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Rusty

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#195 : October 10, 2012, 10:27:32 AM

2013 draft needs should focus purely on oline and dline starters/depth. If we cant' run effectively. it negates Schiano's philosophy. No QB pressure, DB's aare exposed(NY Giants game). 2014 you can go TE/CB/LB depth but nothing is more important than the trenches IMHO.

I agree with that. What is the answer at QB though? Do you continue to try and make this team like the Texans, 9ers, Ravens and just hope that Freeman can at least play up to half of what the 3 QBs of those teams play..? We need DL help for sure, and the OL has been bad in run blocking.

I don't relly know chace (love the new sig). It's like the chicken & the egg. What I do know is that he has zero chance of the disciplined approach, with occasional shots to Jackson/Williams if the oline sucks, compound that with 3 yds a carry, three and out and it puts Freeman in the deer in the headlights scenario where he is now. JMHO. If you eliminate ALL/Most of the excuses, you get to see who Freeman really is. If he didn't have his rookie season, where he clearly demonstrated that he COULD be the man, then I would say, flush the toilet.

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chace1986

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#196 : October 10, 2012, 11:14:05 AM

2013 draft needs should focus purely on oline and dline starters/depth. If we cant' run effectively. it negates Schiano's philosophy. No QB pressure, DB's aare exposed(NY Giants game). 2014 you can go TE/CB/LB depth but nothing is more important than the trenches IMHO.

I agree with that. What is the answer at QB though? Do you continue to try and make this team like the Texans, 9ers, Ravens and just hope that Freeman can at least play up to half of what the 3 QBs of those teams play..? We need DL help for sure, and the OL has been bad in run blocking.

I don't relly know chace (love the new sig). It's like the chicken & the egg. What I do know is that he has zero chance of the disciplined approach, with occasional shots to Jackson/Williams if the oline sucks, compound that with 3 yds a carry, three and out and it puts Freeman in the deer in the headlights scenario where he is now. JMHO. If you eliminate ALL/Most of the excuses, you get to see who Freeman really is. If he didn't have his rookie season, where he clearly demonstrated that he COULD be the man, then I would say, flush the toilet.

Yup, Im happy with the sig, thanks. lol.

Rookie season....you're talking about his 2nd year aka 2010, right?

My thoughts on him is that if they are trying to turn him into a pocket passer, then they will fail miserably and need to get a new QB for 2013, if that's what they want. If they want to adapt him into a Ben R/Romo-esque QB and get him moving around then they might have more success with him. I look back at 2010 and only see 4 or 5 games where he was impressive throughout the game. The rest of the time, he was playing poor early in games and having to make up for poor QB play late in games. IMO, the OL has done a good job at pass blocking this year. Freeman has had plenty of time, but he doesn't have it between the ears to work through multiple progressions. He has actually never shown that ability. He has always stared down receivers and in 2010, he was helped out by his reveivers exponentially. I'm convinced that while he did have good #s in 2010, overall, he played just "above average". If his ceiling is above average, he needs to be dumped, cause he isn't even close to being at the level he was in 2010.


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acacius

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#197 : October 10, 2012, 11:19:44 AM

Hayward and Watson are good depth at linebacker. Either could permantly take Black's job with no drop off. Besides, the 3rd linebacker isn't on the field enough to be a big concern. We could use a FA or mid round linebacker for better depth, but it's not a big need.
Yeah, when I talk about the possibility of adding a linebacker through free agency, I *definitely* don't mean a splash signing.  Basically, if Te'o is there when the team is drafting, they feel like he's all that and a bag of chips, and there're no players that they feel offer comparable value, that's fine.   I'd have no objection to seeing the team draft him.  But otherwise?  I just can't see it as a priority for the team where I'd expect them to spend real resources.

dexmonkey

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#198 : October 10, 2012, 12:36:27 PM

2013 draft needs should focus purely on oline and dline starters/depth. If we cant' run effectively. it negates Schiano's philosophy. No QB pressure, DB's aare exposed(NY Giants game). 2014 you can go TE/CB/LB depth but nothing is more important than the trenches IMHO.

 IMO, the OL has done a good job at pass blocking this year. Freeman has had plenty of time, .

Im not going to agree on the passblocking. its been spotty. theres been times when free was gettin a bunch of pressure in his face. i tihnk part of the problem is the whole right side is a liability. RG sucks right now without joseph. dotson has been ok and i didnt have much hope for him and hes exceeding what i was expecting. Penn has been solid, not great but solid. i think if we get a good RT in the draft and davin comes back healthy we will have a really good line nxt season
: October 10, 2012, 12:39:35 PM dexmonkey

chace1986

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#199 : October 10, 2012, 01:03:44 PM

That's fine. I think through 4 games, there is a definite improvement over last year. RG play would be underwheming with or without Davin Joseph. He has been below average the last few years. People liek to pretend like he is a top guard. Inaccurate. He got picked high and played well for about 2 seasons...then took Dom to school by getting that fat contract. Larsen has been really bad in run blocking and the penalties have hurt. In just passing situations, when he doesn't jump, he has been decent though. Zuttah has played average. Bad in run blocking, adequate in pass pro. Dotson is 2x the pass blocker TB was...but about 1/2 the run blocker...from what we have seen so far. Penn has been decent overall..and Nicks has been good...but not great.


