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Naismith

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#15 : December 17, 2012, 12:54:41 PM

As high as Welker?

No, but still pretty high. I don't think he's as good as Welker and sure seems to get injured too frequently.

I think both guys would be a good fit for the team, but with Jackson getting eleventy billion per year and Mike Williams a year or two away from a new deal, I'd be surprised if they brought in any WR that commands a big deal.

There\'s a very real chance the Bucs waive [Revis] before next season. At the very least, it will be a discussion worth having.

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#16 : December 17, 2012, 01:04:39 PM

pass rush - if we want a consistent pressure from a 4-3 defense then we need a lot.  i really like the bowers/clayborn/bennett trio, but i like it because its more of a stop the run on the way to harassing the QB.  i dont think any of those guys are consistent 15 sack a year guys (which i think many here want/expect).  if we want to stop blitzing, we need serious upgrades at DE and DT, and that means serious resources imo.

secondary - i liked the wright signing, but i hope the experiment is over.  i think he's got a certain skillset that can be adequately replaced by johnson/gaitor.  i like biggers as a depth guy, he does seem to be improving but he always gives up the big one to a no-namer.  i would like to see our serious resources put into CB, although i really dont know what type of DB schiano wants.  if DRC's head is straight go for it, i like the local story and potential.  i also really like sean smith even though he has faults.  those 2 guys with biggers/johnson/gaitor would be a nice 5 imo.

backup RB - definitely.  everyone (including me) gets excited about the big names but we can get what we need with nobodies imo.  ivory, javarris williams (i like) and dozens of other guys can hit the hole hard and be proficient with the playbook.

slot WR - underwood has underwhelmed this season.  i do like him on the roster, but possibly we could find a new slot guy.  welker is a joke imo.  no way we need resources tied into a slot WR.  the last thing i want is freeman throwing more 5 yard passes.   not to go offtopic, but a QB's timing/accuracy/comfort level go a long way with a slot WR.

LB - khasem greene seems the obvious choice but that would tie up a 2nd/3rd for a player that leaves the field a lot.  time to sink or swim with hayward/watson/some new 6th round warrior.  i still dream about acquiring jarvis jones as our von miller, but thats a pipedream.

TE - i really like zach ertz, but i only saw the oregon game.  was very impressed by his hands.  i would like to see stocker get one more year, agree i like bynam...so not really sure what to do what to do.

This.

I would also possibly add depth to the o-line.

But, CB is by far our biggest need. Nothing else comes even close other than possibly pass rush, but with Clayborn back next year and Bowers at 100%, I think our pass rush may not be too bad.


Naismith

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#17 : December 17, 2012, 01:25:39 PM

It's really a shame that Brian Price didn't work out. I think in the magical land of no injuries, a Bowers/Bennett, Clayborn/DTN, GMC/Miller/Price rotation could be real dangerous. I absolutely believe that CB help is irrelevant without improved QB pressure, but I'm starting to come around to the notion that the players are in-house and just need to stay healthy (which is definitely a tall order). The blitz is great when it works, but the best of the best QBs just tear it apart.

There\'s a very real chance the Bucs waive [Revis] before next season. At the very least, it will be a discussion worth having.

GameTime

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#18 : December 17, 2012, 01:33:43 PM

i called welker a joke as in the thoughts of him coming to tampa.  no way we can give another contract like that to a WR...especially a WR whose game is based on accuracy, timing, and familiarity with the QB

\"Lets put the O back in Country\"

TBayXXXVII

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#19 : December 17, 2012, 01:35:09 PM

I'd focus primarily on CB's, a RT, and a C.  If a LT upgrade oppertunity presents itself, it should be taken, but I wouldn't actively look for one.  There are plenty of teams out there that would love to have Penn.  While he's not great, he is a solid starter.  I wouldn't bother at all with a QB.  Honestly, I think that if they brought in someone reasonable, they'd beat out Freeman for the starting job.  I'm still ok with giving Freeman next year only because I don't think there's a franchise QB in this draft.  Now, if Alex Smith or Phillip Rivers becomes available and the Bucs were to obtain one, the Bucs should be able to take advantage of the QB-needy teams and get maybe a 2nd round pick for Freeman.

I think they'd be able to get at least 1 CB and either a RT or C in free agency and then the other CB and other lineman in the draft.  Outside of that, I'd look for a receiver who could get open in the middle of the field and catch the ball...  a guy like Amendola comes to mind.  Ryan S**CENSORED**e is a guy in the draft who could fit that bill as well.  Having someone like him could force the CB's and safties to respect the underneath a little more.

Edit: Just in case the Censored crap disguises the player I mentioned, it the kid from A&M S.w.o.p.e.

Wow, can't believe that name was censored.

As a rule, I don't think you can ever go wrong drafting linemen on either side of the ball. Specifically about Dotson, hasn't he been pretty impressive for a first-year starter and a guy so inexperienced at football?

