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michael89156

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: December 14, 2010, 11:39:22 AM

Tuesday, December 14, 2010
Bull Rush



http://passingonthegame.blogspot.com/2010/12/bull-rush_14.html





I, like many Bucs fans I imagine, was fired up during the first half of the game on Sunday about how turrible the Bucs looked playing the run against the Redskins. I figured, hey I just bought this new webcam and I have a lot to say so screw it, I'll just do a vlog!

Well after several attempted installations and troubleshooting I'm pronouncing that effort an EPIC FAIL.

I was so frustrated I just about said to hell with it and refused to blog about the game, especially since the Bucs won. But I figured that would be kind of trifling this late in the season to just drop the ball like that.

Which is why I'm up at 1:30 blogging right now instead of sleeping.

SMDH!

Anyway this will be another one of those instances where I just get it all off my chest in one post and then move on so get ready for a long post and probably a good bit of rambling thoughts.

I figured first off I might as well address the dismal performance by the Bucs defense in the first half. No diagrams this time but I'll give you the short version of what happened and who was at fault.

Keep in mind that in most of the Bucs' base defenses every guy has their own gap. It's why they call it a "one gap defense"(!). So all it takes on any given play is one guy to screw up and the running back can be out of the gate. But if you compound it with people in the secondary screwing up then you turn a good gain into a 54 yard run.

Other times however a team just runs a better scheme than your defense. This actually was the case several times as I will point out. Even when everybody essentially did their job the defense was still at a disadvantage.

You will notice many of these plays were back to back. It was truly unbelievable to see so many screwups in such a short period of time but the good news is the Bucs were still able to overcome it.

13:09 1st and 15 The Redskins just run a simple one back zone play. The first problem is that Roy Miller, who played a lot better in the second half, went up field and got reached by the center. Its the same problem he has had in other games and this time the defense paid for it. The ball ran in what was his gap after the guard went up to block the linebacker Barrett Ruud. Now Ruud is in decent shape to make the play about 6 or 7 yards up the field or at the least turn it to the safety, in this case Corey Lynch, who SHOULD be filling the ally. What ACTUALLY happened was that Lynch took a poor angle and ran right into the back of Ruud taking them both out of the play and opening the flood gates. 54 yards latter the Bucs at least kept the Redskins out of the endzone which although underplayed by many in the media, was really the catalyst for them winning the game. If they gave up TDs then there never would have been those missed field goals and the game would have been out of hand early.

Just thought I'd point that out.

6:48 1st and 10 The NFL being a copycat league, the Redskins featured that Saints play I drew up a while ago with a new twist. Instead of using two tight ends they used two wide receivers. And instead of both of them going to the flat on the snap, this time the receiver that was wide and the one that was close to the tackle in the slot criss crossed. The effect this had was the slot receiver still took one defender, usually an outside linebacker, out of the box while heading out to the flat, but the receiver that was out wide had the opportunity to come back in the box and help double team the middle linebacker.

Let me say this, I watched those plays over and over and tried to come up with a defense to stop it and short of calling a blitz, which obviously you can't do every play, I had a hard time coming up with an obvious way to stop it. So kudos to the Redskins for their ingenuity. (of course I STILL wonder why the Bucs aren't using the same play which gives their own defense fits)

This particular time the problem was Tim Crowder not getting under the kickout block along with the fact that Miller allowed himself to be pushed too far inside by the guard. The result was a lane big enough to drive a Mac truck through and the Redskins ended up picking up 12 yards. The WR didn't make it to double Ruud but he didn't have to because Ruud went with his correct fit inside of the offensive tackle which walled him off from being able to make the play.

6:13 1st and 10 The Redskins ran a zone iso strong. I've wondered several times this year why the Bucs line up with a 3-4 look a few times a game. It hasn't really hurt them most of the year but I can't remember it ever being some huge help either.

Well this time, it hurt. The Bucs tried a cross blitz with Ruud running up in the A gap and Geno Hayes crossing behind him to the B gap. Unfortunately the guard was waiting on Geno and grabbed him and kept him from getting over the top. Up front Gerald McCoy was lined up in a 5 technique outside of the offensive tackle but on the snap he went inside to try to make a play. Instead he missed the tackle and gave up the C gap between the offensive tackle and the tight end.

