Talib’s Motion Reveals Some Legal Strategy

[dalbuc]

So basically they are gonna go with the "who wouldn't want to shoot at him" defense?

uh . .  . no

Um, yes. They might craft it as "credibility" but basically they want the jury to hate the defendant. Juries are humans not machine. Jur-o-matic 5000 might not care if the victim is a scumbag as just rule on the facts but people do have emotions and can think "who cares if he did it, dude was asking for it". It is the same approach taken for years and years with rape cases - make the victim seem undeserving of the justice they seek.

[VinBucFan]

So basically they are gonna go with the "who wouldn't want to shoot at him" defense?

uh . .  . no

Um, yes. They might craft it as "credibility" but basically they want the jury to hate the defendant. Juries are humans not machine. Jur-o-matic 5000 might not care if the victim is a scumbag as just rule on the facts but people do have emotions and can think "who cares if he did it, dude was asking for it". It is the same approach taken for years and years with rape cases - make the victim seem undeserving of the justice they seek.

Ah, I see . . . the "credibility" defense that is not really a credibility defense. Subliminal messages and all.  Got it.  I think you're right with the explanation

[CaptainStagger]

So basically they are gonna go with the "who wouldn't want to shoot at him" defense?

uh . .  . no

Um, yes. They might craft it as "credibility" but basically they want the jury to hate the defendant. Juries are humans not machine. Jur-o-matic 5000 might not care if the victim is a scumbag as just rule on the facts but people do have emotions and can think "who cares if he did it, dude was asking for it". It is the same approach taken for years and years with rape cases - make the victim seem undeserving of the justice they seek.

This is not about past crimes, this is about him lying to cops and judges. I think the focal point of defense is Billings telling cops that while running for his life he managed to look over his shoulder and clearly make out Talib with a gun. Talib who had no residue on his skin or clothing I believe.

[BucNY]

So basically they are gonna go with the "who wouldn't want to shoot at him" defense?

Uhh...more like he's a liar, see previous lies under oath, he had intent to harm Talib's sister in which case under texas law Talib may have recourse to sufficiently protect her. Also his previous and apparently current child sex cases which speak to his character and integrity of his claims of running for his life and being able to accurately see Talib shooting back at him.

This case is going to end up with a whole lot of we don't know who did what because they are all lying pieces of garbage. Everyone go home. He'll be in a bucs uniform all year is my guess.

[player101]

So basically they are gonna go with the "who wouldn't want to shoot at him" defense?

Uhh...more like he's a liar, see previous lies under oath, he had intent to harm Talib's sister in which case under texas law Talib may have recourse to sufficiently protect her. Also his previous and apparently current child sex cases which speak to his character and integrity of his claims of running for his life and being able to accurately see Talib shooting back at him.

This case is going to end up with a whole lot of we don't know who did what because they are all lying pieces of garbage. Everyone go home. He'll be in a bucs uniform all year is my guess.

I just find it a stretch to hinge the case on the guys credibility. 'Someone' was shooting at him. It was either Talib's mom or Talib. What motivation, if any, does the witness have to lie about WHO was shooting at him? Maybe the defense is going to try to connect the dots between a theoretical civil case against Talib being the rationale for claiming Talib pulled the trigger?

[tatmanfish]

So basically they are gonna go with the "who wouldn't want to shoot at him" defense?

uh . .  . no

Um, yes. They might craft it as "credibility" but basically they want the jury to hate the defendant. Juries are humans not machine. Jur-o-matic 5000 might not care if the victim is a scumbag as just rule on the facts but people do have emotions and can think "who cares if he did it, dude was asking for it". It is the same approach taken for years and years with rape cases - make the victim seem undeserving of the justice they seek.

This is not about past crimes, this is about him lying to cops and judges. I think the focal point of defense is Billings telling cops that while running for his life he managed to look over his shoulder and clearly make out Talib with a gun. Talib who had no residue on his skin or clothing I believe.

look out, we have genius!!!! Why in the world would the defense want to prove all the times Billings has lied to the police and the court system? To make the jury hate Billings!!!!!! LMAO!  Logic fail.

