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Booker Reese

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#60 : February 07, 2012, 11:27:50 AM

I think there are a lot of reasons why Quinn would not take the Bucs DC job, but the idea that they weren't offering him more money than he was being paid is not one of them.

The Glazers might be cheap, but they aren't stupid, and neither is Schiano. They know or have a rough idea what Quinn was paid, and they aren't going to waste their time or his offering him a job with more hours, and the same or less pay.

If they aren't prepared to trump $500k, they would never have talked to him. If that's all they are willing to pay, then they'd be looking at a different coaching bin altogether.

Skull and Bones

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#61 : February 07, 2012, 11:30:02 AM

it could be the 2 year contracts they are offering.


youngone

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#62 : February 07, 2012, 11:39:13 AM

Im not one to harp on calling the glazers cheap but this is really starting to get ridiculous.. y not prove that you are interested in winning by getting the best you can and pay them for it. Why lowball everybody?

I think the reason is simple; for the Glazer's this is a business just like any of their other financial holdings. Unfortunately, at this time the NFL has no real incentive to push owners to try and compete besides pride and they are doing incredibly well financially even though the franchise is a complete mess.
you make it good point but if your have the extremely rare opportunity to own a franchise in the highest level of the sport why not compete? Its not like let they don't have good model examples to go by.

docbravo

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#63 : February 07, 2012, 11:42:33 AM

Do we know what Quinn was offered? Or exactly why he turned the job down?
Maybe they offered to pay him more money, but he thought he was going to be "micro-managed" by Coach Schiano (or Butch Davis in some capacity). Maybe he thought he would have more autonomy if he stayed in Gainesville.

Until we hear the Buc's side of the story, I guess everyone will just assume it was about money. Quinn, of course, has to do damage control back in Gainesville to stay in good standing with his bosses, so I don't really put much stock in what he's telling the media.


But that's the thing...we won't hear the Buc's side of the story. Glazers will continue to remain silent on this issue (like everything else). As fans, we can only draw conclusions based on the "evidence" provided.

Gotta say, this article is very damning.
I belive this is where our local media would be doing the fans of the Buccaneers a disservice. If someone doesn't have the "Marbles" to question Mark Dominik about the SPECIFIC process of hiring assistant coaches, then shame on them. (Step up Scott Reynolds, you my boy!!!!) The Bucs are supposed to be accountable to their paying customers. We deserve to know if the Bucs were offering positions to coaches, and were being turned, or if we were simply interviewing coaches, and deciding that they wouldn't be a good fit. There is a HUGE difference between the two. The coach will always spin it to make it seem like he turned the team down. It's like knowing you are about to be fired, but telling the boss you quit.


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#64 : February 07, 2012, 11:51:33 AM

I think there are a lot of reasons why Quinn would not take the Bucs DC job, but the idea that they weren't offering him more money than he was being paid is not one of them.

The Glazers might be cheap, but they aren't stupid, and neither is Schiano. They know or have a rough idea what Quinn was paid, and they aren't going to waste their time or his offering him a job with more hours, and the same or less pay.

If they aren't prepared to trump $500k, they would never have talked to him. If that's all they are willing to pay, then they'd be looking at a different coaching bin altogether.

Like S&B said, it's not just the pay, it's the structure of the contract. He may have been offered more money at face value than what he makes at UF, but how much of it was guaranteed? I'm pretty sure whatever deal he has going at UF is better than the 1 and 1 deal he probably got offered by the Bucs.

Also, as much as the fans on this message board seem to think that the Bucs are just overflowing with talent across the roster, it is not a view commonly held throughout the league. Money aside, with no guarantees that the Bucs are going to spend, coaches may view it as a negative career move to come here when they may not be given the tools to succeed. Let's face it, it's not like he's the DC of Florida Atlantic or anything. UF is a high profile college program. Succeeding there is going to almost assuredly open up a head coaching gig somewhere down the line. He doesn't have to take the first thing that comes along just because it pays a few extra dollars.


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#65 : February 07, 2012, 11:52:33 AM

We deserve to know if the Bucs were offering positions to coaches, and were being turned, or if we were simply interviewing coaches, and deciding that they wouldn't be a good fit..

No we don't. That's just dumb. No NFL team gives out that kind of details and they shouldn't. Ever.

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#66 : February 07, 2012, 11:56:16 AM

paging Vince to tell us the Glazers aren't cheap.

Lol. His mission in life.

Booker Reese

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#67 : February 07, 2012, 12:04:22 PM

I think there are a lot of reasons why Quinn would not take the Bucs DC job, but the idea that they weren't offering him more money than he was being paid is not one of them.