Now Quincy Black was on the line outside of the tight end but he isn't a true 3-4 linebacker obviously so he got pushed off the line and wasn't able to squeeze the hole at all. At that point there is nobody on the second level to tackle the running back and there are blockers in front of him damn near like a screen.

End result, 23 yard gain.

5:29 1st and 10 Redskins run that Saints play again. This time the defensive line does a decent job. McCoy gets enough penetration to get a hand on the running back but can't bring him down with the offensive tackle still hanging on his back. Crowder did a good job of playing the kick out block which was a cut block and makes the ball bounce a gap wider. Unfortunately Ruud is doubled by the WR and offensive guard and Black is being blocked to the outside by the slot WR. That creates another natural lane and the running back finds it for another 10 yards.



2:22 1st and 10 The Skins run a zone cutback. Michael Bennett at left end decides not to try to get under the kickout block and instead go for the tackle on the running back. Unfortunately he missed and allowed the running back to continue basically going north and south instead of having to cut behind him. That was really unfortunate because this time the Bucs played a defense where Strong Safety Sean Jones was in the box to Bennett's side and was a free hitter to make the play if it has to bounce. Instead the free hitter was wasted and the running back gained 12 more yards.

2nd Quarter

13:53 3rd and 5 Redskins run a zone cutback with the tight end coming across the formation to kick out the end man on the line. Because its 3rd down the Bucs have their pass rushing group up front in and they blitz. Everyone is in their gap for the most part but Geno gets held by the offensive tackle and can't come off the block to tackle the running back coming straight through his gap. It was a pretty obvious hold to me but I'm not making any excuses.

What killed me about this play though was that Corey Lynch flew up into the box on the snap but instead of going for the running back he basically just ran blindly into the pile. He was a free hitter who could have, in theory at least, stopped the running back short of the 1st down marker. Instead there was nobody home and the Skins picked up another 8 yards and the 1st.

13:13 1st and 10 They ran the Saints play yet again. This time Alex Magee is at defensive end and he doesn't get under the kick out block. Also Jones comes flying in trying to get a knock out blow on the running back and instead misses the tackle. Instead of a gain of maybe 5 yards or so, it becomes a gain of 12 yards and another 1st down.

2:17 1st and 10 This was just a simple zone play. I'm sure the Bucs were in 2 minute mode though and they had Magee in at nose tackle I presume for pass rush. Well just like Miller, Magee got reached and the ball ran right into his A gap. Ruud had to give a little ground to play the cut block but he maybe could have been a little faster over the top but not by much. Everyone else pretty much played it correctly but one guy getting reached was the catalyst for a 20 yard run.

So lets do the math.

54
12
23
10
12
8
12
+20
131

7 runs for 131 yards. Not a good look at all but mostly fixable. Not sure about that Saints play though.

Injuries

I would be remiss if I didn't acknowledge all the injuries the Bucs have been hit with of late. It sucks when you lose 6 starters in 3 weeks. It hurts doubly when you are the youngest team in the league. And yet the Bucs still are finding ways if not to win, to at least stay in pretty much every game.

And I'll be honest with you, my biggest complaint and concern heading into the season was what I thought was a lack of quality depth behind most of the starters. I am officially eating my words now.

I'm not saying every guy that has gone from the bench to starting or contributing has been a world beater, but at the least they have been good enough to keep the train rolling. If there is one reason in my mind that most personifies why I think Coach Morris should be up for coach of the year in the NFL, its how he has been able to keep this team together and playing well in the face of all of losing so many key people. I may not agree with every decision or every scheme, but you would have to be a blind man not to see the phenomenal job he has done with, and I don't mean this as a knock, somewhat average talent in a lot of spots.

The one thing I do worry about though is how some of these players will come back next year off their injuries. For the Bucs to take the next step guys like McCoy and Brian Price etc will have to take big leaps forward next year and that's hard to do without having a full season of game experience and also trying to just get your body back to 100%. But I'm hopeful that they will dedicate themselves to their rehab and come back ready to roll by training camp.

