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dbucfan

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#15 : November 24, 2012, 02:30:37 PM

Oh Lord - I meant to join the thread below this one.  My error. 

Inability to read...   Check.
Inability to Modify a post...  Check.




It won't be long - 'you're not a true bucs fan unless' is coming...
Inability to add anything of value to the convo...  Priceless (yet typically expected).



WTF DBF...?  Not being able to see that Freeman's a legitimate franchise quarterback does NOT determine whether or not "you're a true Bucs fan".

It determines if someone has an ounce of common football knowledge...!  Period.
Tenth post - and there you go - another standard for whether one is a "true Bucs fan" or not. 

And no - you know the topic was the fans because you wrote the intro to make fans the subject - not the evaluation of Freeman.  And it is pretty easy argument to win - right now - that Freeman isn't a franchise qb.  WInning games doesn't get one to that level - winning something does.  And so far the bucs have won games - but nothing more - yet.  So the call is premature.  imvho. 

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

lolTampa

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#16 : November 24, 2012, 02:31:58 PM

He's a functionable QB.  He didn't look franchise-like for most of the Panther's game until the end, did he?   He's no Aaron Rodgers or Tom Brady, but he's no Byron Leftwich either. I'd say he's about middle of the pack in the NFL right now. Not upper echelon.

He has shown flashes of being a top 5 QB though. If he becomes consistent he IS a top 5 QB.


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#17 : November 24, 2012, 02:32:56 PM

He's a functionable QB.  He didn't look franchise-like for most of the Panther's game until the end, did he?   He's no Aaron Rodgers or Tom Brady, but he's no Byron Leftwich either. I'd say he's about middle of the pack in the NFL right now. Not upper echelon.

That play at the end of the game was unreal. Your right he's not Brady or Rodgers but he's on the outside looking in at 24 years old. He keeps making plays like that he will find himself there.

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#18 : November 24, 2012, 02:33:05 PM

And anyone can come back later and say "I knew it!" Good for the OP for having the stones to call it.

dbucfan

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#19 : November 24, 2012, 02:34:13 PM

He's a functionable QB.  He didn't look franchise-like for most of the Panther's game until the end, did he?   He's no Aaron Rodgers or Tom Brady, but he's no Byron Leftwich either. I'd say he's about middle of the pack in the NFL right now. Not upper echelon.

He has shown flashes of being a top 5 QB though. If he becomes consistent he IS a top 5 QB.
I agree - the potential is there. 

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

Morgan

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#20 : November 24, 2012, 02:41:00 PM

And anyone can come back later and say "I knew it!" Good for the OP for having the stones to call it.

Stones?

Please, it's not big risk to say he's a franchise QB during a 4 game winning streak.

Try doing it during a 10-game losing streak that we were mired in no less than a season ago.

1sparkybuc

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#21 : November 24, 2012, 03:50:41 PM

Oh Lord - I meant to join the thread below this one.  My error. 

Inability to read...   Check.
Inability to Modify a post...  Check.




It won't be long - 'you're not a true bucs fan unless' is coming...
Inability to add anything of value to the convo...  Priceless (yet typically expected).



WTF DBF...?  Not being able to see that Freeman's a legitimate franchise quarterback does NOT determine whether or not "you're a true Bucs fan".

It determines if someone has an ounce of common football knowledge...!  Period.
Tenth post - and there you go - another standard for whether one is a "true Bucs fan" or not. 

And no - you know the topic was the fans because you wrote the intro to make fans the subject - not the evaluation of Freeman.  And it is pretty easy argument to win - right now - that Freeman isn't a franchise qb.  WInning games doesn't get one to that level - winning something does.  And so far the bucs have won games - but nothing more - yet.  So the call is premature.  imvho.

Apply that same logic to Dan Marino. I believe most people would rank him a "franchise" QB. He just missed out on winning something, and never got back again.

Very shortly, Freeman will own most season and career records at QB for the Bucs. When you consider the conditions he's endured, that's one hell of an accomplishment. He's clearly superior to any other QB this team has had. We traded away the only other QB who could be considered to San Francisco, and would have faded away in history in Tampa. It's no contest. Freeman is our first an only franchise QB.

Benchwarmer#1

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#22 : November 24, 2012, 04:05:30 PM

Oh Lord - I meant to join the thread below this one.  My error. 

Inability to read...   Check.
Inability to Modify a post...  Check.




It won't be long - 'you're not a true bucs fan unless' is coming...
Inability to add anything of value to the convo...  Priceless (yet typically expected).



WTF DBF...?  Not being able to see that Freeman's a legitimate franchise quarterback does NOT determine whether or not "you're a true Bucs fan".