The Glazers might be cheap, but they aren't stupid, and neither is Schiano. They know or have a rough idea what Quinn was paid, and they aren't going to waste their time or his offering him a job with more hours, and the same or less pay.

If they aren't prepared to trump $500k, they would never have talked to him. If that's all they are willing to pay, then they'd be looking at a different coaching bin altogether.

Like S&B said, it's not just the pay, it's the structure of the contract. He may have been offered more money at face value than what he makes at UF, but how much of it was guaranteed? I'm pretty sure whatever deal he has going at UF is better than the 1 and 1 deal he probably got offered by the Bucs.

Also, as much as the fans on this message board seem to think that the Bucs are just overflowing with talent across the roster, it is not a view commonly held throughout the league. Money aside, with no guarantees that the Bucs are going to spend, coaches may view it as a negative career move to come here when they may not be given the tools to succeed. Let's face it, it's not like he's the DC of Florida Atlantic or anything. UF is a high profile college program. Succeeding there is going to almost assuredly open up a head coaching gig somewhere down the line. He doesn't have to take the first thing that comes along just because it pays a few extra dollars.

I totally agree.

Look, I can't say this for every potential hire, but Quinn's path forward if he's ambitious and thinking longterm is to take a little less this year and stay put.  I don't think you even have to buy into the 1 and 1 contract to make that argument; the standard 2 year assistant deal might not be enough.  With 10 guys coming back, he's got a chance to repeat his success, and then start getting Kirby Smart/Bud Foster type $ and perks at worst, or Bob Stoops type looks at best.  He would also be back on the radar of more NFL teams than just the Bucs.

With the Bucs, there's just more risk. There are more holes than talent on defense, and if he can't turn it around, he may find that his next job is back to coaching DL, or returning to college as a DC at a more modest program.

docbravo

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#68 : February 07, 2012, 12:08:42 PM

We deserve to know if the Bucs were offering positions to coaches, and were being turned, or if we were simply interviewing coaches, and deciding that they wouldn't be a good fit..

No we don't. That's just dumb. No NFL team gives out that kind of details and they shouldn't. Ever.

Dumb? I think for fans to spend their money on a team that hasn't shown it's capable of acquiring talent (Coaches & Players), or even attempt  to justify the process is DUMB. I don't follow other NFL teams, so I'm not familiar with what they do. You seem to be in the know (somewhat), so I'll take your word for it (I guess).

I didnt' ask to see their accounting books, or bottom line financials like some people. (THAT, IMO, is Dumb.) I'm simply curious if we are as much of a festering pile crap of a franchise, as we are being painted as. I don't think it's too much to ask, for the GM to stand up for his organization.

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#69 : February 07, 2012, 12:26:55 PM

I'm as frustrated as the next guy, docbravo, but what you are asking is terrible policy.

It basically says to people that the Bucs might want to hire that what happens here is public, and you can't expect them to keep a secret, or respect your privacy.

Benchwarmer#1

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#70 : February 07, 2012, 12:55:44 PM

We deserve to know if the Bucs were offering positions to coaches, and were being turned, or if we were simply interviewing coaches, and deciding that they wouldn't be a good fit..

No we don't. That's just dumb. No NFL team gives out that kind of details and they shouldn't. Ever.

Dumb? I think for fans to spend their money on a team that hasn't shown it's capable of acquiring talent (Coaches & Players), or even attempt  to justify the process is DUMB. I don't follow other NFL teams, so I'm not familiar with what they do. You seem to be in the know (somewhat), so I'll take your word for it (I guess).

I didn't' ask to see their accounting books, or bottom line financial like some people. (THAT, IMO, is Dumb.) I'm simply curious if we are as much of a festering pile crap of a franchise, as we are being painted as. I don't think it's too much to ask, for the GM to stand up for his organization.

People can waste their money if they want too. < It's the same philosophy as the Glazers have taken in FA and payroll. So now...why exactly do I have to spend? And why am I a "bad fan" because I don't want to buy tickets anymore to the Glazers circus show?

It's NOT that they have records that show they haven't spent. It's that their records show they haven't spent in YEARS. Dom is NOT the problem, it's the Glazers. It was "ok" when it was just the fans complaining and saying TB is a laughing stock, but when the entire NFL...assistant, players, coaches say say hell no a bunch of times, it just can't be the GM. It has to go farther than that. Dom hasn't caused nearly as much damage as the Glazers have. Heck, they started getting "out of cap-hell" waaay before he was ever GM, and went "cheap" three years before he was "damage control" GM Dom.