- One thing about injuries is that it gives other guys opportunities as I kind of alluded to before. One such situation is Bennett potentially being the undertackle the rest of the season. Coach Morris was kind of coy about who would be at that spot today in his press conference but as I look at the roster I don't really see anybody else that fits the position.

Roy Miller CAN play undertackle but at this point he is more off a bulky run stopping guy than a pass rusher. And make no mistake, an undertackle has to be an up the field disruptive pass rusher in addition to being a terror against the run. Al Woods seems like more of a nose now too. And although I don't know a lot about Frank Okam, 330 pounds doesn't exactly sound fast and agile.

Could be wrong though.

The only other guy that I think might be a good match for the position is Magee. He played a little inside in the second half and when he wasn't at nose he looked decent. He has some pretty good pass rush awareness about him too.

But having said that I still think Bennett is the best option for now. I don't think it will be a long term place for him, but this is a chance for him to become a huge factor on the defense. I'm sure teams will run right at him and test his ability to play a double team or a slip block and that's fine, as long as he plays with reckless abandon I don't think it will matter.

But that's just it though, he NEEDS to play with reckless abandon. Its pretty obvious by now that I'm a big fan of who I think Bennett COULD be. He has every tool you could want in a defensive lineman. But its also obvious to me that he is still feeling his way through.

Last year and the beginning of this year Bennett's get off was so much better than everybody else's on the defensive line that he put them all to shame every time the ball was snapped. But here recently his get off has been average at best. When he plays blocks the way he is supposed to he makes plays, explosive tackles, against anybody. But he still tries to free lance a little too much. On pass rush his speed and power should be giving offensive linemen fits. But instead he has started relying way too much on finesse moves and head fakes instead of just smoking a guy around the corner or going right under their chin.

Or hell a combination of both!

If I could get that kid in the lab for a week or two I guarantee you I'd turn him into a monster. Basically I'd just teach him to unleash the beast that he already has shown he has in him and he would end up destroying people.

But since I don't have that kind of contact with him let me write one piece of advice for him at the under tackle position in hopes that somehow some way he gets to see it.

When in doubt, haul ass!!!

One of the things that drove me crazy about McCoy here lately is that he started relying too heavily on inside moves. For one they rarely worked. For two he was basically running himself into a double team if the center had any awareness about him.

With the undertackle you want a guy that pierces the heart of the offensive line's pass protection. That means a guy who is getting upfield and making the quarterback move in the pocket. It doesn't always matter if the undertackle gets a hand on the quarterback or gets the sack. If he can get around the guard and make the quarterback feel him then more than likely he will give the other three defensive linemen an opportunity to get the sack or force the throw.

I've talked before about a natural game where the undertackle gets up field and the defensive end sees the quarterback stepping up and just falls back inside to make the sack. Well that will never happen if the undertackle is never trying to get around the corner on the guard. And so you end up with everyone just stuck on blocks and the only guy really having a legitimate shot at pressure being the backside end who could possibly have a one on one.

This is where Bennett can really shine though, especially against play action pass. If he can start back flying off the ball and getting up the field as an undertackle he will be able to help not only his fellow defensive lineman but the secondary tremendously.

And really, if he isn't hauling ass and using his speed and quickness which are his best assets, what's the use of having him in the game anyway?


- It appears that Mike Williams has caught a mild case of the butter fingers here lately. Thankfully fellow rookie Arrelious Benn has caught fire to take up the slack. Imagine what will happen if both of them start balling out. I asked a question on twitter Sunday and I didn't get a response but I'll ask it again here. Has there ever been too rookie wide receivers on the same team that were both as dynamic as Benn and Williams? I'm not engraving their names in Canton yet, but those two guys are explosive as hell, even though they aren't mirror images of each other. If they can stay healthy......DAMN!!!

