Iowa wrestling standout refuses to face girl

[Col. Klink]

And this is why Godwin's Law exists.  When Nazis/Hitler are brought up, everybody loses and the original debate ends.

The original debate got sidetracked with these:





And nobody lost ...

[spartan]

You also, then, need to explain to us third graders how your comment shouldn't be taken literally but Spartan's Nazi reference should be ...

Must confess to quietly waiting for a response on this one!

[Durango 95]

This young man's parents are teaching their son that when adversity comes along he should pack up his stuff and head for the door. The kid made a commitment to his team & his school and if he can't keep his word he has no place on the team. Either he wants to wrestle or he doesn't. He is taking up a slot on the team that could otherwise be occupied by someone that is willing to give 100%.  Just because he doesn't feel philosophically comfortable w/ something that does not give him the right to forgo his obligation.

The kid quit, which makes him a quitter. What if a woman broke into his family's home and brandished a gun? Do you really think he would have the luxury of pampering himself w/ the complexity of his religious morality? No. He would defend his home. 

Maybe, it's not that complicated and it just boils down to the kid and his family not being able to handle the thought of losing to a girl?

Either way he quit. Which makes him a quitter.

You better hope you don't find yourself next to this kid in a foxhole someday.

Now that one is dumb.  A swing that hits nothing but air.  The young man is using the standards his parents taught him - and quite well I would offer.

It is pretty easy to differentiate high school wrestling from a life or death situation with an armed individual.  Just would add that one in.  As for being in a foxhole with a person of values - yea, I am good with that.

Yet another one that can't seem to divine between a commonly used term /expression.(not finding oneself in a fox hole etc. ) indicating a lack of trust or reliability and the literal meaning of the term. Never thought I would have to explain that one to you. Sometimes its like talking to classroom full of third graders around here. Now lets get back to the heart of that matter, besides (yawn) standing up for oneself do you have any real take on this thing or are you happy to put standing up for oneself above all else or is that about the totality of your argument?

You also, then, need to explain to us third graders how your comment shouldn't be taken literally but Spartan's Nazi reference should be ...

Oh this is classic. You want me to explain to you why you believe what you believe. In other words you are asking me to validate the premise of your argument. Since I agree w/ neither that would be ridiculous.

[spartan]

Oh this is classic. You want me to explain to you why you believe what you believe. In other words you are asking me to validate the premise of your argument. Since I agree w/ neither that would be ridiculous.

Speaking of which, this looks like a classic "avoid the question by throwing it back in your face.'  You a politician by chance?

[dbucfan]

This young man's parents are teaching their son that when adversity comes along he should pack up his stuff and head for the door. The kid made a commitment to his team & his school and if he can't keep his word he has no place on the team. Either he wants to wrestle or he doesn't. He is taking up a slot on the team that could otherwise be occupied by someone that is willing to give 100%.  Just because he doesn't feel philosophically comfortable w/ something that does not give him the right to forgo his obligation.

The kid quit, which makes him a quitter. What if a woman broke into his family's home and brandished a gun? Do you really think he would have the luxury of pampering himself w/ the complexity of his religious morality? No. He would defend his home. 

Maybe, it's not that complicated and it just boils down to the kid and his family not being able to handle the thought of losing to a girl?

Either way he quit. Which makes him a quitter.

You better hope you don't find yourself next to this kid in a foxhole someday.

Now that one is dumb.  A swing that hits nothing but air.  The young man is using the standards his parents taught him - and quite well I would offer.

It is pretty easy to differentiate high school wrestling from a life or death situation with an armed individual.  Just would add that one in.  As for being in a foxhole with a person of values - yea, I am good with that.

Yet another one that can't seem to divine between a commonly used term /expression.(not finding oneself in a fox hole etc. ) indicating a lack of trust or reliability and the literal meaning of the term. Never thought I would have to explain that one to you. Sometimes its like talking to classroom full of third graders around here. Now lets get back to the heart of that matter, besides (yawn) standing up for oneself do you have any real take on this thing or are you happy to put standing up for oneself above all else or is that about the totality of your argument?

One of us knows the implication of 'not finding oneself in a fox hole', here's a hint - it isn't me.  The young man's head is on straight, perhaps your review of the term values and upbringing would help. 

I have no issue with the young man opting not to violate the way he was brought up and being consistent with his values and beliefs, just as I have no issue with others raised with differing values and beliefs opting to wrestle the young woman.  While I don't agree with the later - it is truly their choice.  As it is election of the young man who opted not to change when confronted with something he sees as wrongful. 

[Durango 95]

Oh this is classic. You want me to explain to you why you believe what you believe. In other words you are asking me to validate the premise of your argument. Since I agree w/ neither that would be ridiculous.

Speaking of which, this looks like a classic "avoid the question by throwing it back in your face.'  You a politician by chance?

