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BucsGuru

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#45 : August 08, 2011, 08:33:45 AM

I believe the point is missed entirely when we even attempt to reason with the established church.  Paul declared that WE are the church, not the buildings, the religion, the theology, etc.  It is quite obvious just by visiting this site how often scripture is quoted by educated men only to be twisted.  True revelation of the word comes only through the holy spirit.  The vein attempts by man, especially those of the world, to explain scripture has created the confused landscape of religious and non-religious people around the world.  The truth is this is not what Christ taught at all. 

If people agree or disagree, truth is always still truth....this is why it sets you free when you surrender to it.  If you are persecuted for your beliefs, then be of good cheer, so was Christ.  People today want everything to be about love, and if not, then you are hateful and bigoted.  I hate sin, for Christ hated sin.  there isn't but one way to define sin and it is clearly revealed through the spirit in the word.  What I have discovered has been found to be a mystery to many, especially those within the church.  It is that God still is in control, regardless of whether we like it or not.  He still is sovereign.

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#46 : August 08, 2011, 05:09:08 PM

I believe the point is missed entirely when we even attempt to reason with the established church.  Paul declared that WE are the church, not the buildings, the religion, the theology, etc.  It is quite obvious just by visiting this site how often scripture is quoted by educated men only to be twisted.  True revelation of the word comes only through the holy spirit.  The vein attempts by man, especially those of the world, to explain scripture has created the confused landscape of religious and non-religious people around the world.  The truth is this is not what Christ taught at all. 

If people agree or disagree, truth is always still truth....this is why it sets you free when you surrender to it.  If you are persecuted for your beliefs, then be of good cheer, so was Christ.  People today want everything to be about love, and if not, then you are hateful and bigoted.  I hate sin, for Christ hated sin.  there isn't but one way to define sin and it is clearly revealed through the spirit in the word.  What I have discovered has been found to be a mystery to many, especially those within the church.  It is that God still is in control, regardless of whether we like it or not.  He still is sovereign.
I shall ask for the passing of the offering while we sing when we all get to heaven....Very nicely said...OBD


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#47 : August 08, 2011, 05:24:32 PM

You are darned patient OBD.  I envy that trait.
I am in a learning phase...Reaching 50 makes you look at life a little differently...OBD


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#48 : August 08, 2011, 05:31:37 PM

LOL.....at OBD.  When I was called into the ministry, I just assumed I would go to seminary and become a professional pastor, which a large congregation and salary.  After all, I was successful in the business world, why not the church?  It was obvious from the start this would not be the case.  When I began to define just what the "church" was, It became clear to me that if I was going to serve God, I would go against the established church. 
My first church released me for bringing in different denominational pastors and black people, and now, I am at odds with "certain" members over the same thing at a different church!  We had two members who have revealed their hearts about their hate for black people.  Not too long ago they were involved in an altercation at the only local store in the small community where the church is and as a result, they ended up getting their butt beat by a black man and woman.  But, they also were arrested for starting the altercation, pulling a pistol on the black man, and knocking two of his teeth out.  These are the upstanding members of our church, professing to be Christians, not perfect, but Christians.  I got a police report, spoke with the black couple, and spoke with the members.  I apologized on behalf of my family and the church, but did not apologize on behalf of the two members involved.  I listened to the members side of the story and told them after the church leadership met, we would get back in touch with them.  I felt they owed the couple an apology for the altercation since they started it, but this was not my decision alone to make.  well at the next church meeting they found out I apologized to the black couple and asked that I be removed as the pastor.  Since then they have done nothing but cause continuous problems stemming from their pride in not wanting to apologize or deal with an internal problem.  This is a reflection of a pastor attempting to do the right thing in the modern church.
So many on this site think I walk around and hate homosexuals which is so far off base it is impossible to even begin to deal with.  Anyone who really knows me will be the first to tell you this is not the case at all.  I will always treat every person with respect, regardless of whether I agree with their choices in life or not; this is not even debatable.  What amazes me to this day is the number of people who go to church and confess to be Christians and nothing, and I mean NOTHING, is remotely Christ like at any other time of their lives?!  I encourage many people to stay away from churches and seek individuals in their life who they have seen live a life of truth in front of them.  It is sad the church has become what it is, but it is the truth.  Finding a true Christian today is more rare than anyone could possibly imagine.

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#49 : August 08, 2011, 07:35:48 PM

the Catholic Church - our debt to it???? lol

The single worst entity on the face of the earth and we owe it a debt of gratitutde? no thx
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

folks may wonder why I posted this. The reason is clear. Jesus said quite plainly "whoever is on the side of truth listens to my voice".
Now the Catholic Church knows exactly what the truth (they themselves have a library with many Christian artifacts, historical documents, and journals of exorcisms and etc etc) is but they choose to teach doctrine (rules from the mind of men) rather than the truth they verify. At the heart of the matter is they teach - lies.