- I expressed concerned about Derek Hardman starting at guard last week but I thought he played pretty damn well. I know some folks will blame him for the fumble on the goalline but it wasn't his fault. Either you don't call that play on the goalline, OR you don't have Josh Freeman reverse out for the handoff. One of the two. But aside from that play and another when he got knocked on his ass on a pass rush where Freeman got sacked, he held his own in there.

- Speaking of Freeman I thought he bounced back well from two "slump" games. He wasn't perfect but the biggest thing he did in my opinion was not turn the ball over (even though he came close a couple of times). And he still took his shots down the field and burned the Redskins with the big play a couple of times. His TD pass to K2 was one of the best throws he has made all year. Indefensible.

- Cadillac Williams made so many little plays in the game yesterday to help the Bucs win that its hard to point them all out. The one handed grab that moved them close enough for a field goal. The catch in the flat where he makes a move for the first down. He continues to be an asset and he has accepted his demotion with as much class as I think anyone could. I don't know what the future holds for him but I for one wouldn't mind seeing him continue here in the third down role he has carved out for himself.

- I have to give it up for Ronde Barber again. All he did was go out and make 10 total tackles by my count, get a pressure, a PBU and and hit on the quarterback. The old guy continues to be the glue that holds the Bucs young defense together.

Here are the defensive line breakdowns:

Tim Crowder: I had him with a tackle for loss, 1 other tackle, 2 assists a pressure and a pass broken up. Very good game for a guy that was questionable heading into Sunday with a bad shoulder.

Gerald McCoy: Only had him with 1 tackle before the injury. Thought he was getting good penetration though. He also tried another bull**CENSORED** spin which made my head start spinning.

Roy Miller: As mentioned before Roy had a rough start to the game but he got better as the day went on. I had him with 4 tackles and 2 assists and I have to point out that on Crowder's tackle for a loss it was Roy who PWNED the center and drove him back into the running back which made that play possible in the first place.

Now he just has to work on getting off to a better start.

Stylez G. White: I had Stylez with 1 tackle for loss, 2 other tackles and an assist. He didn't get the pressure we are used to seeing from him per se, but I will say I was encouraged to see him working a lot more inside moves. He needs some help from the rest of his line mates though.

Mike Bennett: He wasn't always perfect but he made some nice plays. 3 tackles an assist and a pressure by my count. That one tackle he made down at the goalline was just ferocious. Hoping to see more consistency out of him in these last three games though.

Al Woods: I thought Woods played well at nose tackle. I had him with 1 tackle and two assists. He seemed to play the center reach block as well as anybody on Sunday.

Alex Magee: Magee continues to show flashes that intrigue me. He only had one assist by my count but I saw him make some pretty nice pass rush moves. In particular he had a nice hands move when rushing inside and he had a good long arm when rushing at defensive end. He, like Bennett, has to be more on the details but I'm hoping to get to see more of him the next few weeks to see how he progresses.

Well my eyes are glazing over so that's all for now.

watson

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#1 : December 14, 2010, 02:03:55 PM

Great read and analysis.  What I find interesting  is how he disproves that the problem against the run on Sunday was Barrett Ruud, but was due to others not doing their jobs or the Redskins scheming to take him out of the play.  BR is not in the mold of some MLBs in the NFL, but he is not the problem that many seem to think he is.

Truths:
1.  Never have an argument with an idiot.  They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with their experience.
2.  For some it would be better if they remained silent and be thought a fool than to speak and erase all doubt.

barbernbrooks

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#2 : December 14, 2010, 02:12:53 PM

actually, he blamed ruud for a number of plays....face it, he's terrible.

CyberDilemma

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#3 : December 14, 2010, 02:16:22 PM

  BR is not in the mold of some MLBs in the NFL, but he is not the problem that many seem to think he is.


