Welcome, Guest
Pewter Report  >>  Boards  >>  The Red Board (Moderators: 3rd String Kicker, PRPatrol)  >>  Topic: Should the Bucs sign QB Josh Freeman to long-term extension now? « previous next »
Page: 1 ... 4 5 6 7 8 ... 82

acacius

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 4905
Offline
#75 : December 06, 2012, 04:54:24 PM

I like the comparison to Flacco but I think Freeman is worth more to this team than Flacco is to Baltimore. Thats why I think we will see Freeman get resigned this summer. The Bucs need to take some pressure off of Freeman and say your our guy. Flacco can be a game manager for Baltimore and they will still win games. Freeman needs to shine for this team to win games. If Freeman doesnt play well, chances are this team loses.
FWIW, Baltimore doesn't really have an elite defense anymore.  Sure, they're not as bad as the Bucs' defense, but they aren't really a team anymore than just needs a game manager.

BucNY

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 7776
Offline
#76 : December 06, 2012, 05:04:30 PM

Coddling? How exactly is him throwing 50/50 jump balls coddling? How is him throwing for more yards in any 4 games in a row coddling? I'm afraid your bias is showing here sir.

I am a fan of good players and winning. You are a fan of being right. I hated the Freeman pick but as someone who likes to win he is exactly what we need here. What we need to do is find a CB who can contest a throw and we'll all be surprised how good we feel about him.

The problem is he loses the shootouts against other top 10 QBs because he has to deal with a pass rush and defenders trying to knock the ball down. Peyton Manning didn't have to deal with either one of those things on Sunday. Same can be said with Matt Ryan and Drew Brees.

\\\\\\\"This forum needs a poster like BucNY now more than ever\\\\\\\"
      - Everyone

BucBalla85

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 18424
Offline
#77 : December 06, 2012, 05:05:52 PM

The Bucs need to take some pressure off of Freeman and say your our guy.

Could not disagree more. What the Bucs have always needed is someone to push Freeman. Enough coddling.

I know what you mean and Im not against that. I just notice his confidence is a little off when he starts to make mistakes. I dont think we need another guy to make Freeman look over his shoulder. I think he cant be afraid of making mistakes and your a little more likely to be that way if you got somebody behind you threatening to take your job. If hes the guy, hes gotta be the guy.

chace1986

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 13372
Offline
#78 : December 06, 2012, 05:11:21 PM

Freeman is at or near the top in several important statistics for passing. If you see a guy who defense don't have to focus on, you must be watching a different game than everyone else.

Playing well enough to beat quality teams and secure a playoff spot > being near the top of "several important statistics in passing"

several important statistics in passing = cherry picked stats that don't tell the whole story

whole story = In 3.5 years, Freeman has not been able to step up and deliver against quality opponents in the middle of a playoff run.


Until preseason, you stay classy Red Board.

TheAman

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 2492
Offline
#79 : December 06, 2012, 05:12:59 PM


The problem is he loses the shootouts against other top 10 QBs because he has to deal with a pass rush and defenders trying to knock the ball down. Peyton Manning didn't have to deal with either one of those things on Sunday. Same can be said with Matt Ryan and Drew Brees.

He's not a top 10 QB right now.  He might be at some point, but he's not now.  And it's fine that he's not, you can offer him a long term deal if he's not, though I'd hesitate til next year just like the Ravens are doing.  But saying he's a top 10 QB (forgive me if you aren't, when you say other, that implies that he is) is wrong.

Chief Joseph

User is banned from postingMuted
******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 4309
Offline
#80 : December 06, 2012, 05:15:18 PM


I hope you're wrong, Balla, 'cause if that's the case he's not cut out for the NFL.

NY seems to be out in left field mumbling to himself.

Illuminator is a good poster. He sticks to his guns and makes good points. Some don\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\'t like that.

Feel Real Good

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 27528
Offline
#81 : December 06, 2012, 05:27:17 PM

Freeman is better than Flacco. Freeman is currently or has already been top 11 in QB rating twice and top 10 in TD's twice in four years. Flacco has been playing five years and has only had a QB rating higher than #13 once and the highest he's ever been for passing TD's is #10 once.

FRG is the most logical poster on this board.  You guys just don\'t like where the logical conclusions take you.

TheAman

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 2492
Offline
#82 : December 06, 2012, 05:29:46 PM

So...is Alex Smith a better QB than Freeman?  If you believe that Passer Rating should be the biggest factor in ranking QBs, you have to say yes.  I think Passer Rating, while ok to look at, is an incredibly flawed stat.

BucBalla85

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 18424
Offline
#83 : December 06, 2012, 05:33:12 PM


I hope you're wrong, Balla, 'cause if that's the case he's not cut out for the NFL.


