice.

Josh Freeman is clearly the frontrunner to be the best we have ever had. I'm just thankful I lived long enough to see it.

Blaze688

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 3094
Offline
#3 : November 14, 2010, 10:39:00 AM

1sparkybuc wrote:
Quote
The only other Buccaneer QB I would even consider building a team around is Steve Young, and yes I know we didn't draft him. Of the players we drafted, Vinnie would be the next choice.




NotDeadYet

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 6860
Offline
#4 : November 14, 2010, 11:18:51 AM

Sorry, but Doug Williams was never a great quarterback for the Bucs. After he left, yes, he did develop. Same with Steve Young and Vinny. Doug played with a lot of guts, took an unbelievable beating at times from opposing defenses, but was not in the same league as Brad Johnson or even Josh Freeman, for instance. Josh Freeman is on course to becoming the best the Bucs have ever had, IMO...
    Oh, and I think Josh Freeman is better right now than Matt Ryan. Ryan is good, but is definitely overrated...

1sparkybuc

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 7269
Offline
#5 : November 14, 2010, 05:20:44 PM

Blaze688 wrote:
Quote
1sparkybuc wrote:
Quote
The only other Buccaneer QB I would even consider building a team around is Steve Young, and yes I know we didn't draft him. Of the players we drafted, Vinnie would be the next choice.




Suplemental being the key word. Steve Young was already a paid professional QB in the USFL before the Bucs acquired him. He was not drafted as a rookie out of BYU. He was fortunate to be traded to San Francisco. A career here would never have ended up in Canton. The Bucs were the black hole of the NFL universe back then. I doubt Bill Walsh could have saved them even if he had Young and Montana on the roster.

ABuccsFan

*****
Pro Bowler

Posts : 1423
Offline
#6 : November 14, 2010, 05:32:18 PM

jerseybucsfan wrote:
Quote
Shelton is like that ugly girl who if you dim the lights and play the right music every so often is good looking.
Every once in awhile he gives us one of these gems, reminding us how much fun it used to be to read about the Bucs beyond Pewter Report. The SPT and the Trib weren't always this way. Nice job, Gary.
Let's hope he and his cohorts can continue to see the good of what this franchise is and hopefully is becoming.
Jersey, I hate to beat a dead horse but I'm still amazed some refuse to see the light. How was the Trib and SPT fun to read before 2002 and fun to read again now? Maybe they were right before????????????????????????

\"For a brief, shining, moment in history, a select breed truly lived free.\".....Unknown Author.

BuccinTex

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 4940
Offline
#7 : November 14, 2010, 05:34:10 PM

Call me crazy but looking at that top 10 QB list.....I'd take freeman over Rivers any day of the week and twice on Sunday because for starters.....freeman can win you games on sunday.  Rivers doesn't seem to be able to put that team on his back and get the wins despite the rest of them playing bad.  Freeman has already proven he can do that and that's why I take him over Rivers easily.


Detrimental

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 6016
Offline
#8 : November 14, 2010, 05:34:49 PM

Freeman has 12 tds and 5 ints thru 9 games

Garcia averaged 12 tds a SEASON!!

Man its damn good having a franchise QB instead of "game managers"

Captain Hindsight

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 2513
Offline
#9 : November 14, 2010, 05:35:35 PM

Sorry, no way is Freeman better than Rivers. Rivers is a monster, and judging him by not being able to win on Sunday is crazy talk. It's like judging a pitcher by his W/L record. It's like Flacco's playoff record, it's magnificent but his personal stats are horrid... even in the wins. Rivers is a top 3 QB IMO.


BuccinTex

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 4940
Offline
#10 : November 14, 2010, 05:38:40 PM

Captain Hindsight wrote:
Quote
Sorry, no way is Freeman better than Rivers. Rivers is an absolute monster.


but Freeman finds a way to win close games and win despite his team doing everything they can to lose it....Rivers chokes in big games and doesn't have the same effect on the outcome as Freeman.  It's just my opinion but I doubt I'm the only one.   Plus Rivers is such a crap talking ninny.  He always tried to talk smack against the Broncos or Pats and would just take a flogging by them.  Freeman can back up anything he may say and yet he's smart enough to stay humble and just let his play do the talking.


but technically speaking I didn't say Freeman was better.  Just that I'd rather have him on my side come sunday.  If you want to talk numbers then yeah that's not Freeman but I'm like Raheem...stats are for losers, baby.  Just win the damn game.


