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michael89156

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« : December 12, 2012, 12:26:33 AM »



For the Buccanners, the 12th Man is Not a Good Thing

Dec 11th, 2012 at 7:12 pm by Leo Howell

 




 
I don’t think there is a medium of sports discussion that produces more frustrating and poorly fashioned opinions than talk radio. Without fail, sports talk personalities come to the mic with outlandish opinions that they might not actually totally believe in an effort to drive ratings and inspire discussion.
 
This morning on local Tampa area sports talk station 620 AM WDAE, Tom Jones of the Tampa Bay Times was discussing with Rick Stroud about the 12 men on the field call that has haunted the Buccaneers for two consecutive weeks. His opinion was that, as long as a player is moving off the field and is outside the numbers, there should not be a flag.
 
Rick Stroud in the studio, and Leo in his car both had the same reaction… “Do you understand football?”
 
Substitution strategy has become a serious part of the NFL game, and the rules are in place because football is an 11 on 11 sport, no questions asked. The possibilities of allowing a 12th man on the field, for any reason, opens up a can of worms that is completely unneeded and will only cause more problems.
 
Trick plays involving a man leaving the field or coming onto the field late would cause issues worse than the “Fail Mary.” More importantly, rules are meant to be followed and called consistently, and the NFL already struggles with rules that have absolutely no level of consistency (holding, block in the back, illegal contact and pass interference, even group celebration).
 
The underlying issue is that we are making excuses for a team that continues to show a lack of discipline. Under lame duck Raheem Morris last season, the Buccaneers were top 5 in penalties. This season, under “disciplinarian” Greg Schiano, the Buccaneers are just outside of the top 5, with penalties affecting the final drive of multiple games this season for the Buccaneers.
 
There might be a “Buccaneer Way”, but it’s not translating onto the field by way of discipline, and with Josh Freeman’s outbursts this past weekend, combined with the suspensions and accusations of illegal substances, maybe there’s still a long road left to traverse before a Buccaneer Way is truly in place?
 
I have shouted at my television multiple times this season to “Stop playing like Raheem is still there…” and I believe the Buccaneers have a ways to go to ensure that happens. A team that struggles to make consistent plays on either side of the ball will never succeed with a high penalty count, and discipline is something Schiano preached in the offseason. It’s time to practice what he preached.
 



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Follow @ThePewterPlank for the latest Buccaneers news.

MagicMike

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« #1 : December 12, 2012, 02:02:45 PM »

For me, what made the "12 men on the field" penalty absolutely inexcusable this week was that it occurred while the Eagles were obviously trying to spike the ball.  Why on earth would we need to substitute until after the spike?  Then, we could have called a timeout to make substitutions.  Instead of a 2nd down and 10, the penalty gave the Eagles a 1st down and 5.  Interestingly, the Eagles threw incomplete passes on 1st, 2nd, and 3rd downs before completing the 21yd pass to Jason Avant to the 1 on 4th down.  The penalty gave them the extra play that they used to set up the game winning pass. 

JavaRay

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« #2 : December 12, 2012, 02:06:19 PM »

I've never seen a team get caught with 12 on the field as often as the Bucs.   Schiano is so college.


chace1986

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« #3 : December 12, 2012, 02:42:05 PM »

http://www.nflpenalties.com/penalty/defensive-12-on-field?year=2012

« : December 12, 2012, 02:45:52 PM chace1986 »


JavaRay

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« #4 : December 12, 2012, 02:43:05 PM »

http://www.nflpenalties.com/penalty/defensive-12-on-field?year=2012

The Bucs lead the league in something!


NotDeadYet

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« #5 : December 12, 2012, 03:21:48 PM »

    Is there another team sport where substitutions are allowed WITHOUT a stoppage of play? I thought the refs were supposed to hold onto the ball until subs had gotten lined up after Tom Brady a few years ago kept doing that quick snap and NFL brass didn't like that. The refs don't seem to be doing that...

DonkeyHunter

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« #6 : December 12, 2012, 03:30:39 PM »

http://www.nflpenalties.com/penalty/defensive-12-on-field?year=2012

The Bucs lead the league in something!


I'm pretty sure they lead the league in rushing defense at 78.2 yards per game.

In many bassin\' circles, trolling is often considered the lowest form of fishing - Jim Porter

BaghdadJoe54

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« #7 : December 12, 2012, 03:39:48 PM »

The penalty last Sunday was just horrible.  Everyone on earth knew they were going to spike it.  Well, obviously not everyone but ya know what I mean.

Benchwarmer#1

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« #8 : December 12, 2012, 05:33:46 PM »

http://www.nflpenalties.com/penalty/defensive-12-on-field?year=2012

The Bucs lead the league in something!


I'm pretty sure they lead the league in rushing defense at 78.2 yards per game.

And +20 yard passes.

Naismith was right about Revis. Everyone else is a dummy.

The Anti-Java

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« #9 : December 12, 2012, 08:08:43 PM »

I hate that penalty.  If the guy is one step from the sideline, he obviously is not part of the play. Maybe they address it in the offseason.  Guys like Peyton watch for it, and exploit it as much as he can.   I guess they feel it is an easy 5 yards, why not.



olafberserker

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« #10 : December 12, 2012, 08:10:56 PM »

I hate that penalty.  If the guy is one step from the sideline, he obviously is not part of the play. Maybe they address it in the offseason.  Guys like Peyton watch for it, and exploit it as much as he can.   I guess they feel it is an easy 5 yards, why not.

agreed

Boid Fink

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« #11 : December 12, 2012, 08:28:01 PM »

Bellicheat has no issues with it.  He exploits rules and has a fundamental understanding of all the minutiae involved in being a NFL coach.  S is light years from that, and will never be that.

How hard is it to get a sub package in there?  Apparently for a group of ill prepared men, it is quite easy, and lessons never get learned. 


The Anti-Java

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« #12 : December 12, 2012, 08:34:08 PM »

They should differentiate between 12 men in the huddle, and this BS of a guy being one step from the sideline, big difference.



Boid Fink

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« #13 : December 12, 2012, 08:36:39 PM »

You exploit rules that are in place.  Or you prepare to deal with these things.  They are football players and coaches...not rocket scientists. Shame on you coaches for being so damned stupid as to not be aware of this.


gone

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« #14 : December 12, 2012, 08:40:47 PM »

They should differentiate between 12 men in the huddle, and this BS of a guy being one step from the sideline, big difference.

The only reason you are whining about it is because we got caught by it two weeks in a row. 
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