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jerseybucsfan

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#30 : June 13, 2012, 12:30:09 PM

5 or less= clearly disappointing
6= slightly disappointing but understandable
7= expected
8 or 9 = successful
10 or more = fantastic

In Verner We Trust

blind melon

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#31 : June 13, 2012, 12:35:53 PM

8 = 100% improvement = huge success.

I have a feeling this team is going to surprise a lot of people.   All of us included...  :)

Go get Bridgewater.   Do what it takes.

BucsFTW

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#32 : June 13, 2012, 01:24:28 PM

Playoffs.  Dom has already said he was done rebuilding team.  Time to tell if he knows what he is doing.

Playoffs...?  Playoffs...?!?   PLAYOFFS...?!!!?!?

"Dom has already said he was done rebuilding team"....   Link...?  (I won't hold my breath.  No GM is ever "done" building a team.  No way you can provide that link was the point Skull...)


Sailing2smth

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#33 : June 13, 2012, 01:39:37 PM

I know this wasnt directed at me BucsFTW but here is the link:
http://www.tampabay.com/sports/football/bucs/tampa-bay-buccaneers-gm-mark-dominik-i-think-were-tired-of-rebuilding-here/1220035


That's why I said 11 wins is "success" because that's what it's going to take to get into the playoffs....probably.

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#34 : June 13, 2012, 01:44:39 PM

a 6 or 7 win season will mean Freeman isn't a franchise QB more than likely.  With the improvements made to the team in talent and coaching he quite simply needs to do better than that.

Skull...  Your logic (or lack thereof) is flawed sir.

You're assuming two things, as if they're a "given"...

The talent level.  The addition of a top-tier WR & O lineman, not to mention the "hopeful upgrade" that Wright will be - does NOT guarantee success.

The coaching appears to have been upgraded "on paper", but to assume that the regime change has been improved, simply because it has been changed, as if it is a "given"...?  Ridiculous.

In case you haven't noticed, there are over 100 players/coaches that take the field every Sunday.  Just because you don't like who our current QB is...  Don't make ya right...!

If we have another year of "Swiss cheeze defense", and Freeman still manages to pull out 6 ot 7 wins, in spite of the lack of defense, I think it almost solidifies him as a legitimate franchise QB.


The Franchi5e

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#35 : June 13, 2012, 01:44:48 PM

12

Morgan

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#36 : June 13, 2012, 01:46:30 PM

Last year, I sat in the club section for breakfast w/ Rah and Dom before the season and they talked championship.

So I'm very cautious to believe anything coming out of Dom's mouth concerning playoffs and beyond.


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#37 : June 13, 2012, 02:16:37 PM

37...  You're talking out of both sides of your mouth man.  It's like you make sense in half your post, then - after being blinded by your disdain for Freeman - you add something crazier than bat sh!t...

Whether they win 6, 7, 10, or 12 games, I still don't think Freeman is a franchise QB.
IF Freeman manages to put together a 10, 11, or 12-win season...  He IS officially the "franchise QB" we've screamed for for years.  Fact.  End discussion.  No questions.
ANY quarterback who manages to put up 2 10-win seasons...  In his first 3 seasons as the team's starting QB...  IS a franchise QB.

To argue the point with you is fruitless.  You've got your mind made up, and that's truly pretty sad.





  Aside from that, there is a chance that the schedule could turn out to be rather difficult (I do doubt it though), if that's the case, like I said... with a new system and regime and accompany that with a tougher than expected schedule, I could see 6 or 7 wins being a successful season providing the end of the season shows a tremendous upward swing.
You're putting way too much emphasis on "strength of schedule"...  This ain't the NCAA, and there are NO cream-puffs in the NFL.

The difference between the haves and the have nots is so minimal that I just can't give that much creedance to ANY of the "schedule talk" BS.

Think about it...  Look at this seasons schedule.  You tell me the team that we "should" beat...?


JDouble

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#38 : June 13, 2012, 02:37:35 PM

I'm surprised how many folks expect 6 or 7 wins and would consider it a successful season. We started rebuilding this franchise in 2009 when we fired Gruden, cut our vets, and drafted Freeman. This is year four. We aren't rebuilding anymore. We've had four drafts to rebuild and we spent big time in FA this year because we want to win NOW. No more rebuilding and moral victories. A completely new coaching staff will buy a little slack, but anything less than the playoffs is a failure of a season. Period.

Draft Aaron Donald



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#39 : June 13, 2012, 02:44:29 PM


IF Freeman manages to put together a 10, 11, or 12-win season...  He IS officially the "franchise QB" we've screamed for for years.  Fact.  End discussion.  No questions.
ANY quarterback who manages to put up 2 10-win seasons...  In his first 3 seasons as the team's starting QB...  IS a franchise QB.

To argue the point with you is fruitless.  You've got your mind made up, and that's truly pretty sad.

Not trying to make you turn to being "fruitless"...but what happens if Freeman does great in '12 and then in '13 he reverts back to '11 form?

I don't know of many "franchise QBs" that can't string together 2,3,4+ good seasons. I'm looking for consistency out of #5 before I stick the label of "franchise" on him. I do have hope that he will get there...but I am also skeptical..cause we haven't seen any signs of consistency yet....just flashes of ability.


Hell, brees might not be as accurate as manziel.

Morgan

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#40 : June 13, 2012, 02:47:39 PM

I think we'd be ecstatic if we split in our division and take one from the NFC East (Skins?),  AFC West is no pushover - maybe win against KC. Travel to Denver and Oakland, no easy wins there. Minn maybe. STL no guarantees. Anyone that says this is an easy schedule is clueless.