Yeah, it was the middle 3 letters that drew the ire of big brother.

With Dotson, I thought that when Trueblood got hurt, the mention of Dotson playing there was just a stop gap and that he was best suited for the guard position.  That was the reason for my post, it's very possible that I misread it.

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#20 : December 17, 2012, 01:39:03 PM

Number 1 priority is to cut the cord and let freeman go.  As long as he's our qb, we arent going anywhere.  After that is secondary.

TBayXXXVII

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#21 : December 17, 2012, 01:39:04 PM

I think Amendola is going to command a pretty high salary.

Really?  I don't think so.  The guy was a solid return man, but all he's shown over the past 2 seasons is that he's not very durable.  He has good hands, but he's primarily a short yardage specialist... I can't imagine a demand for him would be out there to warrent him getting much more than $2 or $3M per year on a 2 or 3 year deal.  Maybe because of his durability issues, he's probably a guy not worth targeting, but his skill set would have value on this team.

NotDeadYet

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#22 : December 17, 2012, 02:26:53 PM

     After the last 2 games, I think QB may have entered Schiano's mind as a necessary upgrade for us to be able to play with the NFL's big boys. Whether he thinks Josh can reach the level needed, will be unfolding... And I don't think he's a patient man...
     For those that consider CB our greatest need, consider this; The Eagles and Jets have invested huge $$ in big-name CB's the last few years and look where that got'em. Food for thought.
     Whether we need to get new players or just improve and coach up guys already on our roster or PS, I'll leave up to the coaches.
     My top 5 positions: QB, DT, CB, WR, RB. I think there is talent already there at DE, but is very raw. They get penetration, but QB's easily step up into an almost-always uncollapsed pocket to get off their pass. I think they can be coached up.
     I like Noble as an athletic TE; it will be interested to see if he can stay healthy and contribute next season.

Naismith

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#23 : December 17, 2012, 02:44:06 PM

Really?  I don't think so.  The guy was a solid return man, but all he's shown over the past 2 seasons is that he's not very durable.  He has good hands, but he's primarily a short yardage specialist... I can't imagine a demand for him would be out there to warrent him getting much more than $2 or $3M per year on a 2 or 3 year deal.  Maybe because of his durability issues, he's probably a guy not worth targeting, but his skill set would have value on this team.

I think he'll get closer to 5-6 million, but admittedly, I'm just guessing. Most fantasy football players are big Amendola fans, so I could be biased by listening to them rave about him as well.

There\'s a very real chance the Bucs waive [Revis] before next season. At the very least, it will be a discussion worth having.

TBayXXXVII

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#24 : December 17, 2012, 02:51:48 PM

Really?  I don't think so.  The guy was a solid return man, but all he's shown over the past 2 seasons is that he's not very durable.  He has good hands, but he's primarily a short yardage specialist... I can't imagine a demand for him would be out there to warrent him getting much more than $2 or $3M per year on a 2 or 3 year deal.  Maybe because of his durability issues, he's probably a guy not worth targeting, but his skill set would have value on this team.

I think he'll get closer to 5-6 million, but admittedly, I'm just guessing. Most fantasy football players are big Amendola fans, so I could be biased by listening to them rave about him as well.

I just looked up his deal, at the beginning of the season he apparently signed a 1 year (virtually) $2M deal.  I'd say there's a decent chance that any deal he gets probably would fall right in the middle of where you and I think he could be.... possibly a $4M per deal.  If that's the case, I might tagert the kid from A&M and if I miss... take a run at Amendola.  If Amendola signs before the draft, I might make a move to jump up and get the kid.

dexmonkey

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#25 : December 17, 2012, 02:56:52 PM

     After the last 2 games, I think QB may have entered Schiano's mind as a necessary upgrade for us to be able to play with the NFL's big boys. Whether he thinks Josh can reach the level needed, will be unfolding... And I don't think he's a patient man...
     For those that consider CB our greatest need, consider this; The Eagles and Jets have invested huge $$ in big-name CB's the last few years and look where that got'em. Food for thought.
     Whether we need to get new players or just improve and coach up guys already on our roster or PS, I'll leave up to the coaches.
     My top 5 positions: QB, DT, CB, WR, RB. I think there is talent already there at DE, but is very raw. They get penetration, but QB's easily step up into an almost-always uncollapsed pocket to get off their pass. I think they can be coached up.
     I like Noble as an athletic TE; it will be interested to see if he can stay healthy and contribute next season.

you are correct about the eagles but dead wrong about the jets. revis and cromartie is one of the best CB tandems in the league.