[tatmanfish]

So basically they are gonna go with the "who wouldn't want to shoot at him" defense?

Uhh...more like he's a liar, see previous lies under oath, he had intent to harm Talib's sister in which case under texas law Talib may have recourse to sufficiently protect her. Also his previous and apparently current child sex cases which speak to his character and integrity of his claims of running for his life and being able to accurately see Talib shooting back at him.

This case is going to end up with a whole lot of we don't know who did what because they are all lying pieces of garbage. Everyone go home. He'll be in a bucs uniform all year is my guess.

I just find it a stretch to hinge the case on the guys credibility. 'Someone' was shooting at him. It was either Talib's mom or Talib. What motivation, if any, does the witness have to lie about WHO was shooting at him? Maybe the defense is going to try to connect the dots between a theoretical civil case against Talib being the rationale for claiming Talib pulled the trigger?

uh, because Billings wasnt supposed to be there in the first place. He was violating a restraining order issued to him just hours before the incident. Without him also having some sort of conflict, its just Billings violating a restraining order and likely his probation and going to jail for quite awhile. So he can go to jail again for abuse, violating a restraining order, and violating probation......or he becomes a victim of a crime and stays out of jail at least until after the court case is closed or maybe out of jail all together.

Also, the case doesnt hinge on just the guys credibility given all the other details. something like 15 witnesses in Talibs favor vs 1 or 2 for Billings might have an effect. No gun shot residue on Talib may have a factor. Billings abusing Talibs sister and violating a restraining order may have a factor. Add all of those together and a history of lieing to police and the courts, Billing doesnt have much to stand on.

[player101]

So basically they are gonna go with the "who wouldn't want to shoot at him" defense?

Uhh...more like he's a liar, see previous lies under oath, he had intent to harm Talib's sister in which case under texas law Talib may have recourse to sufficiently protect her. Also his previous and apparently current child sex cases which speak to his character and integrity of his claims of running for his life and being able to accurately see Talib shooting back at him.

This case is going to end up with a whole lot of we don't know who did what because they are all lying pieces of garbage. Everyone go home. He'll be in a bucs uniform all year is my guess.

I just find it a stretch to hinge the case on the guys credibility. 'Someone' was shooting at him. It was either Talib's mom or Talib. What motivation, if any, does the witness have to lie about WHO was shooting at him? Maybe the defense is going to try to connect the dots between a theoretical civil case against Talib being the rationale for claiming Talib pulled the trigger?

uh, because Billings wasnt supposed to be there in the first place. He was violating a restraining order issued to him just hours before the incident. Without him also having some sort of conflict, its just Billings violating a restraining order and likely his probation and going to jail for quite awhile. So he can go to jail again for abuse, violating a restraining order, and violating probation......or he becomes a victim of a crime and stays out of jail at least until after the court case is closed or maybe out of jail all together.

Also, the case doesnt hinge on just the guys credibility given all the other details. something like 15 witnesses in Talibs favor vs 1 or 2 for Billings might have an effect. No gun shot residue on Talib may have a factor. Billings abusing Talibs sister and violating a restraining order may have a factor. Add all of those together and a history of lieing to police and the courts, Billing doesnt have much to stand on.

Tatem, Billings is not on trial (at this time). This trial is to determine if Talib committed assault with a deadly weapon . The person could have been Charles Manson and it would not change what Talib is being charged with. I guess it is possible that the defense could try to say it was done with just cause but that argument would assume he was the one that pulled the trigger.

[mrchillwill]

If Talib fired a weapon, how come no residue was found on him?

[tatmanfish]

So basically they are gonna go with the "who wouldn't want to shoot at him" defense?

Uhh...more like he's a liar, see previous lies under oath, he had intent to harm Talib's sister in which case under texas law Talib may have recourse to sufficiently protect her. Also his previous and apparently current child sex cases which speak to his character and integrity of his claims of running for his life and being able to accurately see Talib shooting back at him.

