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J Buc

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#15 : April 30, 2012, 06:31:28 PM


I keep hearing this argument about today's modern passing league... and it just seems counter-intuitive to me...

In actuality, Mark Barron is EXACTLY what you want today to attack today's passing oriented offenses.

He is a guy who can play the run AND the pass - so when you replace a linebacker with a defensive back - you still have a player on the field who can act like a linebacker and play the run much more effectively. And in obvious running situations - he almost serves as an extra linebacker.

This is what I really loved about Cody Grimm's game when he was healthy. He was decent in coverage, but he served almost as an extra linebacker in stopping the run. Go look at our run defense stats when Grimm was in there - and compare them to when he was out of there. Night and day.

So I think this argument is simply back asswards. Actually the league is moving towards players like a Mark Barron and the rest of the NFL recognized it, which is why he was such a hot commodity as the draft approached. And guys like Mark Barron are extremely difficult to find. So I personally think he is a great pick. Gives our defense so much more flexibility.

nice post.

+1

Guys like Mayock, Casserly & charles Davis all have said Barron is a potential Pro Bowler. When's the last time that was said about ANY of the Buc's draft choices?

Kenyatta Walker ......

 I KEEED I KEEEEEEDDD

As for Traew01's post I was caught off guard as well. Didnt know how to react until I heard everybody gushing over him on NFLN and Gruden and Kipa loving the pick, thats what made me start to look into it.What I saw I loved though

 Everybody who's opinion actually means anything loves our drafts and the others (Bleacher Report) well ... need I say more


Dolorous Jason

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#16 : April 30, 2012, 06:50:11 PM

Look at this Jason Cole queer:



We're supposed to believe he knows football ??

What is your point? I was wrong? Ok. You win. I was wrong.

           

Raheem33

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#17 : April 30, 2012, 06:59:05 PM

Who cares what the national media thinks. It was a great draft and I love the leadership Barron brings to our team

sunrisejeff

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#18 : April 30, 2012, 07:10:51 PM

Saying that Barron is worth the pick only if he is the next Troy P is like saying Claiborne is only worth the pick if he is the next Deion.  Stupid logic.

gone

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#19 : April 30, 2012, 07:16:08 PM

Saying that Barron is worth the pick only if he is the next Troy P is like saying Claiborne is only worth the pick if he is the next Deion.  Stupid logic.

No, it's not stupid and it's not like saying that about Claiborn.  The logic is that for a safety to have as much of an impact on the game as a corner he would have to be correspondingly better.  You may agree with it or not, but it is logical and most coaches and pros agree with that logic.

bucfan26

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#20 : April 30, 2012, 07:17:58 PM

Claiborne may turn out to be the right pick but the Bucs weren't high on him. If they were they wouldn't have traded down for Barron at #7.


GameTime

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#21 : April 30, 2012, 07:21:02 PM

No, it's not stupid and it's not like saying that about Claiborn.  The logic is that for a safety to have as much of an impact on the game as a corner he would have to be correspondingly better.  You may agree with it or not, but it is logical and most coaches and pros agree with that logic.

i think there are many ways to look at it.  you can take a CB out of the game with formations, personnel and routes.  can you really do that with a safety?  now there is the flipside, that the defense believes they have taken away your top WR...but i think it can be argued both ways.

\"Lets put the O back in Country\"

bradentonian

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#22 : April 30, 2012, 07:24:04 PM

No, it's not stupid and it's not like saying that about Claiborn.  The logic is that for a safety to have as much of an impact on the game as a corner he would have to be correspondingly better.  You may agree with it or not, but it is logical and most coaches and pros agree with that logic.

i think there are many ways to look at it.  you can take a CB out of the game with formations, personnel and routes.  can you really do that with a safety?  now there is the flipside, that the defense believes they have taken away your top WR...but i think it can be argued both ways.


