The Demon? Cholesterol

[Durango 95]

So what's the big attraction in trying to scratch a couple of extra years out of life?

Wasting away in a nursing home, staving off death on a daily basis, that's isn't a life, it's just an existence. No thanks.

Well put. I recently had a close friend with an inoperable cancer that was given less than 6 months to live. JMO but I would have just asked to be put on morphine for the pain instead they made the guys remaining days a living hell ( chemo and radiation) since last September. He died a few weeks ago.   Horrible! All about the Benjamin's!

If I were told that I have only 6 months left that would make for an easy decision. Make the best of my remaining days and stay as far away from a hospital as possible. Spend as much time as I could w/ my family and do whatever I could to create the most value from the time I had left. Choosing chemo. & radiation would not even be a consideration. I agree, you always have to be aware of the profit motives involved w/ medical treatment. But, the individual always has the final choice, which I would never abdicate. Sorry about your friend.

[Morgan]

Yeah that must be why those drugs cost many, many times more here than anywhere else in the world. Big Pharm ain't ripping no one off.

Capitalism, I guess. Takes money to research and develop medications. No different than automakers charging for automobiles or Bill Gates asking $500 for a computer.  Do you feel companies shouldn't make a profit?

[VinBucFan]

Yeah that must be why those drugs cost many, many times more here than anywhere else in the world. Big Pharm ain't ripping no one off.

Capitalism, I guess. Takes money to research and develop medications. No different than automakers charging for automobiles or Bill Gates asking $500 for a computer.  Do you feel companies shouldn't make a profit?

Its actually completely different.  I can order a car or computer from Canada or France or China. Drug sales in this country are the opposite of capitalism in a sense although I think prices are lower in most other countries because of government involvement

[Morgan]

Yeah that must be why those drugs cost many, many times more here than anywhere else in the world. Big Pharm ain't ripping no one off.

Capitalism, I guess. Takes money to research and develop medications. No different than automakers charging for automobiles or Bill Gates asking $500 for a computer.  Do you feel companies shouldn't make a profit?

Its actually completely different.  I can order a car or computer from Canada or France or China. Drug sales in this country are the opposite of capitalism in a sense although I think prices are lower in most other countries because of government involvement

But you're unable to get medications for other counties? Canada, Mexico, France?   I'm baffled.

[VinBucFan]

Yeah that must be why those drugs cost many, many times more here than anywhere else in the world. Big Pharm ain't ripping no one off.

Capitalism, I guess. Takes money to research and develop medications. No different than automakers charging for automobiles or Bill Gates asking $500 for a computer.  Do you feel companies shouldn't make a profit?

Its actually completely different.  I can order a car or computer from Canada or France or China. Drug sales in this country are the opposite of capitalism in a sense although I think prices are lower in most other countries because of government involvement

But you're unable to get medications for other counties? Canada, Mexico, France?   I'm baffled.

This FDA fiction:

"We appreciate that there is a significant cost differential between drugs available here and those in other countries/areas. However, many drugs sold in foreign countries/areas as "foreign versions" of approved prescription drugs sold in the United States are often of unknown quality with inadequate directions for use and may pose a risk to the patient's health. FDA approves a drug on the basis of scientific data proving it to be safe and effective. FDA approved labeling provides information on how and when the drug can be used to maximize effectiveness and minimize any harmful side effects. The manufacturing facilities and procedures for approved products are also carefully regulated by FDA to ensure product integrity. Since FDA cannot assure the consumer that the drug purchased in the foreign country/area would be the same product his or her physician's prescription is written for, we recommend the product covered by the prescription be acquired in the United States"

leads to this:

"A three-month supply of the cholesterol drug Zocor costs $327.86 from U.S.-based Drugstore.com, but only $189.55 if ordered from the Manitoba-based Hometownmeds.com."

Zocor is an interesting example (even if a bit dated) because it was the subject of class action lawsuits here in the US.  So much for the fiction that "foreign versions" are dangerous and inadequately labeled :-).  Pills manufactured by Merck are of the same kind quality whether  distributed in the US or the UK. Merck would actually be served by having uniform labeling based on the country with the most restrictive laws BUT actually produces different labels for products outside the US.  Now why would it do that?

[Runole]

Yeah that must be why those drugs cost many, many times more here than anywhere else in the world. Big Pharm ain't ripping no one off.

Capitalism, I guess. Takes money to research and develop medications. No different than automakers charging for automobiles or Bill Gates asking $500 for a computer.  Do you feel companies shouldn't make a profit?

Its actually completely different.  I can order a car or computer from Canada or France or China. Drug sales in this country are the opposite of capitalism in a sense although I think prices are lower in most other countries because of government involvement

But you're unable to get medications for other counties? Canada, Mexico, France?   I'm baffled.

This FDA fiction:

"We appreciate that there is a significant cost differential between drugs available here and those in other countries/areas. However, many drugs sold in foreign countries/areas as "foreign versions" of approved prescription drugs sold in the United States are often of unknown quality with inadequate directions for use and may pose a risk to the patient's health. FDA approves a drug on the basis of scientific data proving it to be safe and effective. FDA approved labeling provides information on how and when the drug can be used to maximize effectiveness and minimize any harmful side effects. The manufacturing facilities and procedures for approved products are also carefully regulated by FDA to ensure product integrity. Since FDA cannot assure the consumer that the drug purchased in the foreign country/area would be the same product his or her physician's prescription is written for, we recommend the product covered by the prescription be acquired in the United States"

leads to this:

"A three-month supply of the cholesterol drug Zocor costs $327.86 from U.S.-based Drugstore.com, but only $189.55 if ordered from the Manitoba-based Hometownmeds.com."