This case is going to end up with a whole lot of we don't know who did what because they are all lying pieces of garbage. Everyone go home. He'll be in a bucs uniform all year is my guess.

I just find it a stretch to hinge the case on the guys credibility. 'Someone' was shooting at him. It was either Talib's mom or Talib. What motivation, if any, does the witness have to lie about WHO was shooting at him? Maybe the defense is going to try to connect the dots between a theoretical civil case against Talib being the rationale for claiming Talib pulled the trigger?

uh, because Billings wasnt supposed to be there in the first place. He was violating a restraining order issued to him just hours before the incident. Without him also having some sort of conflict, its just Billings violating a restraining order and likely his probation and going to jail for quite awhile. So he can go to jail again for abuse, violating a restraining order, and violating probation......or he becomes a victim of a crime and stays out of jail at least until after the court case is closed or maybe out of jail all together.

Also, the case doesnt hinge on just the guys credibility given all the other details. something like 15 witnesses in Talibs favor vs 1 or 2 for Billings might have an effect. No gun shot residue on Talib may have a factor. Billings abusing Talibs sister and violating a restraining order may have a factor. Add all of those together and a history of lieing to police and the courts, Billing doesnt have much to stand on.

Tatem, Billings is not on trial (at this time). This trial is to determine if Talib committed assault with a deadly weapon . The person could have been Charles Manson and it would not change what Talib is being charged with. I guess it is possible that the defense could try to say it was done with just cause but that argument would assume he was the one that pulled the trigger.

wow, just wow. You clearly dont get any of this. if a guy has continually lied to police and courts, you are supposed to take his word at 100%? You do understand that the credibility of a witness is always in question right? 

You come up with just cause and an assumption?

Maybe they are saying Billings is flat out lieing? The eye witness accounts back this up, documented history backs this up. If his accounts are thrown out, they have nothing to base the case off of. No residue, and an overwhelming number of witnesses in favor of Talib. There isnt a single witness that saw anything of the running into the woods and the latter shots being fired other than Billings. Id say his credibility plays a huge role.

ill aslo explain slowly, that when the police are getting conflicting stories, they ask each side if they want to prosecute. Obviously Talibs family was going to, so Billing was left with the choice of pressing charges as well, or going to jail right there on the spot. If Billings wasnt counter claiming that Talib was attacking him instead of just Billings attacking Talibs sister, there wouldnt have been conflicting reports and Billings wouldve been hauled off right there. Due to the conflicting reports and both sides wanting to press charges, no one was immediately arrested.

Either way, you ignorant as all hell if you dont the the credibility of the accuser isnt a factor when they are one of the only witnesses for these charges to stem from.

 

[VinBucFan]

If Talib fired a weapon, how come no residue was found on him?

He was not tested, at least not contemporaneously, because he left the scene. At least that is what I read

[player101]

So basically they are gonna go with the "who wouldn't want to shoot at him" defense?

Uhh...more like he's a liar, see previous lies under oath, he had intent to harm Talib's sister in which case under texas law Talib may have recourse to sufficiently protect her. Also his previous and apparently current child sex cases which speak to his character and integrity of his claims of running for his life and being able to accurately see Talib shooting back at him.

This case is going to end up with a whole lot of we don't know who did what because they are all lying pieces of garbage. Everyone go home. He'll be in a bucs uniform all year is my guess.

I just find it a stretch to hinge the case on the guys credibility. 'Someone' was shooting at him. It was either Talib's mom or Talib. What motivation, if any, does the witness have to lie about WHO was shooting at him? Maybe the defense is going to try to connect the dots between a theoretical civil case against Talib being the rationale for claiming Talib pulled the trigger?

uh, because Billings wasnt supposed to be there in the first place. He was violating a restraining order issued to him just hours before the incident. Without him also having some sort of conflict, its just Billings violating a restraining order and likely his probation and going to jail for quite awhile. So he can go to jail again for abuse, violating a restraining order, and violating probation......or he becomes a victim of a crime and stays out of jail at least until after the court case is closed or maybe out of jail all together.

