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Dolorous Jason

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#300 : November 27, 2012, 06:36:55 PM


 " The point is that it is an impossibility to support yourself, much less a family, on a job that pays $7.25 an hour."

 It's probably not a good idea to start a family you can't support then, is it? But nothing to worry about if the load for your irresponsible decisions falls on other people's shoulders.

Now you are asking for personal responsibility , and that's just cruel , man.

What is your point? I was wrong? Ok. You win. I was wrong.

           

spartan

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#301 : November 27, 2012, 08:09:12 PM


 " The point is that it is an impossibility to support yourself, much less a family, on a job that pays $7.25 an hour."

 It's probably not a good idea to start a family you can't support then, is it? But nothing to worry about if the load for your irresponsible decisions falls on other people's shoulders.

Zing!!!!!!!!!

One extra word; Europe!

wreck ship

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#302 : November 27, 2012, 08:47:23 PM


 " The point is that it is an impossibility to support yourself, much less a family, on a job that pays $7.25 an hour."

 It's probably not a good idea to start a family you can't support then, is it? But nothing to worry about if the load for your irresponsible decisions falls on other people's shoulders.
while I agree it's not a good idea to start a family on a 7.25, **CENSORED** happens. A married women with kids today can be a single mother with kids tomorrow. A family man can be employed today and unemployed tomorrow. **CENSORED** happens.

philosophy is questions that may never be answered
religion is answers that may never be questioned

Chief Joseph

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#303 : November 27, 2012, 08:53:05 PM


 Indeed it does. And curiously, it tends to happen to the same people over and over.

Illuminator is a good poster. He sticks to his guns and makes good points. Some don\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\'t like that.

wreck ship

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#304 : November 27, 2012, 09:03:29 PM


 Indeed it does. And curiously, it tends to happen to the same people over and over.
and so it goes for poor ol dilluminate

philosophy is questions that may never be answered
religion is answers that may never be questioned

CBWx2

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#305 : November 27, 2012, 10:17:22 PM

They aren't interested in actual solutions. Just in trotting out the same ole' tired a$$ conservative memes. Raising the minimum wage to $11.00 an hour would save the country millions, if not billions in welfare spending, but that would also mean that the cons would lose their moral condemnation and an extra $0.15 for a box of Cheez-its, so of course, they have no interest.


olafberserker

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#306 : November 27, 2012, 10:30:15 PM

sounds great until employers lay off workers and/or cut hours to make up for the additional wages

Biggs3535

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#307 : November 28, 2012, 10:03:43 AM

They aren't interested in actual solutions. Just in trotting out the same ole' tired a$$ conservative memes. Raising the minimum wage to $11.00 an hour would save the country millions, if not billions in welfare spending, but that would also mean that the cons would lose their moral condemnation and an extra $0.15 for a box of Cheez-its, so of course, they have no interest.

I'm sure an $11.00 minimum wage wouldn't affect inflation at all.  Those minimum wage workers buying power would go up, alright.


John Galt?

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#308 : November 28, 2012, 12:31:26 PM

They aren't interested in actual solutions. Just in trotting out the same ole' tired a$$ conservative memes. Raising the minimum wage to $11.00 an hour would save the country millions, if not billions in welfare spending, but that would also mean that the cons would lose their moral condemnation and an extra $0.15 for a box of Cheez-its, so of course, they have no interest.


Well using that logic why not just raise minimum to $30/hr then all workers would be making $50k+ and paying taxes at that much higher rate? Hey trillions in new tax revenue and billions saved in welfare. What could possibly go wrong??


CBWx2

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#309 : November 28, 2012, 12:56:23 PM

sounds great until employers lay off workers and/or cut hours to make up for the additional wages

Empirical evidence has refuted the claim that raising the minimum wage leads to an increase in unemployment. One reason could be that a raise in the minimum wage doesn't affect a business' minimum labor requirements to meet consumer demand.

http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=226778


deadzone

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#310 : November 28, 2012, 01:12:45 PM

This crap is still debated? Those city dwellars that bash may one day beg for a meal.......

CBWx2

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#311 : November 28, 2012, 01:15:09 PM

They aren't interested in actual solutions. Just in trotting out the same ole' tired a$$ conservative memes. Raising the minimum wage to $11.00 an hour would save the country millions, if not billions in welfare spending, but that would also mean that the cons would lose their moral condemnation and an extra $0.15 for a box of Cheez-its, so of course, they have no interest.


Well using that logic why not just raise minimum to $30/hr then all workers would be making $50k+ and paying taxes at that much higher rate? Hey trillions in new tax revenue and billions saved in welfare. What could possibly go wrong??

That's not using that logic. That's using extremes to argue against logic. Logic is that inflation occurs regardless of whether or not labor costs increase. You're a smart guy, JG?. If the cost of goods steadily increases, yet the income of workers does not increase at at least the same rate, how does that affect the economy?

No one is arguing that a cashier should be making 50k a year. What's being argued is whether or not the minimum wage should at least reflect the real rate of inflation. Wage suppression artificially lowers the cost of goods, but it also suppresses demand and increases dependence on the state to subsidize the cost of basic needs and living expenses of low wage earners. As Durango 95 said, welfare has become the minimum wage equalizer.
: November 28, 2012, 01:17:29 PM CBWx2


olafberserker

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#312 : November 28, 2012, 01:21:13 PM

Yeah, front line employees never feel the crunch

http://www.npr.org/2012/07/08/156458470/raising-minimum-wage-a-help-or-harm

Joe Olivo owns a small printing press in New Jersey that employs 47 people. Olivo tells Raz that a higher minimum wage basically raises the whole wage scale and would force him to make cuts.

"What happens is the employee who's been here for 3 years and has more experience than a person making an entry-level wage, they will rightfully want more for their seniority," Olivo says. "So what it does to me as a business owner, by pushing up wage scale, it increases my expenses."

Olivo says that means he either has to increase revenues difficult in the current economy or he must find ways to cut expenses: cutting employees, not hiring new employees or bring in new technology to decrease the number of employees he needs.

"So it really hurts my current employees and it also prevents me from bringing on new ones," he says.

olafberserker

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#313 : November 28, 2012, 01:25:14 PM

I'm not saying that we can't/shouldn't raise the minimum wage some, but it isn't going to solve all the ills.   While we are at how about raising the salaries or teachers, police officers, firemen, etc.

John Galt?

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#314 : November 28, 2012, 01:25:43 PM

sounds great until employers lay off workers and/or cut hours to make up for the additional wages

Empirical evidence has refuted the claim that raising the minimum wage leads to an increase in unemployment. One reason could be that a raise in the minimum wage doesn't affect a business' minimum labor requirements to meet consumer demand.

http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=226778


Or maybe it is because only 5.2%1 of all workers are at minimum wage so even a 20% drop in employment of min wage workers equates to a miniscule change in over all employment rates.


1http://www.bls.gov/cps/minwage2011.htm


Or maybe because changing min. wage rates just leads to fewer hours worked and not job loss. So would you rather get $11/hr and only 20 hours/week or $7.25/hr with a 38 hour week?
: November 28, 2012, 01:31:58 PM John Galt?

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