Zocor is an interesting example (even if a bit dated) because it was the subject of class action lawsuits here in the US.  So much for the fiction that "foreign versions" are dangerous and inadequately labeled :-).  Pills manufactured by Merck are of the same kind quality whether  distributed in the US or the UK. Merck would actually be served by having uniform labeling based on the country with the most restrictive laws BUT actually produces different labels for products outside the US.  Now why would it do that?

Nailed it.   Our current medical system and big Pharma which controls it is a National disgrace!   The inflated costs of medications are absolutely repugnant and are not even close to what the real cost should be.   Much like the illicit drug industry charges $ thousands of dollars for drugs that cost pennies to make Big Pharma does the same thing to only a possibly a slightly less outrageous price.( though I am not sure this is actually true). When you go to a hospital and get charged  $25.00 for a single aspirin to the line of physicians that come into the patients room to sign a paper to get an outrageous amount of money for merely signing their name. They are even worse than what lawyers charge for their time.

Now we have Obamacare about to make things 100 times worse..     Is there any chance America can ever return to the great principles it was founded upon?   


Where can I sign up to be an "illegal alien"?

One listen to a TV advertisement for Cymbalta and can anyone seriously say  America is actually in a real WAR ON DRUGS?    Good Gawd!!

[Runole]

So what's the big attraction in trying to scratch a couple of extra years out of life?

Wasting away in a nursing home, staving off death on a daily basis, that's isn't a life, it's just an existence. No thanks.

Well put. I recently had a close friend with an inoperable cancer that was given less than 6 months to live. JMO but I would have just asked to be put on morphine for the pain instead they made the guys remaining days a living hell ( chemo and radiation) since last September. He died a few weeks ago.   Horrible! All about the Benjamin's!

If I were told that I have only 6 months left that would make for an easy decision. Make the best of my remaining days and stay as far away from a hospital as possible. Spend as much time as I could w/ my family and do whatever I could to create the most value from the time I had left. Choosing chemo. & radiation would not even be a consideration. I agree, you always have to be aware of the profit motives involved w/ medical treatment. But, the individual always has the final choice, which I would never abdicate. Sorry about your friend.

Thanks!

You and I are on the exact same page on this issue.  Unfortunately, the medical profession shamelessly promotes their completely horrible solutions with no conscience whatsoever.   His wife and the guy got sucked into the false hopes put forth by his doctors when the cancer was discovered.

It is absolutely insidious how every American gets sold this bill of goods that claims just take this medication and everything will be fine!   UGH!!!

I have had more than one experienced Nurse tell me that staying away from hospitals for just about everything would the best quality of life choice one could make.

Never have understood when someone gets a little sniffle the solution is to run to emergency room in a panic?  Also, rather interesting at the social strata of those that occupy the emergency rooms every Friday night? Might be some sort of psychological need to be taken care of by someone else?

[Morgan]

Surprised you haven't come out and complained that running shoes industry (Nike, Reebok, Asics)  isn't behind this so-called "exercise is good for you" conspiracy.

[Runole]

Surprised you haven't come out and complained that running shoes industry (Nike, Reebok, Asics)  isn't behind this so-called "exercise is good for you" conspiracy.

Comparing buying shoes with the health risks of an out of control medical and pharmaceutical industry is a valid comparison? 


News Flash! There are plenty of exercises that don't involve foot ware. Furthermore, there are many choices one can make on what type of foot ware one purchases.

Knowledge will set you free.  Take your head out of the sand.  Hey, I get it!  The purpose of your totally ignorant rantings and personal insults are well established.

From the responses others have towards you I can see why most hold you in such low regard.    JMO but I think when you state someone is dangerous you need to look in a mirror and see the SHEEP you have become. 

[VinBucFan]

Surprised you haven't come out and complained that running shoes industry (Nike, Reebok, Asics)  isn't behind this so-called "exercise is good for you" conspiracy.

maybe because of your profession you're missing the distinction between medicine and marketing. Even doctors that prescribe statins have questioned their efficacy. Statins are usually prescribed by doctors as one part of a broader strategy to deal with risk for heart and artery issues.  Drug companies that sells statins sell them as essential to avoiding heart attacks . .  even if the science is less clear.

[Runole]

Surprised you haven't come out and complained that running shoes industry (Nike, Reebok, Asics)  isn't behind this so-called "exercise is good for you" conspiracy.

maybe because of your profession you're missing the distinction between medicine and marketing. Even doctors that prescribe statins have questioned their efficacy. Statins are usually prescribed by doctors as one part of a broader strategy to deal with risk for heart and artery issues.  Drug companies that sells statins sell them as essential to avoiding heart attacks . .  even if the science is less clear.

Morgan indeed is missing a lot.  The sad part is he fights so hard to protect those institutions that are screwing over Americans every day. How dare anyone question doctors, Judges ,government officials, and major pharmaceutical corporations?  Everyone knows they speak the truth and are honestly interested in the health and well fare of US citizens.     Money what money?

[BucNY]

Arteriosclerosis from poor diet, genetics, hypertension, and tobacco use can cause heart attacks as early as 20-30 yrs of age. People with hypercholeterolemia because of genetics can benefit from lipid-reducing agents and antihypertensives, and prolong their life.  Happens every day in clinics and hospitals. Anyone that states that all these gov't, pharm, and commercial enterprises are scamming the public are suffering from a severe case of paranoia.

You and I seem to think very similar on this topic. The biggest trouble we have right now is the research that is behind many of our dietary reccomendations. For some reason nutritional research, as a whole, is very poor designed with many many variables not accounted for. Intentional or not, who's to say but following one variable over 5 years and blaming that variable for any changes is no scientifically correct.

Diet and exercise are key, some medications as well. The problem is we're not sure what a good diet is. Low fat? Low sugar? No carbs? Very muddled.