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Boid Fink

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« #30 : May 11, 2011, 12:39:55 AM »

I think the more pertinent answer should be can they if he is acquitted of defense's accusation?  If he did not commit any crime, he cannot be disciplined.  And it was his sister he was going to, not one of his buddies.  So what can Goodell do at that point?

NOTHING.



Not true B

It's about putting yourself in bad situations, even if your not exactly breaking the law.  I think Pacman for instance, never broke the law per se, but put himself in bad situations over and over again.  He still got suspended, several times IIRC.  So bottom line, you dont need a conviction to get suspended.
He was suspended based on multiple investigations. MANY investigations.  And he should have been suspended roughly 11 times based on what you said.  But you can only suspend based on what can be proven.  So each time he did something stupid, even in the most minute of fashions, they rolled him.  Pacman was a fool for many reasons. He still is, IMO.  But if just being in unsavory situations is enough, Pac would have NEVER had a chance to be on a roster.  And I mean EVER.  The NFLPA will defend Talib to the utmost.  It is their obligation to.  And if cleared of charges, he will not get suspended without a huge "fight".  I think Talib is an immature, reckless individual.  I do not think he should have did what he did, but he did go to his SISTERS defense.  That is forgiveable.  Pulling the trig is not.  But so far, nobody can honestly say that he did.  There is very little evidence.  If Talib is cleared, he is not in a nightclub.  He is with his sister in the early part of the day.  He is defending her from abuse by a convicted child molester.  There is a lockout.  It will be tough for Goodell to suspend him...and will be tougher for him to lose any pay as a result of doing NOTHING but being innocent, if he is indeed "innocent".  Not a fan of his stupidity.  And make no mistake, Talib is stupid.  Not a genius, but he can run well, he has long arms, and he can cover a pigskin in an entertainment business that makes him big money.  He is not a good man however.  Based on what we know, he is not a zen master.  Too much pride, too much stupid.  Too much thug.  But if he is cleared, and charges are dropped....


Then what?

How do you susepnd an innocent man who is defending his sister?  You cannot.

This is Pacman.

• Strip club incident
Where: Atlanta
When: April 2005
What: Jones' name appeared on the police incident report after a fight broke out in a strip club. The female involved said she had no plans to pursue the case and it was dismissed.

• Hotel incident
Where: Nashville
When: June 2005
What: Security officials at Regal Maxwell House Hotel had trouble getting two of Jones' friends to clear their room after checkout time. Police arrived, smelled marijuana and found some on a tabletop. Jones was in the room, but one of his friends took full responsibility for the evidence.

• Nightclub arrest
Where: Nashville
When: July 2005
What:Jones was arrested on two counts of misdemeanor assault and a felony count of vandalism after a fight at a Nashville nightclub. Charges were dismissed less than a year later.


• Vehicle confiscation
Where: Nashville
When: April 2006
What: Metro Police said a vehicle registered to Jones was involved in a drug trafficking ring. "Pac Man" was embroidered on the leather seats of a 2004 Cadillac XLR which was confiscated from a friend of Jones. Jones later bought the car back at an auction.
• Shots fired
Where: Nashville
When: April 2006
What: Jones was at the scene where gunshots were fired following an altercation at a Nashville gas station at 1:50 a.m. Police questioned Jones but labeled him only as a witness. The incident occurred just three days after the vehicle confiscation.

• Nightclub arrest
Where: Murfreesboro, Tenn. When: Aug. 2006
What: Jones was arrested and charged with public drunkenness and disorderly conduct, both misdemeanors, for an incident at Sweetwater Saloon. With six months of good behavior the charges will be dropped, a judge ruled last month.

• Spitting incident
Where: Nashville
When: October 2006
What: Jones was issued a citation for misdemeanor assault after being accused of spitting in the face of a Tennessee State student following a verbal exchange at a downtown nightclub. The charge was dismissed in general sessions court earlier this month.

• Nightclub fracas
Where: Las Vegas
When: February 2007
What: Jones took a plea deal to reduce felony charges to a gross misdemeanor in connection with his involvement in a nightclub disturbance. He got probation in return for his testimony about an ensuing triple shooting that left one man paralyzed.

• Hotel scuffle
Where: Dallas
When: October 2008
What: Jones was involved in an alcohol-related incident with a bodyguard assigned to him by the Cowboys, and hotel employees called police. No arrests were made, nor were there charges filed. But the NFL suspended Jones for at least four games because the incident was a violation of the league's personal conduct policy.


-- ESPN.com news services


Big difference.


The Anti-Java

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« #31 : May 11, 2011, 12:50:45 AM »

Good stuff B.

But my point is Talib is building a pretty nice resume of his own, while not as extensive as Pacman's its still pretty disturbing. While you may be right and he walks from the latest incident unscathed,  its the pattern of bad behavior that Goodell will be looking at.


