Our OT's -- Not Good

[dalbuc]

Sort of piling on more of last week's news that we can't pass block we start to see the culprits on the line:

http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2011/06/13/2010-pass-blocking-efficiency-tackles/

Penn is 7th worst on the list at LOT and unshockingly Trueblood is 5th worst at ROT.  I would assume that Lee qualified (200 snaps is the line) for this analysis and he is mercifully not on the list of worst.

[bradentonian]

Andrew Whitworth was the 2nd best LOT, and he was drafted a half a round after we took Davin Joseph

[bradentonian]

Eric Winston was the 3rd best ROT, and he went several picks after we took Jeremy Trueblood

[blind melon]

and now the curveball...   

Was it coaching?

Will Pat Morris fix this?   

(muhahaha...)

[Feel Real Good]

and now the curveball...   

Was it coaching?

Will Pat Morris fix this?   

(muhahaha...)

Penn and Trueblood have been bad in pass protection with multiple coaches.

[JC5100]

What makes you guys think this website is right?

[Feel Real Good]

What makes you guys think this website is right?

Ignoring Bucs players, which rankings do you disagree with? Are Jake Long, Joe Thomas, and D'Brickashaw Ferguson not generally considered the three best left tackles in the NFL? Would Brandyn Dombrowski, Levi Brown, and Frank Omiyale not generally be considered among the worst?

[Biggs3535]

What makes you guys think this website is right?

Ignoring Bucs players, which rankings do you disagree with? Are Jake Long, Joe Thomas, and D'Brickashaw Ferguson not generally considered the three best left tackles in the NFL? Would Brandyn Dombrowski, Levi Brown, and Frank Omiyale not generally be considered among the worst?

Not only that, but they don't just hand out good grades to name-players.  Joe Thomas and Jordan Gross weren't as dominant as they normally are at the beginning of the season, and their grades reflected that at the time.  Both of those guys picked up their play considerably in the second half, and their grades reflected that.

[JC5100]

What makes you guys think this website is right?

Ignoring Bucs players, which rankings do you disagree with? Are Jake Long, Joe Thomas, and D'Brickashaw Ferguson not generally considered the three best left tackles in the NFL? Would Brandyn Dombrowski, Levi Brown, and Frank Omiyale not generally be considered among the worst?

Peters and McKinnie are way too high. They give up kill shots too frequently. And it's hard for me to ignore Bucs players when I've seen every snap they've played and then people use this site to constantly knock them.

I looked back and watched games to try to see what they were seeing and it looks like they assigned pressures to Penn when he setup deep in the pocket, engaged and stonewalled. So the DE or LB gets fairly close to the QB but he is never in danger, and he knows it and he's comfortable. But PFF sees the DE/LB 4-5 yards in the backfield and just writes it as pressure eventhough it should have been a plus for Penn. And when he completely destroys a guy, which he does often, he's not getting the proper reward.

That's why Joseph gets rated so lowly. He runs hot and cold. When he screws up it's obvious and it's easy to grade out. But when he wrecks someone he's not getting the credit for it.

The OL couldn't have played any better Week 1 2009 vs Dallas. 450 yards, 26 first downs, 0 sacks allowed vs a fierce pass rush and heavy footed QB, Cadillac and Ward combining for 6.4 ypc. Penn was literally throwing Ware around. Then you look at PFF and you see Penn and the OL overall with a negative rating.

You can have 10 different NFL coaches look at a player and you'll get 10 different opinions. That's part of the reason why there are draft busts, free agent busts and depth chart screw ups. So I don't understand why you guys accept one amateur opinion as gospel.

[bradentonian]

it looks like they assigned pressures to Penn when he setup deep in the pocket, engaged and stonewalled. So the DE or LB gets fairly close to the QB but he is never in danger, and he knows it

Unless he breaks his finger on their helmet

[Feel Real Good]

That's why Joseph gets rated so lowly. He runs hot and cold. When he screws up it's obvious and it's easy to grade out. But when he wrecks someone he's not getting the credit for it.

Ironic that you continually rip on Aqib Talib for just what you're praising Joseph and Penn for.

Chaz why do you keep saying Top 5 corner? Because he gets picks? DeAngelo Halls gets picks and he sucks. Talib gets beat way too often and he gets too much credit for "shutting down" WRs when most of the time it's the QB shutting down his own WR. Like when Fitzgerald beat him like a rented mule and Max Hall threw the ball in Section 113 Row D.

Ravens picked on Talib all game, but he caught an INT with his ankles so people thought he had a good game.

Talib needs to become a CB who doesn't get beat instead of a CB who gets beat and gets picks. More Revis and Asomugha and less DeAngelo Hall.

I'm more confident with Lewis as a #2 CB and Biggers as a #3 than I am with Talib as a #1 CB. He's developing into a more extreme version of DeAngelo Hall; all the skills in the world, makes great INTs but gets beat like a drum and has a TERRIBLE attitude. Best move Thomas Dimitroff has made was trading Hall.

DeAngelo Hall is a loud mouth who racks up picks too but lets WRs rip him up. That's what Talib is turning into.

[Biggs3535]

So we're back to the PFF conspiracy against the Bucs, huh?  Why are the Bucs OL graded differently by PFF than every other team in the NFL?  Did Donald Penn, Davin Joseph, Jeremy Trueblood, Jeff Faine and company gangbang their girls or something?

Maybe, just maybe your definition of "stonewalled" and "throwing around" don't match-up to what other people would consider those things.

And when he completely destroys a guy, which he does often, he's not getting the proper reward.

But when he wrecks someone he's not getting the credit for it. .

What makes you think they don't get rewarded for positive plays?

[JC5100]

That's why Joseph gets rated so lowly. He runs hot and cold. When he screws up it's obvious and it's easy to grade out. But when he wrecks someone he's not getting the credit for it.

Ironic that you continually rip on Aqib Talib for just what you're praising Joseph and Penn for.

Chaz why do you keep saying Top 5 corner? Because he gets picks? DeAngelo Halls gets picks and he sucks. Talib gets beat way too often and he gets too much credit for "shutting down" WRs when most of the time it's the QB shutting down his own WR. Like when Fitzgerald beat him like a rented mule and Max Hall threw the ball in Section 113 Row D.

Ravens picked on Talib all game, but he caught an INT with his ankles so people thought he had a good game.

Talib needs to become a CB who doesn't get beat instead of a CB who gets beat and gets picks. More Revis and Asomugha and less DeAngelo Hall.

I'm more confident with Lewis as a #2 CB and Biggers as a #3 than I am with Talib as a #1 CB. He's developing into a more extreme version of DeAngelo Hall; all the skills in the world, makes great INTs but gets beat like a drum and has a TERRIBLE attitude. Best move Thomas Dimitroff has made was trading Hall.

DeAngelo Hall is a loud mouth who racks up picks too but lets WRs rip him up. That's what Talib is turning into.

Giving up a long TDs is alot worse than giving up pressures. You really don't see the difference? Talib gave up TDs in 6 straight games, should have been 7 if McCoy didn't save him by forcing an errant throw. His INTs don't make up for all his big plays allowed. Penn and Joseph redeem themselves and then some.

[Feel Real Good]

Giving up a long TDs is alot worse than giving up pressures.

How long do you think Freeman is going to be able to keep this up?

[Biggs3535]

His INTs don't make up for all his big plays allowed. Penn and Joseph redeem themselves and then some.

This is a pretty clear double-standard, JC.