I would agree with the point your trying to make because if hes not confident after some mistakes or because theres a capable back up he may not be strong enough to play consistently at this level. From my observations, when hes feeling good and confident hes as good as anybody. As anybody would be when they are feeling confident. The idea should be to keep his confidence up. Not worrying about messing up. I think at 24 years old, the pressure to be a starting QB in the NFL is bigger than anything most 24 year olds would deal with. So I can see why he would get a little rattled sometimes or how he would if there were somebody behind him threatening to take his job. Its not easy. For me personally, I just think he needs some time where we say your the guy. Take it as far as you want to go. Then if he slips up then your back out looking for a QB again. Im also just not a fan of the QB controversy. I think SF situation could hurt them in this year they are trying to win it all. Both guys playing well but you dont know who to start. Can cause some separation in the locker room and thats not something you want. For a 24 year old, hes not quite ready for that yet.

Feel Real Good

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 27528
Offline
#84 : December 06, 2012, 05:33:57 PM

So...is Alex Smith a better QB than Freeman?  If you believe that Passer Rating should be the biggest factor in ranking QBs, you have to say yes.  I think Passer Rating, while ok to look at, is an incredibly flawed stat.
I think Smith played legitimately well this year and the fact that his QB rating is much higher than it's ever been in his career demonstrates it. The one criticism would be his play in the red zone as he hasn't had a ton of TD's and while San Francisco does score a lot on the ground, they don't score at a totally obscene level. I tend to believe he was leaving points out there.

FRG is the most logical poster on this board.  You guys just don\'t like where the logical conclusions take you.

TheAman

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 2492
Offline
#85 : December 06, 2012, 05:39:27 PM

Hey, he's been in the top 10 each of the past two years.  But nobody would say he's a top 10 QB. 

The St. Louis game coming up will be a titanic game for Freeman.  They are a perfectly average NFL defense.  We've seen him succeed against the bottom-dwellers, we've seen him have issues with the good teams.  He's had mixed results against the middle of the league, so we need to see that pick up.

chace1986

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 13372
Offline
#86 : December 06, 2012, 05:43:02 PM

The age thing is bullsh*t. The dude has been in the league since 2009. While Freeman and Russell Wilson might be the same age, Russell Wilson is on the cusp of doing something that Freeman hasn't yet accomplished...LEAD his team to the postseason. Also, while fighting for a playoff spot, Wilson went into Chicago and beat a division leader in December. Nothing Freeman has done in 3.5 years comes close to what a rookie his same age accomplished.

Saying "he is 24", is giving him a pass for not being able to do anything but build up useless stats.


Until preseason, you stay classy Red Board.

Feel Real Good

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 27528
Offline
#87 : December 06, 2012, 05:43:29 PM

Hey, he's been in the top 10 each of the past two years.  But nobody would say he's a top 10 QB. 
By QB rating, yes, but as I said he doesn't throw a lot of TD passes, so on one hand when he plays well he's really efficient but he's not too high on the list of playmaking QB's. There's not much of an element of danger to him.

FRG is the most logical poster on this board.  You guys just don\'t like where the logical conclusions take you.

TheAman

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 2492
Offline
#88 : December 06, 2012, 05:46:10 PM

I'm just illustrating the danger of using Passer Rating as a valid statistic.  I think right now, most people would put Freeman and Flacco within the same tier, whoever they have above the other.  A pretty good QB, probably just outside the top 10 somewhere between 12-15, shows flashes of greatness, but not the total package yet. 

Feel Real Good

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 27528
Offline
#89 : December 06, 2012, 05:46:17 PM

The age thing is bullsh*t. The dude has been in the league since 2009. While Freeman and Russell Wilson might be the same age, Russell Wilson is on the cusp of doing something that Freeman hasn't yet accomplished...LEAD his team to the postseason. Also, while fighting for a playoff spot, Wilson went into Chicago and beat a division leader in December. Nothing Freeman has done in 3.5 years comes close to what a rookie his same age accomplished.

Saying "he is 24", is giving him a pass for not being able to do anything but build up useless stats.
Wilson is playing better than I ever thought he would, but he's won 4 games in which the opponent has scored 12 points or less. The Bucs have allowed an opponent to score fewer than 16 points once.

FRG is the most logical poster on this board.  You guys just don\'t like where the logical conclusions take you.
Page: 1 ... 4 5 6 7 8 ... 82
Pewter Report  >>  Boards  >>  The Red Board (Moderators: 3rd String Kicker, PRPatrol)  >>  Topic: Should the Bucs sign QB Josh Freeman to long-term extension now? « previous next »
:

Hide Tools Show Tools