QB is not even in the cards for this draft. the qb class is very weak this year and frankly not worth it. theres going to be a lot of overdrafts this year because of how many teams need qbs and how few qbs there are available. if we can fix a few problems on defense we will win a bunch more games. you guys are overexagerating freeman as usual. just because hes up and down doesnt mean you can cut the cord and reach on another QB with all the other glaring issues on this team. im glad you guys arent GMs because this team would be absolute garbage

we need in this order
CB
CB
DT to pair with mccoy
TE if available.
LB
S
RB whatever is left its the 7th round

Naismith

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#26 : December 17, 2012, 03:08:54 PM

I just looked up his deal, at the beginning of the season he apparently signed a 1 year (virtually) $2M deal.  I'd say there's a decent chance that any deal he gets probably would fall right in the middle of where you and I think he could be.... possibly a $4M per deal.  If that's the case, I might tagert the kid from A&M and if I miss... take a run at Amendola.  If Amendola signs before the draft, I might make a move to jump up and get the kid.

Yeah, I can't see the Bucs paying a WR that much with Williams' new deal on the horizon. I do think Amendola would be an excellent fit, though.

we need in this order
CB
CB
DT to pair with mccoy
TE if available.
LB
S
RB whatever is left its the 7th round

I'm not in the CB camp as I've stated previously. I think QB pressure will take care of a lot of the CB issues and I'd rather they brought in a player with some experience rather than a rookie to solve the secondary concerns.

I quoted this because I was going to switch the S with TE, but, even though I think S is a bigger need, I think you can get better value out of a fourth round TE.

I would love for there to be a big time DT available in the first round.

There\'s a very real chance the Bucs waive [Revis] before next season. At the very least, it will be a discussion worth having.

Naismith

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#27 : December 17, 2012, 03:11:43 PM

As a point of reference from last year's WRs:

Laurent Robinson - 5 yr $32.5M (1, 2.6, 5.6, 6.4, FA)
Brandon Lloyd - 3 yr $12m (900k, 1.9, 2.9)
Mario Manningham - 2 yr $7.3m (1.2, 3.6)
Pierre Garcon - 5 yr $42.5m (2.1, 5.6, 7.1, 7.6, FA)

There\'s a very real chance the Bucs waive [Revis] before next season. At the very least, it will be a discussion worth having.

NotDeadYet

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#28 : December 17, 2012, 04:14:06 PM

     After the last 2 games, I think QB may have entered Schiano's mind as a necessary upgrade for us to be able to play with the NFL's big boys. Whether he thinks Josh can reach the level needed, will be unfolding... And I don't think he's a patient man...
     For those that consider CB our greatest need, consider this; The Eagles and Jets have invested huge $$ in big-name CB's the last few years and look where that got'em. Food for thought.
     Whether we need to get new players or just improve and coach up guys already on our roster or PS, I'll leave up to the coaches.
     My top 5 positions: QB, DT, CB, WR, RB. I think there is talent already there at DE, but is very raw. They get penetration, but QB's easily step up into an almost-always uncollapsed pocket to get off their pass. I think they can be coached up.
     I like Noble as an athletic TE; it will be interested to see if he can stay healthy and contribute next season.

you are correct about the eagles but dead wrong about the jets. revis and cromartie is one of the best CB tandems in the league.

QB is not even in the cards for this draft. the qb class is very weak this year and frankly not worth it. theres going to be a lot of overdrafts this year because of how many teams need qbs and how few qbs there are available. if we can fix a few problems on defense we will win a bunch more games. you guys are overexagerating freeman as usual. just because hes up and down doesnt mean you can cut the cord and reach on another QB with all the other glaring issues on this team. im glad you guys arent GMs because this team would be absolute garbage

we need in this order
CB
CB
DT to pair with mccoy
TE if available.
LB
S
RB whatever is left its the 7th round
   What I was referring to was the team's W/L record. My contention is generating a reasonably consistant PR is more important to an overall defense's effectiveness than stellar CB coverage. Without it, 8 Pro-Bowl CB's couldn't cover today's array of talented QB's, receivers, and clever OC's schemes to get them open. I really think part of our scheme of not covering closely at the snap is because our DC knows our PR is so inconsistant, so our DB's are constantly retreating from the LOS, making it easier to keep receivers in front of them. If we had a better PR, our CB's would, and I think they could, crowd opposing WR's much more. LJ especially is very quick and strong in short range, as is Gaitor. No question being young they need coaching up on their technique, but I think the raw physical skills are there...

Naismith

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#29 : December 17, 2012, 05:13:15 PM

What I was referring to was the team's W/L record. My contention is generating a reasonably consistant PR is more important to an overall defense's effectiveness than stellar CB coverage. Without it, 8 Pro-Bowl CB's couldn't cover today's array of talented QB's, receivers, and clever OC's schemes to get them open.

This is how I feel as well. I think bringing in high caliber CBs will just prove this point as they constantly get beat by QBs getting lots of time to throw. Further, I think it's extremely hard to judge the current CBs because they've been put in an impossible position.

There\'s a very real chance the Bucs waive [Revis] before next season. At the very least, it will be a discussion worth having.
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