It determines if someone has an ounce of common football knowledge...!  Period.
Tenth post - and there you go - another standard for whether one is a "true Bucs fan" or not. 

And no - you know the topic was the fans because you wrote the intro to make fans the subject - not the evaluation of Freeman.  And it is pretty easy argument to win - right now - that Freeman isn't a franchise qb.  WInning games doesn't get one to that level - winning something does.  And so far the bucs have won games - but nothing more - yet.  So the call is premature.  imvho.

Apply that same logic to Dan Marino. I believe most people would rank him a "franchise" QB. He just missed out on winning something, and never got back again.

Very shortly, Freeman will own most season and career records at QB for the Bucs. When you consider the conditions he's endured, that's one hell of an accomplishment. He's clearly superior to any other QB this team has had. We traded away the only other QB who could be considered to San Francisco, and would have faded away in history in Tampa. It's no contest. Freeman is our first an only franchise QB.

The last part I completely agree with. Freeman is the only true franchise QB the Bucs have ever had.

Others came close, Brad did his part, but none of them were a true franchise QB.

dbucfan

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#23 : November 24, 2012, 04:38:51 PM

Apply that same logic to Dan Marino. I believe most people would rank him a "franchise" QB. He just missed out on winning something, and never got back again.

Very shortly, Freeman will own most season and career records at QB for the Bucs. When you consider the conditions he's endured, that's one hell of an accomplishment. He's clearly superior to any other QB this team has had. We traded away the only other QB who could be considered to San Francisco, and would have faded away in history in Tampa. It's no contest. Freeman is our first an only franchise QB.
If I recall correctly a team has to win their conference to get to the SB.  Now a team can be a wild card, but mostly win their division to get into the tournament.  So Marino was a winner right off the bat.  And you can follow his career, as it wasn't the only time the Dolphins won a division championship, though only winning the conference that one time.  If curious however, one could read about Marino's statistics - and wonder how in the world the Dolphins managed not to visit the Super Bowl another time or two. 

And if one can't see the difference between the rookie and early years of Marino and that of Freeman - well there is no point in having a conversation. 

There - the logic is applied - and while I still have high hopes for Freeman and the bucs - they are found wanting with the Marino & Dolphins comparison. 

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

Pepsi

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#24 : November 24, 2012, 04:41:12 PM

I still have doubts. He still plays erratic. Glad he's good enough to win with one of the best running backs in the leagues and one of the best receiving cores in the league though. He actually played bad last game except a couple of good throws at the end.



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#25 : November 24, 2012, 04:56:07 PM

Freeman is a franchise QB. The mistakes he's made just means he is a young franchise QB.


1sparkybuc

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#26 : November 24, 2012, 05:11:17 PM

Apply that same logic to Dan Marino. I believe most people would rank him a "franchise" QB. He just missed out on winning something, and never got back again.

Very shortly, Freeman will own most season and career records at QB for the Bucs. When you consider the conditions he's endured, that's one hell of an accomplishment. He's clearly superior to any other QB this team has had. We traded away the only other QB who could be considered to San Francisco, and would have faded away in history in Tampa. It's no contest. Freeman is our first an only franchise QB.
If I recall correctly a team has to win their conference to get to the SB.  Now a team can be a wild card, but mostly win their division to get into the tournament.  So Marino was a winner right off the bat.  And you can follow his career, as it wasn't the only time the Dolphins won a division championship, though only winning the conference that one time.  If curious however, one could read about Marino's statistics - and wonder how in the world the Dolphins managed not to visit the Super Bowl another time or two. 

And if one can't see the difference between the rookie and early years of Marino and that of Freeman - well there is no point in having a conversation. 

There - the logic is applied - and while I still have high hopes for Freeman and the bucs - they are found wanting with the Marino & Dolphins comparison.

And if another can't see the difference between Raheem Morris and his revamped squad and Don Shula and his well established veteran team- you are right about at least one thing, there is no possibility of an intelligent conversation here.

dbucfan

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#27 : November 24, 2012, 06:08:04 PM

You do know that isn't the topic right?  Comparing Morris to Shula is a waste of time - something like comparing a guy who hasn't won anything yet to a guy in the HOF.  I am glad to see you figured out the limitations of your proposition.  Now let Freeman grow into a franchise qb by showing he can win a division title or better. 

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

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#28 : November 24, 2012, 06:23:09 PM

Bucs will have to make a decision on him after next year at the latest.

dbucfan

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#29 : November 24, 2012, 06:25:06 PM

I think that decision is made already cyber - if the deal can be achieved without franchising him.  Then we will see where Josh's ceiling is...

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant
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