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Rusty

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#200 : October 10, 2012, 01:08:03 PM

I thought that the oline was supposed to be the strength of the team. Big disappointment. Has a lot to do with the crappy results obviously.

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tripblood

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#201 : October 10, 2012, 01:08:36 PM

I know the numbers speak differently. But i'd feel 10x better with Joseph playing RG than Larsen.

Larsen's presence irritates me. He's small, slow, and weak. Whats the upside?

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FIRE SCHIANO!!!!

Its so hard for me to sit back on this forum, lookin at a guy on here, holler in\' my name!  When last year i spent more on 5 electric bills from this side of the country to the other, than you made! You\'re talkin to the Rolex wearing, diamond earring wearing, kiss-stealin, WOOOO!, wheelin dealin\', CTS drivin, jet-flyin sonofagun.. And I\'m havin a hard time holding these alligators down! WOOOO!

tripblood

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#202 : October 10, 2012, 01:09:23 PM

I thought that the oline was supposed to be the strength of the team. Big disappointment. Has a lot to do with the crappy results obviously.

Larsen playing instead of Joseph has alot to do with it, IMO

Show No MRSA..

FIRE SCHIANO!!!!

Its so hard for me to sit back on this forum, lookin at a guy on here, holler in\' my name!  When last year i spent more on 5 electric bills from this side of the country to the other, than you made! You\'re talkin to the Rolex wearing, diamond earring wearing, kiss-stealin, WOOOO!, wheelin dealin\', CTS drivin, jet-flyin sonofagun.. And I\'m havin a hard time holding these alligators down! WOOOO!

dexmonkey

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#203 : October 10, 2012, 01:50:22 PM

id love to get just average play out of the oline right now. right now id rate it as below average. dotson is playing decent considering i had zero expectations. larsen sucks. getting joseph back and drafting a RT would get great. id settle for joseph and dotson right now though. would rather draft a DL and a CB early

chace1986

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#204 : October 10, 2012, 01:52:11 PM

Joseph is highly overvalued by Bucs fans....Larsen might suck...but in all honesty...so does Joseph.


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NovaBuc

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#205 : October 10, 2012, 01:52:41 PM


 Some of these don't necessarily have to come through the draft but:

 A true center. Zuttah is definitely versatile but I'd rather see him at guard or tackle than center. Perhaps he can be our RT..?
 A true fullback who can block.
 Cornerback, possibly two of them.
 Possibly a QB.. the draft is looking fairly weak for QBs this year so it'd be nice if Freeman pans out or we find a gem somewhere.
 While we don't necessarily need to get a LB, I'd love to get Manti T'eo and slide Foster to Black's position.
 And of course, OL/DL depth.

 

dexmonkey

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#206 : October 10, 2012, 02:01:53 PM


 Some of these don't necessarily have to come through the draft but:

 A true center. Zuttah is definitely versatile but I'd rather see him at guard or tackle than center. Perhaps he can be our RT..?
 A true fullback who can block.
 Cornerback, possibly two of them.
 Possibly a QB.. the draft is looking fairly weak for QBs this year so it'd be nice if Freeman pans out or we find a gem somewhere.
 While we don't necessarily need to get a LB, I'd love to get Manti T'eo and slide Foster to Black's position.
 And of course, OL/DL depth.

agree. QB needs to be bypassed this year no matter what anyone says. the QB class is underwhelming to me right now and id rather spend picks on positions that will upgrade the team overall. that way if we do grab a QB next year he joins a team that is solid everywhere but qb, instead of deficient everywhere. WR and RB are perfectly fine. OL can be addressed later on in the draft or FA. LB can be addressed later on or not at all. TE can be addressed in the 4th or so. Safetey can be a later pick or wait til next year, black and baron will be fine for a year.

1 CB rounds 1-3
1 fullback round 5+
1 DT round 1-3
1 DE round 1-3

everything beyond that is gravy

JDouble

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#207 : October 10, 2012, 03:12:15 PM

Disagree Chace. I think his absence is proving how important Davin really is.


chace1986

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#208 : October 10, 2012, 05:11:06 PM

Disagree Chace. I think his absence is proving how important Davin really is.

IMHO, I feel Davin hasn't been the same since his foot injury in 2008. 2009 he was "meh". 2010, the running game actually improved when Davin went out. Last year, he was manhandled and constantly missed blocks. It was without a doubt, a terrible year. What makes things even funnier...he made the pro bowl. What a joke.

Even this preseason, that whole Pats game, he was getting shoved 2-3 yards back into the back field and was bad in run blocking. Davin is highly overrated. Yea..he is better than Larsen...but the Bucs would still be struggling in the run game...and the record this year would still be 1-3. Davin is not a game changer.

He is inconsistent and heavily overpaid.

Now that I think about it...Davin, Eric Wright, Quincy Black, Trueblood, Michael Clayton, Derrick Ward, Tanard Jackson, Sean Jones, Antonio Bryant, Alvin Harper and Bert Emanuel will head up the cast of the Buc's 11...a ocean's 11-type story in which 11 football players blatantly steal money from a franchise. Coming soon to a redbox near you.


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McCoy93

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#209 : October 10, 2012, 05:31:12 PM

QB has to be in discussion especially if Freeman continues his play. I just dont know how early the bucs would be willing to take a QB
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