Also, the case doesnt hinge on just the guys credibility given all the other details. something like 15 witnesses in Talibs favor vs 1 or 2 for Billings might have an effect. No gun shot residue on Talib may have a factor. Billings abusing Talibs sister and violating a restraining order may have a factor. Add all of those together and a history of lieing to police and the courts, Billing doesnt have much to stand on.

Tatem, Billings is not on trial (at this time). This trial is to determine if Talib committed assault with a deadly weapon . The person could have been Charles Manson and it would not change what Talib is being charged with. I guess it is possible that the defense could try to say it was done with just cause but that argument would assume he was the one that pulled the trigger.

wow, just wow. You clearly dont get any of this. if a guy has continually lied to police and courts, you are supposed to take his word at 100%? You do understand that the credibility of a witness is always in question right? 

You come up with just cause and an assumption?

Maybe they are saying Billings is flat out lieing? The eye witness accounts back this up, documented history backs this up. If his accounts are thrown out, they have nothing to base the case off of. No residue, and an overwhelming number of witnesses in favor of Talib. There isnt a single witness that saw anything of the running into the woods and the latter shots being fired other than Billings. Id say his credibility plays a huge role.

ill aslo explain slowly, that when the police are getting conflicting stories, they ask each side if they want to prosecute. Obviously Talibs family was going to, so Billing was left with the choice of pressing charges as well, or going to jail right there on the spot. If Billings wasnt counter claiming that Talib was attacking him instead of just Billings attacking Talibs sister, there wouldnt have been conflicting reports and Billings wouldve been hauled off right there. Due to the conflicting reports and both sides wanting to press charges, no one was immediately arrested.

Either way, you ignorant as all hell if you dont the the credibility of the accuser isnt a factor when they are one of the only witnesses for these charges to stem from.

First off, Relax bro.....
Second, from what I have read on the case a weapon was discharged at the scene. The question is who fired the weapon. From what has been said it was either Aqib or his mother. Aqib said it was his mother. Billings said it was Aqib. (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/03/31/aqib-talib-denies-allegations-shooting_n_843290.html) The case hinges on the testimony of Billings and I am guessing other witness testimony. Yes, Billings seems like a first rate ass but what must be determined is what (if any) are the motivations for billings to lie about who shot the gun. Why would he say Aqib fired the gun instead of his mom.

[tatmanfish]

youve seen too many TV shows. They dont have to prove what Billings reason is for lieing. They just have to show that he has no credibility and there for rendering his version of the story completely useless in court.

It doesnt matter why Billings would say anything if hes shown that hes lied countless times to the police and courts. You seem to believe that there has to be all of these reasons as to why each thing happened. Its called speculation and doesnt hold any weight what so ever. None for either side.

[player101]

youve seen too many TV shows. They dont have to prove what Billings reason is for lieing. They just have to show that he has no credibility and there for rendering his version of the story completely useless in court.

It doesnt matter why Billings would say anything if hes shown that hes lied countless times to the police and courts. You seem to believe that there has to be all of these reasons as to why each thing happened. Its called speculation and doesnt hold any weight what so ever. None for either side.

Dude, the facts are this: Either Aqib or his mother took a shot at the guy with a gun and neither were in fear for their life so no self defense. Nothing I have read explains it in any other way. Aqib says it was his mom. Apparently, prosecutors disagree. Billings is only one of the witnesses and his credibility doesn't change jack **CENSORED** about whether or not Aqib (or his mom) aimed a gun at him and tried to kill him.

[muvlodge]

Texans almost make it a requirement to own and carry a gun. He might come out of this trial smelling like a rose.

This may be true except if you happen to be african -american.  Unfortunately, Texas is still pretty behind the times in that respect.