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#50 : August 08, 2011, 08:03:18 PM

LOL.....at OBD.  When I was called into the ministry, I just assumed I would go to seminary and become a professional pastor, which a large congregation and salary.  After all, I was successful in the business world, why not the church?  It was obvious from the start this would not be the case.  When I began to define just what the "church" was, It became clear to me that if I was going to serve God, I would go against the established church. 
My first church released me for bringing in different denominational pastors and black people, and now, I am at odds with "certain" members over the same thing at a different church!  We had two members who have revealed their hearts about their hate for black people.  Not too long ago they were involved in an altercation at the only local store in the small community where the church is and as a result, they ended up getting their butt beat by a black man and woman.  But, they also were arrested for starting the altercation, pulling a pistol on the black man, and knocking two of his teeth out.  These are the upstanding members of our church, professing to be Christians, not perfect, but Christians.  I got a police report, spoke with the black couple, and spoke with the members.  I apologized on behalf of my family and the church, but did not apologize on behalf of the two members involved.  I listened to the members side of the story and told them after the church leadership met, we would get back in touch with them.  I felt they owed the couple an apology for the altercation since they started it, but this was not my decision alone to make.  well at the next church meeting they found out I apologized to the black couple and asked that I be removed as the pastor.  Since then they have done nothing but cause continuous problems stemming from their pride in not wanting to apologize or deal with an internal problem.  This is a reflection of a pastor attempting to do the right thing in the modern church.
So many on this site think I walk around and hate homosexuals which is so far off base it is impossible to even begin to deal with.  Anyone who really knows me will be the first to tell you this is not the case at all.  I will always treat every person with respect, regardless of whether I agree with their choices in life or not; this is not even debatable.  What amazes me to this day is the number of people who go to church and confess to be Christians and nothing, and I mean NOTHING, is remotely Christ like at any other time of their lives?!  I encourage many people to stay away from churches and seek individuals in their life who they have seen live a life of truth in front of them.  It is sad the church has become what it is, but it is the truth.  Finding a true Christian today is more rare than anyone could possibly imagine.
BG...Let me first to join you in saying this. It is a sin to hate anyone. To point out a sin makes us all judges. Take note One Truth you are no ones judge but to point where sin may lie is not evil either. We to some degree in the Spirit of the Lord can point out down falls. People take this as judging when it is done in a hateful or condeming tone. this is why I don't like blogs when it comes to the lord because some of us are not as eloquent to typing good speech like Chris a.k.a. hate because he is good just like Joe. Many of times I type in these blog boxes only to erase because I wouldn't be able to convey my thoughts as humble or in as humanitarian way as I would like. WE are supposed to be our brothers keeper only when he knows we are looking out for him. That being said our brother has to have some sort of trust in us which is only made by building a friendship with all people. Paul said I am all things to all men paraphrased of course.

1 Corinthians 9:19-23

King James Version (KJV)

 


 19For though I be free from all men, yet have I made myself servant unto all, that I might gain the more.

 20And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law;

 21To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law.

 22To the weak became I as weak, that I might gain the weak: I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some.

 23And this I do for the gospel's sake, that I might be partaker thereof with you.
All that being said I hate no person that I voice my opinion but like that my opinion is just that...MY OPINION...I see so many here and listen to sooo many when they spew malcontent because people don't line up with their views...So what...If they just respect all then they would have an easier life in seven things of life...Wisdom...Understanding...Knowledge...Might...Counsel...Fear of the Lord...The Spirit of the Lord. Even Jesus didn't condemn the woman at the well when he knew she had been married many times and if the Son of God didn't Condemn then who are we mere mortal men to condemn anyone. Thomas I leave you with this...


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#51 : August 08, 2011, 08:37:34 PM

Well said OBD.  This is why I haven't visited this site very often of late; too many people who just have outbursts when your opinion doesn't agree with theirs.  Honestly though, I have grown a lot from my many exchanges on this site.  It is foolish to believe we have the right to change anyone; for we do not.  However, I know in my heart by merely pointing at a sin and calling it a sin is far different than pointing at an individual and declaring his/her sin. 

I am looking forward to football and the fall.....it has been a hot summer!

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#52 : August 09, 2011, 08:54:34 AM

This reminds me of Job's situation when the 3 "wise" companions traveled days just to sit at Job's side and offer their advice on what God was doing.

OBD you do not speak for God - you  are serving up your own opinions on what you believe is best. Although I have no problem with that as a brother in Christ and a Christian warrior - I disgree with your opinions here.