If the offense has to game plan to "take the CB out of the game" then he has already done his job


Dolorous Jason

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#23 : April 30, 2012, 07:30:01 PM

No, it's not stupid and it's not like saying that about Claiborn.  The logic is that for a safety to have as much of an impact on the game as a corner he would have to be correspondingly better.  You may agree with it or not, but it is logical and most coaches and pros agree with that logic.

i think there are many ways to look at it.  you can take a CB out of the game with formations, personnel and routes.  can you really do that with a safety?  now there is the flipside, that the defense believes they have taken away your top WR...but i think it can be argued both ways.

I think a great safety like Troy P makes a bigger impact on a game than a great corner . Great safeties make plays in all facets of the game against the run and the pass , and all over the field. All a corner can do is shut down the guy he is covering on one side of the field. If he worries you enough you can simply  game-plan to keep the ball away from him.

How many superbowls have Ed Reed and Troy P won as compared to Revis Island ?

What is your point? I was wrong? Ok. You win. I was wrong.

           

VinBucFan

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#24 : April 30, 2012, 07:39:36 PM

Barron to Claiborne Barron should make a bigger difference if they are both very good at their position because Barron should have a significant impact on run and passing game and is a leader and he plays an essential position in THIS defense

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#25 : April 30, 2012, 07:52:22 PM

Barron has more to offer overall than Claiborn.  At his best, clay would be a kind of "fire and forget it" pick, you man him up and make it a 10 on 10 .  No leadership, no teaching, no making calls on the field as apparently Barron will do. 

GameTime

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#26 : April 30, 2012, 08:00:33 PM

If the offense has to game plan to "take the CB out of the game" then he has already done his job

the offense is gonna gameplan against biggers and lewis, gonna gameplan against claiborne and carr...doesnt mean they have done their job.  you play to your strengths and the defenses weaknesses.  but like i said, it can be argued both ways, i certainly understand your position.

\"Lets put the O back in Country\"

dalbuc

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#27 : April 30, 2012, 08:06:45 PM


I think a great safety like Troy P makes a bigger impact on a game than a great corner . Great safeties make plays in all facets of the game against the run and the pass , and all over the field. All a corner can do is shut down the guy he is covering on one side of the field. If he worries you enough you can simply  game-plan to keep the ball away from him.

How many superbowls have Ed Reed and Troy P won as compared to Revis Island ?



I'll trade you Troy P for Revis straight up forgetting age...how many GM's take that deal? 32 out of 32 and never look back. Troy P isn't even the most important guy on that defense, hell he's not the second most important guy. Just because we took an S people have lost their minds trying to prove that which can't be proved. Here's the real simple test, what is the franchise # for CB's ($9.5m). What is it for S ($6.5m)? That valuation says only TE's are less valuable than S's among non kickers. That is in the end the evaluation of the NFL about those players.

All posts are opinions in case you are too stupid to figure that out on your own without me saying it over and over.
If you think Manziel is the best QB in this draft I can safely assume you are an idiot and will treat you as such.

dalbuc

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#28 : April 30, 2012, 08:08:39 PM


i think there are many ways to look at it.  you can take a CB out of the game with formations, personnel and routes.  can you really do that with a safety?  now there is the flipside, that the defense believes they have taken away your top WR...but i think it can be argued both ways.

Of course, if Barron is a run stuffer you flank the TE out. You get him matched on an RB. You use formations to keep him away from the line or to suck him up to the line. Safeties are about the easiest thing to manipulate on the field.

All posts are opinions in case you are too stupid to figure that out on your own without me saying it over and over.
If you think Manziel is the best QB in this draft I can safely assume you are an idiot and will treat you as such.

GameTime

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#29 : April 30, 2012, 09:09:39 PM

Of course, if Barron is a run stuffer you flank the TE out. You get him matched on an RB. You use formations to keep him away from the line or to suck him up to the line. Safeties are about the easiest thing to manipulate on the field.

TE's are a huge part of todays NFL...how does him covering a TE take him out of the play?  if he's matched up on a RB he is still right in the middle of the action.  every position can be manipulated, but a safety will always be more in the action than a cover corner imo. 

\"Lets put the O back in Country\"
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