Spartan- Why are you pressing this? I thought I made it clear to you that I agreed you were not calling anyone a Nazi and you expressed appreciation of that at the time and wanted to stop discussing it. Now you have a change of heart and want to talk about it again? Let me spell it out then, I am not going to respond to this Nazi crap again and again. Just keep it on subject. My "Foxhole is commonly used and as such not stated in a literal sense. In addition, the Nazi thing which you brought up is not something I took literally either. Now if you would like to press the issue then I challenge you to go back and show me where I stated anything at all to indicate I took your Nazi reference literally. A couple of days ago you wanted to drop the Nazi thing and seemed appreciative that I understood now you want to go back to that? Look, here's the only reference I made (post#55) regarding your Nazi thing.

"I generally find that when one throws out the Nazi card they have nothing logical to say in rebuttal and are relying on emotion to carry the debate for them. So isn't this the part where I am supposed to say, your surrender has been noted."

Now the foxhole isn't meant literally and I do not/did not/ will not take your Nazi reference literally either. Seriously how much plainer can I make that? As I have stated to you before I appreciate the fact you keep your posts on an intellectual level w/o going into personal attacks etc. But, man, at this point you are be coming hard work.

Comprenede?

[spartan]

One of us knows the implication of 'not finding oneself in a fox hole', here's a hint - it isn't me.  The young man's head is on straight, perhaps your review of the term values and upbringing would help. 

I have no issue with the young man opting not to violate the way he was brought up and being consistent with his values and beliefs, just as I have no issue with others raised with differing values and beliefs opting to wrestle the young woman.  While I don't agree with the later - it is truly their choice.  As it is election of the young man who opted not to change when confronted with something he sees as wrongful.

7 pages of back and forth and we are back at page 1.

[dbucfan]

One of us knows the implication of 'not finding oneself in a fox hole', here's a hint - it isn't me.  The young man's head is on straight, perhaps your review of the term values and upbringing would help. 

I have no issue with the young man opting not to violate the way he was brought up and being consistent with his values and beliefs, just as I have no issue with others raised with differing values and beliefs opting to wrestle the young woman.  While I don't agree with the later - it is truly their choice.  As it is election of the young man who opted not to change when confronted with something he sees as wrongful.

7 pages of back and forth and we are back at page 1.

Yep - when you have it right at the onset the continued turning of the terms to create argument is without need.  But some feel the need.... lol

[spartan]

Oh this is classic. You want me to explain to you why you believe what you believe. In other words you are asking me to validate the premise of your argument. Since I agree w/ neither that would be ridiculous.

Speaking of which, this looks like a classic "avoid the question by throwing it back in your face.'  You a politician by chance?

Spartan- Why are you pressing this? I thought I made it clear to you that I agreed you were not calling anyone a Nazi and you expressed appreciation of that at the time and wanted to stop discussing it. Now you have a change of heart and want to talk about it again? Let me spell it out then, I am not going to respond to this Nazi crap again and again. Just keep it on subject. My "Foxhole is commonly used and as such not stated in a literal sense. In addition, the Nazi thing which you brought up is not something I took literally either. Now if you would like to press the issue then I challenge you to go back and show me where I stated anything at all to indicate I took your Nazi reference literally. A couple of days ago you wanted to drop the Nazi thing and seemed appreciative that I understood now you want to go back to that? Look, here's the only reference I made (post#55) regarding your Nazi thing.

"I generally find that when one throws out the Nazi card they have nothing logical to say in rebuttal and are relying on emotion to carry the debate for them. So isn't this the part where I am supposed to say, your surrender has been noted."

Now the foxhole isn't meant literally and I do not/did not/ will not take your Nazi reference literally either. Seriously how much plainer can I make that? As I have stated to you before I appreciate the fact you keep your posts on an intellectual level w/o going into personal attacks etc. But, man, at this point you are be coming hard work.

Comprenede?

Yes, yes, I get it and will let it drop. Just having a bit of fun. Even I am not immune to a bit of chain yanking you know. Sorry if I upset you.

[Col. Klink]

Oh this is classic. You want me to explain to you why you believe what you believe. In other words you are asking me to validate the premise of your argument. Since I agree w/ neither that would be ridiculous.

Speaking of which, this looks like a classic "avoid the question by throwing it back in your face.'  You a politician by chance?

Spartan- Why are you pressing this? I thought I made it clear to you that I agreed you were not calling anyone a Nazi and you expressed appreciation of that at the time and wanted to stop discussing it. Now you have a change of heart and want to talk about it again? Let me spell it out then, I am not going to respond to this Nazi crap again and again. Just keep it on subject. My "Foxhole is commonly used and as such not stated in a literal sense. In addition, the Nazi thing which you brought up is not something I took literally either. Now if you would like to press the issue then I challenge you to go back and show me where I stated anything at all to indicate I took your Nazi reference literally. A couple of days ago you wanted to drop the Nazi thing and seemed appreciative that I understood now you want to go back to that? Look, here's the only reference I made (post#55) regarding your Nazi thing.