True....he may not be the problem but he has also proven to not be the solution. He just kind of exists. He is the general on the defense, so he should be commended for that; however, the Bucs' roots go all the way back to the old NFC Central "Black and Blue" Division where many of the MLB's were the difference makers in the games. Ruud just isn't a big difference maker.

watson

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#4 : December 14, 2010, 03:51:57 PM

actually, he blamed ruud for a number of plays....face it, he's terrible.
You must be reading something I can't see.  Here is the only one where he puts the blame on Ruud:

2:17 1st and 10 This was just a simple zone play. I'm sure the Bucs were in 2 minute mode though and they had Magee in at nose tackle I presume for pass rush. Well just like Miller, Magee got reached and the ball ran right into his A gap. Ruud had to give a little ground to play the cut block but he maybe could have been a little faster over the top but not by much. Everyone else pretty much played it correctly but one guy getting reached was the catalyst for a 20 yard run.

There are a couple of others where he talks about the scheme from the Redskins double teaming him and there's not much any LB can do to overcome that. 

If there are other points where he blames Ruud, please tell what they are.


Truths:
1.  Never have an argument with an idiot.  They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with their experience.
2.  For some it would be better if they remained silent and be thought a fool than to speak and erase all doubt.

watson

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#5 : December 14, 2010, 03:54:38 PM

  BR is not in the mold of some MLBs in the NFL, but he is not the problem that many seem to think he is.


True....he may not be the problem but he has also proven to not be the solution. He just kind of exists. He is the general on the defense, so he should be commended for that; however, the Bucs' roots go all the way back to the old NFC Central "Black and Blue" Division where many of the MLB's were the difference makers in the games. Ruud just isn't a big difference maker.
Shelton Quarles was a difference maker?  He was a good MLB, but he and Ruud are pretty much the same player....IMO.  And Jamie Duncan was not much different.

Truths:
1.  Never have an argument with an idiot.  They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with their experience.
2.  For some it would be better if they remained silent and be thought a fool than to speak and erase all doubt.

CyberDilemma

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#6 : December 14, 2010, 04:00:24 PM

  BR is not in the mold of some MLBs in the NFL, but he is not the problem that many seem to think he is.


True....he may not be the problem but he has also proven to not be the solution. He just kind of exists. He is the general on the defense, so he should be commended for that; however, the Bucs' roots go all the way back to the old NFC Central "Black and Blue" Division where many of the MLB's were the difference makers in the games. Ruud just isn't a big difference maker.
Shelton Quarles was a difference maker?  He was a good MLB, but he and Ruud are pretty much the same player....IMO.  And Jamie Duncan was not much different.


If I recall, Quarles made a Pro Bowl. How many does Ruud have on his resume?

sandogbuc

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#7 : December 14, 2010, 04:26:47 PM

  BR is not in the mold of some MLBs in the NFL, but he is not the problem that many seem to think he is.


True....he may not be the problem but he has also proven to not be the solution. He just kind of exists. He is the general on the defense, so he should be commended for that; however, the Bucs' roots go all the way back to the old NFC Central "Black and Blue" Division where many of the MLB's were the difference makers in the games. Ruud just isn't a big difference maker.
Shelton Quarles was a difference maker?  He was a good MLB, but he and Ruud are pretty much the same player....IMO.  And Jamie Duncan was not much different.

your kidding right? Quarles in his prime was the ideal MLB in the Tampa 2 scheme. He filled his gap and laid hats to opposing RB's and was athletic enough to drop back in coverage in the middle of the field. Ruud is excellent at coverage but flat our sucks at filling his gap and making tackles at the LOS aka he is afraid of contact at the point of attack.

Quarles may not be Hardy Nickerson but to compare him to Ruud and Duncan is laughable

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#8 : December 14, 2010, 05:24:38 PM

Put Mr. Derrick Brooks in his prime at Ruud's side, and he'd look a whole lot more like a pro-bowler as well.  I'm not saying that Ruud isn't completely replaceable, or that he is worth a big contract, but I don't think the comparison to Quarles (who was a long, long way from being a thumper) is really all that far off the mark. 
: December 14, 2010, 05:26:55 PM acacius

watson

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#9 : December 14, 2010, 05:51:27 PM

  BR is not in the mold of some MLBs in the NFL, but he is not the problem that many seem to think he is.