Biggs3535

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 31619
Online
#11 : November 14, 2010, 06:17:49 PM

Captain Hindsight wrote:
Quote
Sorry, no way is Freeman better than Rivers. Rivers is a monster, and judging him by not being able to win on Sunday is crazy talk. It's like judging a pitcher by his W/L record. It's like Flacco's playoff record, it's magnificent but his personal stats are horrid... even in the wins. Rivers is a top 3 QB IMO.


Yeah, Rivers is leading all QB's in Yards, TD's, and QB Rating.  He's a stud.  San Diego has the number 1 offense in the league because of Rivers.  Dude's throwing the ball to no-name WR's and even Gates has missed time.


BuccinTex

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 4940
Offline
#12 : November 14, 2010, 06:23:43 PM

But back on point of the question of the thread......

http://www.nfl.com/videos/tampa-bay-buccaneers/09000d5d81c1bda2/Week-10-Josh-Freeman-highlights


It's hard to watch that and not say he's the best this team has ever had.   Both passes to Benn, the K2 touchdown, and the 3 to Williams are all nice.  That pass last week to Spurlock....money.  Using his legs to makes plays?  Yes sir.  The fake pass pull down run for the first down was like watching McNabb in his prime only better.  Freeman is becoming a star.


dbucfan

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 46214
Offline
#13 : November 14, 2010, 08:10:24 PM

BuccinTex wrote:
Quote
But back on point of the question of the thread......

http://www.nfl.com/videos/tampa-bay-buccaneers/09000d5d81c1bda2/Week-10-Josh-Freeman-highlights


It's hard to watch that and not say he's the best this team has ever had.   Both passes to Benn, the K2 touchdown, and the 3 to Williams are all nice.  That pass last week to Spurlock....money.  Using his legs to makes plays?  Yes sir.  The fake pass pull down run for the first down was like watching McNabb in his prime only better.  Freeman is becoming a star.


Agree with that ^^^^ but for Brad taking the team to success in a successful SB run - means that year he was the qb who beat the best of the competition.  I think Free can get to that level when the rest of this team is ready....

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

BuccinTex

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 4940
Offline
#14 : November 14, 2010, 08:15:42 PM

dbucfan wrote:
Quote
BuccinTex wrote:
Quote
But back on point of the question of the thread......

http://www.nfl.com/videos/tampa-bay-buccaneers/09000d5d81c1bda2/Week-10-Josh-Freeman-highlights


It's hard to watch that and not say he's the best this team has ever had.   Both passes to Benn, the K2 touchdown, and the 3 to Williams are all nice.  That pass last week to Spurlock....money.  Using his legs to makes plays?  Yes sir.  The fake pass pull down run for the first down was like watching McNabb in his prime only better.  Freeman is becoming a star.


Agree with that ^^^^ but for Brad taking the team to success in a successful SB run - means that year he was the qb who beat the best of the competition.  I think Free can get to that level when the rest of this team is ready....


Yeah after I posted it I realized some might say Brad and his run.  I can't really argue that except for if you look at that season Brad really did enough to win games with that defense.  I can't remember one game where he put the team on his back and won it with his arm or legs or even his brain.   But yeah he won the biggest game the franchise has ever had so until Freeman can duplicate that maybe he'll have to settle for second.   Just can't get over his calm demeanor come crunch time and how well he's protected the ball after last year's 18 picks.   I was one of the biggest cheerleaders for him after the draft and even I never thought he could be this good this early.  I honestly thought he wouldn't start winning a lot of games until year three.   Good drafting has helped him a lot.

Page: 1 2 3
Pewter Report  >>  Boards  >>  The Red Board (Moderators: 3rd String Kicker, PRPatrol)  >>  Topic: Is Freeman the best Bucs QB ever....... right now? « previous next »
:

Hide Tools Show Tools