"I generally find that when one throws out the Nazi card they have nothing logical to say in rebuttal and are relying on emotion to carry the debate for them. So isn't this the part where I am supposed to say, your surrender has been noted."

Now the foxhole isn't meant literally and I do not/did not/ will not take your Nazi reference literally either. Seriously how much plainer can I make that? As I have stated to you before I appreciate the fact you keep your posts on an intellectual level w/o going into personal attacks etc. But, man, at this point you are be coming hard work.

Comprenede?

Yes, yes, I get it and will let it drop.

Quitter .... Don't expect to be sharing a foxhole with D95 anytime in the near future.


















Sorry ... too good to pass up.

[Durango 95]

Oh this is classic. You want me to explain to you why you believe what you believe. In other words you are asking me to validate the premise of your argument. Since I agree w/ neither that would be ridiculous.

Speaking of which, this looks like a classic "avoid the question by throwing it back in your face.'  You a politician by chance?

Spartan- Why are you pressing this? I thought I made it clear to you that I agreed you were not calling anyone a Nazi and you expressed appreciation of that at the time and wanted to stop discussing it. Now you have a change of heart and want to talk about it again? Let me spell it out then, I am not going to respond to this Nazi crap again and again. Just keep it on subject. My "Foxhole is commonly used and as such not stated in a literal sense. In addition, the Nazi thing which you brought up is not something I took literally either. Now if you would like to press the issue then I challenge you to go back and show me where I stated anything at all to indicate I took your Nazi reference literally. A couple of days ago you wanted to drop the Nazi thing and seemed appreciative that I understood now you want to go back to that? Look, here's the only reference I made (post#55) regarding your Nazi thing.

"I generally find that when one throws out the Nazi card they have nothing logical to say in rebuttal and are relying on emotion to carry the debate for them. So isn't this the part where I am supposed to say, your surrender has been noted."

Now the foxhole isn't meant literally and I do not/did not/ will not take your Nazi reference literally either. Seriously how much plainer can I make that? As I have stated to you before I appreciate the fact you keep your posts on an intellectual level w/o going into personal attacks etc. But, man, at this point you are be coming hard work.

Comprenede?

Yes, yes, I get it and will let it drop.

Quitter .... Don't expect to be sharing a foxhole with D95 anytime in the near future.


















Sorry ... too good to pass up.

Ha! Now THAT was funny! Touche Klink...btw...Hogans Heros kicked butt back in the day!!

[Durango 95]

Oh this is classic. You want me to explain to you why you believe what you believe. In other words you are asking me to validate the premise of your argument. Since I agree w/ neither that would be ridiculous.

Speaking of which, this looks like a classic "avoid the question by throwing it back in your face.'  You a politician by chance?

Spartan- Why are you pressing this? I thought I made it clear to you that I agreed you were not calling anyone a Nazi and you expressed appreciation of that at the time and wanted to stop discussing it. Now you have a change of heart and want to talk about it again? Let me spell it out then, I am not going to respond to this Nazi crap again and again. Just keep it on subject. My "Foxhole is commonly used and as such not stated in a literal sense. In addition, the Nazi thing which you brought up is not something I took literally either. Now if you would like to press the issue then I challenge you to go back and show me where I stated anything at all to indicate I took your Nazi reference literally. A couple of days ago you wanted to drop the Nazi thing and seemed appreciative that I understood now you want to go back to that? Look, here's the only reference I made (post#55) regarding your Nazi thing.

"I generally find that when one throws out the Nazi card they have nothing logical to say in rebuttal and are relying on emotion to carry the debate for them. So isn't this the part where I am supposed to say, your surrender has been noted."

Now the foxhole isn't meant literally and I do not/did not/ will not take your Nazi reference literally either. Seriously how much plainer can I make that? As I have stated to you before I appreciate the fact you keep your posts on an intellectual level w/o going into personal attacks etc. But, man, at this point you are be coming hard work.

Comprenede?

Yes, yes, I get it and will let it drop. Just having a bit of fun. Even I am not immune to a bit of chain yanking you know. Sorry if I upset you.

All good Spartan. I didn't pick up on the humor  probably because i am the only man defending my POV. At this risk of being misinterpreted I guess you could say I am feeling a bit shell-shocked. Not literally though 

[spartan]

The problem with MB's as so many have pointed out in the past, is that they do not always convey the intent of a comment.

What separates those who want and enjoy a good conversation, regardless of the differences involved, from those who simply want to brow beat and win, is the ability to recognize when things either get out of hand or misinterpreted, is not only the willingness to ask for clarification but also to simply the realization you just need to walk away sometimes. When you have 2 parties who understand that, it might not achieve a meeting of minds, but it does not (usually) result in unnecessary animosity. I think in that respect you and I are a like mind.

I am not perfect in that respect and can be as guilty as the next person of being an Internet Warior, but I try and do think I can recognize being pulled up (for the most part).