1    Sep 09    CAR @ TB    Raymond James Stadium    4:15 PM    Tickets    FOX         
   
2    Sep 16    TB @ NYG    MetLife Stadium    1:00 PM    Tickets    FOX         
   
3    Sep 23    TB @ DAL    Cowboys Stadium    1:00 PM    Tickets    FOX         
   
4    Sep 30    WAS @ TB    Raymond James Stadium    4:15 PM    Tickets    FOX         
   
6    Oct 14    KC @ TB    Raymond James Stadium    1:00 PM    Tickets    CBS         
   
7    Oct 21    NO @ TB    Raymond James Stadium    1:00 PM    Tickets    FOX         
   
8    Oct 25    TB @ MIN    Mall of America Field    8:20 PM    Tickets    NFLN         
   
9    Nov 04    TB @ OAK    O.co Coliseum    4:05 PM    Tickets    FOX         
   
10    Nov 11    SD @ TB    Raymond James Stadium    1:00 PM    Tickets    CBS         
   
11    Nov 18    TB @ CAR    Bank of America Stadium    1:00 PM    Tickets    FOX         
   
12    Nov 25    ATL @ TB    Raymond James Stadium    1:00 PM    Tickets    FOX         
   
13    Dec 02    TB @ DEN    Sports Authority Field at Mile High    4:05 PM    Tickets    FOX         
   
14    Dec 09    PHI @ TB    Raymond James Stadium    1:00 PM    Tickets    FOX         
   
15    Dec 16    TB @ NO    Mercedes-Benz Superdome    1:00 PM    Tickets    FOX         
   
16    Dec 23    STL @ TB    Raymond James Stadium    1:00 PM    Tickets    FOX         
   
17    Dec 30    TB @ ATL    Georgia Dome    1:00 PM    Tickets    FOX

JDouble

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#41 : June 13, 2012, 02:48:04 PM

Just curious. Do you think Eli Manning, Matt Ryan, or Phillip Rivers would have looked good last year with Raheem/Olson and crew?

Draft Aaron Donald



BucsFTW

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#42 : June 13, 2012, 02:51:37 PM

Last year, I sat in the club section for breakfast w/ Rah and Dom before the season and they talked championship.

So I'm very cautious to believe anything coming out of Dom's mouth concerning playoffs and beyond.

C'mon Morg...

I don't care what section you sat in...  I don't care who you had breakfast with...  And I don't even care WHO you were listening to...

ALL 32 teams had the same sit-downs with season ticket holders, at 32 NFL cities.  Do you think any one of the other 31 team's GMs / Head Coaches said anything different...?  "Well...  we hope to field a competetive team, but realistically - we'll be very happy if we manage 7-9 wins and hopefully back our way into a wild card berth..."

I don't even recall Dom saying (this offseason) the word "playoffs", without hearing the words "hopefully" or "hope to" prefacing it...  Could be wrong, but it would be pretty polyannish to make that claim.

It sure as heck wasn't a 'reach' last year, coming off a 10-win season, for Dom to either say, or even think (and actually believe it as well) that we were playoff bound...  I'm sure he totally believed it.  Many of us did.

When you come out with the 4-3 start, not to mention the division wins as well, it wasn't far-fetched to think we had the inside track to the playoffs.  Divisionally speaking - at that point, we controlled our own destiny, regardless of the wins other NFCS opponents got, unless of course one of those 3 teams got extremely hot late in the season.

Morg...  I guess I'm saying - To consider Dom "untrustworthy", for talking playoffs and championships, is not accurate appraisal of Mark Dominik.

I think, as a whole, people want to lump waaaay too much blame on the teams GM when either the coach, or an individual player, don't work out.

We're talking about whittling down well over 1,000 players - every year - not to mention hiring (and then maintaining) a skilled and compitent coaching staff, and hoping they perform perfectly as well...  to roughly 60+ players, and 20-ish coaches, to a perfectly meshed well-oiled machine.  When you stop and think about it...  It's NO small task.

But EVERY GM is going to have his "misses"...  It's just how many he can avoid, and who he can also attract (given that a team's ownership group is willing to make the financial commitment to do so) in free agency.

/.02 cents


JavaRay

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#43 : June 13, 2012, 02:54:04 PM

Just curious. Do you think Eli Manning, Matt Ryan, or Phillip Rivers would have looked good last year with Raheem/Olson and crew?

Just a year ago, you were one of Raheem's biggest supporters.   Now you act like he was dog **CENSORED**.   

Make up your mind.


chace1986

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#44 : June 13, 2012, 02:54:53 PM

....This is year four..
...A completely new coaching staff...

Man, because of the new coaching staff...to me this is year one. The last three years, I think it's fair to say that the players drafted have not been adequately coached/prepared....compared to other 2,3,4 year vets on other squads..who knows how far behind they are in terms of progression. This franchise just hit the reset button...the difference is..they actually went out and got a few talented players and seem to have hired a pretty decent hands on, no BS coach. There were plenty of left-overs from Gru-allen when they reset in '09 and now there are plenty of Rahee-nik players leftovers that will be present during Shia-nik...so just because they didnt boot out all of the players from the last 3 years...doesn't mean it isn't a reset...IMO.
: June 13, 2012, 03:02:28 PM chace1986


Hell, brees might not be as accurate as manziel.
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