True....he may not be the problem but he has also proven to not be the solution. He just kind of exists. He is the general on the defense, so he should be commended for that; however, the Bucs' roots go all the way back to the old NFC Central "Black and Blue" Division where many of the MLB's were the difference makers in the games. Ruud just isn't a big difference maker.
Shelton Quarles was a difference maker?  He was a good MLB, but he and Ruud are pretty much the same player....IMO.  And Jamie Duncan was not much different.


If I recall, Quarles made a Pro Bowl. How many does Ruud have on his resume?
You are right, SQ did make the Pro Bowl....but so did Davin Joseph and many on here are saying he is not that good.  Sorry but IMO is there is not much difference between them.

Truths:
1.  Never have an argument with an idiot.  They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with their experience.
2.  For some it would be better if they remained silent and be thought a fool than to speak and erase all doubt.

Detrimental

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#10 : December 14, 2010, 06:03:02 PM

  BR is not in the mold of some MLBs in the NFL, but he is not the problem that many seem to think he is.


True....he may not be the problem but he has also proven to not be the solution. He just kind of exists. He is the general on the defense, so he should be commended for that; however, the Bucs' roots go all the way back to the old NFC Central "Black and Blue" Division where many of the MLB's were the difference makers in the games. Ruud just isn't a big difference maker.
Shelton Quarles was a difference maker?  He was a good MLB, but he and Ruud are pretty much the same player....IMO.  And Jamie Duncan was not much different.


If I recall, Quarles made a Pro Bowl. How many does Ruud have on his resume?
You are right, SQ did make the Pro Bowl....but so did Davin Joseph and many on here are saying he is not that good.  Sorry but IMO is there is not much difference between them.
WTF is this a joke? Quarles > Ruud and its NOT even close. Quarles was much quicker, a better hitter, much better against the run and just as good as him in zone coverage. Quarles was never a liability against the run even when Sapp left. Ruud had 1 great year as a Buc, the others were mediocre.

Ruud sucks, stop making excuses. He will NOT be in Tampa next season and we TB fans will be gleeful.

michael89156

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#11 : December 14, 2010, 07:31:19 PM

In the Washington game I noticed a play where Ruud was just standing there with his back to the play. I guess he thought he could maybe get a block in the back call or something. 
Steve White is a big fan of Ruud IMO.  I asked him once if he thought Ruud was a little soft and he was very offended by the question.  So no surprise he does not rip him often.

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#12 : December 14, 2010, 08:47:57 PM

Steve White is a big fan of Ruud IMO.  I asked him once if he thought Ruud was a little soft and he was very offended by the question.  So no surprise he does not rip him often.

Yep.


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#13 : December 14, 2010, 11:17:30 PM

Steve White is a big fan of Ruud IMO.  I asked him once if he thought Ruud was a little soft and he was very offended by the question.  So no surprise he does not rip him often.

Yep.

I believe Steve wanted us to draft Rolando McClain this year. I don't think he's in love with Ruud....he just casts blame where it actually belongs. Ruud just happens to usually be doing what he's supposed to be doing, especially compared to the other guys on the team. So he doesn't get bashed by knowledgeable people.

watson

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#14 : December 15, 2010, 08:34:52 AM


[/quote]You are right, SQ did make the Pro Bowl....but so did Davin Joseph and many on here are saying he is not that good.  Sorry but IMO is there is not much difference between them.
[/quote]WTF is this a joke? Quarles > Ruud and its NOT even close. Quarles was much quicker, a better hitter, much better against the run and just as good as him in zone coverage. Quarles was never a liability against the run even when Sapp left. Ruud had 1 great year as a Buc, the others were mediocre.

Ruud sucks, stop making excuses. He will NOT be in Tampa next season and we TB fans will be gleeful.
[/quote]That is your opinion and you are entitled to it.  I see it differently and that is OK too.  Again, as I said at the beginning of this topic, it was/is interesting to see that Steve White....who played in this defense and knows who has what gap and responsibility....didn't see the problem with the run defense last week as being caused by Ruud.  I tend to put more credence in the opinions of someone that has played at that level.

Truths:
1.  Never have an argument with an idiot.  They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with their experience.
2.  For some it would be better if they remained silent and be thought a fool than to speak and erase all doubt.
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