God does not want to kill any sinner but rather that they would repent and stop doing what is bad in Jehovah's eyes ~ this is what He really wants. Jesus even knew Jehovah does not place anyone above His own laws - when being comforted by Peter about his future torturous death, Peter said "be kind to yourself lord, ...the people love you, you are going to be a great king!" Jesus thought for a second and replied "get behind me Satan because you think men's thoughts and not God's...of what benefit is it to gain the world and lose your soul"

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#53 : August 09, 2011, 08:58:43 AM

Many people want to have their ears tickled - sometimes the truth hurts. But if nobody speaks the truth how will anyone know it - that they may know it I will continue to speak it. And many will speak injurious things about me becuase of this but at least they will have been dutifully warned. The sinner that does not repent will die in their sins - and this death is permanent and final.

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#54 : August 09, 2011, 09:20:14 AM

One Truth, it is interesting you speak about Peter being rebuked; I used this passage in my sermon on Sunday.  I believe the truth is revealed through the holy spirit; and lived out among the world through our lives, not so much our words.  I may speak out on a subject like homosexuality only because it is unbelievable to ME that society sees it much differently than I believe God does; however, it is obvious it hurts my testimony on this site with some, perhaps not.  Many times I believe the same posters who argue about homosexuality will argue just about any subject for any reason.

The topic of my sermon was that an unbeliever cannot be corrected, but a true believer can.  When we tell an unbeliever he is going to hell for this or that, we are judging them, which is forbidden.  When we test the spirit of a confessing believer and call them to conviction, they respond and change their ways.  When Christ spoke out to the Pharisees about their wrong doing, the word said they plotted to kill them.  They were already condemned within for their actions against the church, and some could care less for their was never a love for God to begin with.  However, when Christ rebuked Peter, he did not go and find another Christ, he simply received the correction and eventually became the rock of the church.  I'm sure Peter didn't like being rebuked, but He accepted it.  We don't like when God rebukes us, but we must learn to accept it.  Again, a believer can be corrected, but an unbeliever cannot.  An unbeliever many times is already being condemned by Satan and the enemy; it does no good for the church to join in; nobody has to tell them they are sinning!  But a believer from time to time must be reminded they are still flesh and can fall victim to sin. 
Example:  Before I had a relationship with God, I was a smoker.  No Christian had to tell me I was doing my temple harm by smoking; the Surgeon General took care of that!  So did my napping wife, people I worked with, etc.  I already felt condemned inside about the situation.  I went to a church that condemned people for smoking, which only made the matter worse.  I eventually spoke with the pastor and told him I would like to quit smoking and he said to simply turn it over to God.  I did so, did not feel condemned about my habit, and God took smoking from me; that was well over 7 years ago.  Stating that something is sin can be taken as offensive by smokers, just like stating homosexuality is a sin can be taken offensive by homosexuals.  Perhaps this is the answer I have been seeking in my search to reach the homosexual community with the love of Christ.  What makes it different is that society at large also believes smoking is bad for you and condemns it, but homosexuality is lifted up by society as perfectly acceptable; thus my passion to post articles showing how so much information can be biased.  I am learning though it doesn't do much good to continue to do so......it seems to only hurt people even when it is not meant to. 

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#55 : August 09, 2011, 09:45:23 AM

OBD you do not speak for God - you  are serving up your own opinions on what you believe is best.

Got a mirror? Now would be a good time to take a look in it.

Illuminator is a good poster. He sticks to his guns and makes good points. Some don\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\'t like that.

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#56 : August 09, 2011, 09:06:32 PM

This reminds me of Job's situation when the 3 "wise" companions traveled days just to sit at Job's side and offer their advice on what God was doing.

OBD you do not speak for God - you  are serving up your own opinions on what you believe is best. Although I have no problem with that as a brother in Christ and a Christian warrior - I disgree with your opinions here.

God does not want to kill any sinner but rather that they would repent and stop doing what is bad in Jehovah's eyes ~ this is what He really wants. Jesus even knew Jehovah does not place anyone above His own laws - when being comforted by Peter about his future torturous death, Peter said "be kind to yourself lord, ...the people love you, you are going to be a great king!" Jesus thought for a second and replied "get behind me Satan because you think men's thoughts and not God's...of what benefit is it to gain the world and lose your soul"
Actually Thomas any words I speak about the Word of God are only to reprove man not to Judge him. You need to look at what I said...I never said I spoke for God...He doesn't need me or You for that matter. That is why he had the word written Called the Holy Bible. If I offended you I was not trying too. I think your young in the word and keep throwing the word out like a judge., You need to stop that type of behavior and move forward showing that your  a seasoned believer with the leading of the Spirit...OBD

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