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PewterReportMC....
\\\\\\\"Java, do you understand this a perfect example of why people beg me to suspend or ban you on a daily basis? Are you actually trying to make a point? Seriously what is the reason for even commenting. In fact why do you even bother coming to the boards? What happened to the intelligent poster from years ago?  A real shame. Like the Bucs yesterday, a wasted effort.\\\\\\\"

Bayside4Life

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« #32 : May 11, 2011, 12:54:23 AM »

I think the more pertinent answer should be can they if he is acquitted of defense's accusation?  If he did not commit any crime, he cannot be disciplined.  And it was his sister he was going to, not one of his buddies.  So what can Goodell do at that point?

NOTHING.



Not true B

It's about putting yourself in bad situations, even if your not exactly breaking the law.  I think Pacman for instance, never broke the law per se, but put himself in bad situations over and over again.  He still got suspended, several times IIRC.  So bottom line, you dont need a conviction to get suspended.

Yeah, you don't need a conviction.  The personal conduct policy prohibits "conduct detrimental to the integrity of and public confidence in the National Football League."  Obviously the Commissioner has interpreted that broadly, i.e. not limiting it to only conduct that has some connection with the league.  Anyway, there have been numerous suspensions s where no conviction occurred, the most recent to come to mind is Roethlisburger. 

Benchwarmer#1

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« #33 : May 11, 2011, 02:40:21 AM »

From what I read, Goodell said anything that was done outside the lockout WILL be enforced after. Like there was no lockout essentially.

I think he may actually have that power, as the players are still representing their respective team during the lockout. An seeing how they were players BEFORE the lockout (and not FA's or anything), they will once again be required to adhere to the rules the second it lets up.

Naismith was right about Revis. Everyone else is a dummy.

JDouble

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« #34 : May 11, 2011, 09:42:14 AM »

Goodell can say whatever he likes, if it's not covered in the new CBA he will be powerless to do anything about things that happened in the lockout.

As far as Talib being suspended if he gets off....I don't see how it can happen. He wasn't out at a club or drunk or putting himself in a bad situation. He was at his family home. If the charges are dropped then there is nothing to suspend him for.

If the charges aren't dropped then he is going to prison and his place on our roster becomes a mute point.


Bayside4Life

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« #35 : May 11, 2011, 09:59:06 AM »

Goodell can say whatever he likes, if it's not covered in the new CBA he will be powerless to do anything about things that happened in the lockout.

As far as Talib being suspended if he gets off....I don't see how it can happen. He wasn't out at a club or drunk or putting himself in a bad situation. He was at his family home. If the charges are dropped then there is nothing to suspend him for.

If the charges aren't dropped then he is going to prison and his place on our roster becomes a mute point.

I agree with all of this except for the idea that if the charges aren't dropped then he is going to prison.  I think it is very likely he could take a plea for a misdemeanor.  If not, he could be acquitted at trial.  If he gets probation, then I don't think his place on the roster is moot, the team will have a decision to make as to whether he should be kept.  And again, it will be interesting to see if Goodell actually tries to punish conduct that took place during the lockout. I doubt he will be able to/will choose to do so, regardless of what he said. 

blind melon

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« #36 : May 11, 2011, 10:08:19 AM »

I believe that Goodell's impetus to be the Warden will be curtailed in some manner due to the lockout, lack of a CBA and etc.

It's pretty murky trying to enforce a personal conduct policy when a CBA is not in place...   Frankly - I believe Talib's Lawyers would eat this as a snack...

Who knew how good it would feel as a fan when we now know what it\'s like for our team to have a direction, an attitude, and dare I say an offense?.  

Good time to be a Bucs fan.

blind melon

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« #37 : May 12, 2011, 01:48:50 PM »

It appears that Derrick Brooks sees it the same way...

JBF.com

Judge, Jury And Executioner”
May 12th, 2011

Joe despises lockout talk (Enough already. Just cut a deal.), but Bucs icon Derrick Brooks had a labor-related message yesterday of interest to Aqib Talib.

Brooks usually brings fresh insider knowledge on the NFL lockout during his Wednesday on-air visits with The Big Dog, Steve Duemig of WDAE-AM 620. Yesterday, Brooks talked about how the NFL discipline policy will be a major point during any eventual collective bargaining that would lead to a new labor agreement between owners and players. Brooks said Roger Goodell is “judge, jury and executioner right now,” making the point that altering Goodell’s role or power would be important.

So where might that leave Talib if he isn’t found guilty of the Texas felony charge pending against him?

As it stands now, Goodell could still slap Talib with a hearty suspension after reviewing the facts of the case. But that could change in Talib’s favor with a new labor agreement.

Time appears to be on Talib’s side — and on the Bucs’ side. If the unfounded claims, courtesy of the St. Pete Times, that Talib will be cut when the lockout is over are bogus, then if Talib gets a light suspension or no suspension under a new labor deal, he’s still got plenty of trade value and on-field value for the Bucs.


Who knew how good it would feel as a fan when we now know what it\'s like for our team to have a direction, an attitude, and dare I say an offense?.  

Good time to be a Bucs fan.
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