Remember, if the OWNERS want to be contenders, they'll be contenders. GM or not. They have the money, Dom doesn't. He's even said before that he would have to check with the Glazers a few time when asked questions. He's NOT the wallet holder, the Glazers are. THEY hired Dom, THEY hired Rah, THEY fired Gruden, THEY haven't spent, and THEY make the decisions. The ONLY reason Dom has a job is because they need SOMEONE to run the general business after they fired nearly everyone, and the fact that their OTHER team has FAR more invested into it. They aren't going to watch over a team that's worth 1/2 billion quite as well as they are a team that's worth 4-5 times as much. They have to have a guy running the general operations. The ONLY time they seem to be around is when $ is involved, and consequently, it's also when people say "no" to the team.

docbravo

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#71 : February 07, 2012, 02:10:57 PM

We deserve to know if the Bucs were offering positions to coaches, and were being turned, or if we were simply interviewing coaches, and deciding that they wouldn't be a good fit..

No we don't. That's just dumb. No NFL team gives out that kind of details and they shouldn't. Ever.

Dumb? I think for fans to spend their money on a team that hasn't shown it's capable of acquiring talent (Coaches & Players), or even attempt  to justify the process is DUMB. I don't follow other NFL teams, so I'm not familiar with what they do. You seem to be in the know (somewhat), so I'll take your word for it (I guess).

I didn't' ask to see their accounting books, or bottom line financial like some people. (THAT, IMO, is Dumb.) I'm simply curious if we are as much of a festering pile crap of a franchise, as we are being painted as. I don't think it's too much to ask, for the GM to stand up for his organization.

People can waste their money if they want too. < It's the same philosophy as the Glazers have taken in FA and payroll. So now...why exactly do I have to spend? And why am I a "bad fan" because I don't want to buy tickets anymore to the Glazers circus show?

It's NOT that they have records that show they haven't spent. It's that their records show they haven't spent in YEARS. Dom is NOT the problem, it's the Glazers. It was "ok" when it was just the fans complaining and saying TB is a laughing stock, but when the entire NFL...assistant, players, coaches say say hell no a bunch of times, it just can't be the GM. It has to go farther than that. Dom hasn't caused nearly as much damage as the Glazers have. Heck, they started getting "out of cap-hell" waaay before he was ever GM, and went "cheap" three years before he was "damage control" GM Dom.

Remember, if the OWNERS want to be contenders, they'll be contenders. GM or not. They have the money, Dom doesn't. He's even said before that he would have to check with the Glazers a few time when asked questions. He's NOT the wallet holder, the Glazers are. THEY hired Dom, THEY hired Rah, THEY fired Gruden, THEY haven't spent, and THEY make the decisions. The ONLY reason Dom has a job is because they need SOMEONE to run the general business after they fired nearly everyone, and the fact that their OTHER team has FAR more invested into it. They aren't going to watch over a team that's worth 1/2 billion quite as well as they are a team that's worth 4-5 times as much. They have to have a guy running the general operations. The ONLY time they seem to be around is when $ is involved, and consequently, it's also when people say "no" to the team.
Bench,
I understand that the Glazers have to take the blount of the blame, so I'm not holding Dominik's feet to the fire for all that is currently wrong with this situation. I just think, as the GM, he should speak up to set the record straight; instead of letting the organization that he represents get dragged through the mud, and made a mockery of. Am I suggesting that he answer every lie, rumor, or slanderous thing being said about the Bucs and the Glazers, no. But offer the fans of this franchise something to feel good about. I understand being clandestine in your activities, but to do so at the expense of your credibility is pretty risky, IMO.

Of course, if this all works out, and they bake a sweet cake (the team becomes viable again) , no one will care that they appeared to have egg on their face now.

I'm as frustrated as the next guy, docbravo, but what you are asking is terrible policy.

It basically says to people that the Bucs might want to hire that what happens here is public, and you can't expect them to keep a secret, or respect your privacy.

Maybe so, but shouldn't that work both ways? Shouldn't coaches agree not to spout off to the media that they turned the Bucs down? 

: February 07, 2012, 02:14:55 PM docbravo

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#72 : February 07, 2012, 02:12:33 PM

Maybe so, but shouldn't that work both ways? Shouldn't coaches agree not to spout off to the media that they turned the Bucs down?

It isn't the coaches, usually. It's their agents.

And BTW, my information tells me that Quinn was never actually offered the position.

docbravo

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#73 : February 07, 2012, 10:29:53 PM

Maybe so, but shouldn't that work both ways? Shouldn't coaches agree not to spout off to the media that they turned the Bucs down?

And BTW, my information tells me that Quinn was never actually offered the position.

That was my su**CENSORED**ion all along! Once word leaks that a college coach has interviewed for another job, the back peddling and spinning that takes place is ridiculous! They will do and say anything to make them look loyal to their original school. Especially after signing a big recruiting class.  It just hurt me to see my favorite team get used and kicked around because of it.
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