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Naismith

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#60 : February 03, 2013, 12:40:23 PM

I don't think anyone wants Freeman to become a different QB, they just want him to keep improving and become more consistent. When he's good, he's very, very good.

There\'s a very real chance the Bucs waive [Revis] before next season. At the very least, it will be a discussion worth having.

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#61 : February 03, 2013, 12:42:52 PM

I don't think anyone wants Freeman to become a different QB, they just want him to keep improving and become more consistent. When he's good, he's very, very good.

He has been unreliable and inconstant for four years. You want him to stop being that. That is different.


Naismith

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#62 : February 03, 2013, 02:06:38 PM

You are speaking in terms of absolutes but his inconsistency last season was different than 2011. If he improves from 2012 to 2013 like he did from 2011 to 2012, he'll be a great QB.

There\'s a very real chance the Bucs waive [Revis] before next season. At the very least, it will be a discussion worth having.

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#63 : February 03, 2013, 02:58:34 PM

Hopefully at this time next year, we are debating on should Freeman be tagged, or signed long term after his great 2013 season.


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#64 : February 03, 2013, 03:03:55 PM

Spools, I'm not trying to be a jerk or start an argument.....but that was complete gibberish.

His 2011 inconsistency is different than his 2012 inconsistency? Really? Can you understand how that sounds ridiculous to some folks?

Only difference I saw between 2011 and 2012, was Doug Martin and Vincent Jackson. Take away those two guys and Freeman looks just as bad as he did in 2011. Even with those two guys, he looked every bit as bad as 2011 in half the games this year. He is consistently inconsistent with his accuracy and decision making. I haven't seen any change in those areas. It was ok in 2009 and 2010 because he was young and there is a learning curve....but here we are 5 years into his career and he just finished the season playing awful making the same bad decisions and making the same horribly off target throws. At some point you have to stop making excuses and just admit that the guy has not improved at all since his rookie year. THAT is a huge red flag and a good reason to move on. 


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#65 : February 03, 2013, 03:07:47 PM

Well...he was less inconsistant anyway.  He had a pretty good stretch last season where he was ballin at a high level.  Now if he can progress in 2013 to playing at a high level the whole season, that will be progress.


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#66 : February 03, 2013, 03:11:20 PM

Five game stretch where he successfully threw jump balls deep and Jackson/Williams made great catches. Didn't hurt that Martin was going off and averaging 120 yards per game during that stretch. Also didn't hurt that we were playing the worst teams in the league during that 5 game span.

Before that span and after he sucked as usual.

I'm willing to bet we could easily find someone else to chuck it up deep and pray.


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#67 : February 03, 2013, 03:27:16 PM

Really?  Was Freeman playing in our secondary?  The Defense blew multiple leads.  In fact the passing defense was historically bad.  That has nothing to do with Freeman.  D-line and CB are the primary needs by far.  I dont see how there is any debate that those are out top needs but feel free to attempt to do so. ;)

This has been addressed in each of the 3 million Freeman threads, feel free to go look them over.

dont need to.  typical crap.  blame everything on the QB and assume that any replacement is an upgrade.  its smart thinking like that which keep teams like Bills, Browns, Chiefs, Jags, Raiders, blowing out QBs and coaching staffs every 2-3 years continually picking in the top 10.  the grass isnt always greener.

Who were the good QB's those teams you listed got rid of?

And those teams are changing QB's so often usually because they don't have a good QB.
Eggzactly.

And from what I am seeing out of the Bucs as of late, they seem to love blowing out their coaching staffs, and the W/L record is indicative of that.  And the guy running the ship is largely responsible.  Good QBs usually are in charge of good teams.  Usually.


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#68 : February 03, 2013, 04:15:19 PM

Don't worry, I don't take it personally when someone disagrees with me.

I think he was less inconsistent, but more importantly, his good was much better than his good from 2010. There was a bigger disparity from good to bad, but that's because his peak play was much better than the previous year.

There\'s a very real chance the Bucs waive [Revis] before next season. At the very least, it will be a discussion worth having.

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#69 : February 03, 2013, 04:48:43 PM

Hopefully at this time next year, we are debating on should Freeman be tagged, or signed long term after his great 2013 season.

This would be the best case for sure.
Just it seems a lot more likely to debate about keeping Freeman after a good but not great 2013 season, or lets say debate about letting walk a guy still having a few flaws at the age of 26.

I say try to trade him NOW. The what seems to be a weak draft class and FA class, QB wise, just makes Freeman more valuable. I would not have an issue throwing away our 2013 season, we will have to have found our QB after 2013 anyway. We either find him with a few more draft picks of the Freeman trade or we suck anyway. After 2013 we either overpay Freeman or find a new guy, getting nothing for Freeman. But if you think Freeman could be extendable after 2013, why not try to sign him to a cheap contract NOW? That's what i would do then, should we not be able to find a trade partner.

But just hoping for Freeman to suddenly break through next year seems naive, especially if you have doubts about his abilities already NOW anyway. We saw him for FOUR years, but now you wanna base your decision on ONE single year, 2013?

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#70 : February 03, 2013, 04:52:04 PM

Hopefully at this time next year, we are debating on should Freeman be tagged, or signed long term after his great 2013 season.

This would be the best case for sure.
Just it seems a lot more likely to debate about keeping Freeman after a good but not great 2013 season, or lets say debate about letting walk a guy still having a few flaws at the age of 26.

I say try to trade him NOW. The what seems to be a weak draft class and FA class, QB wise, just makes Freeman more valuable. I would not have an issue throwing away our 2013 season, we will have to have found our QB after 2013 anyway. We either find him with a few more draft picks of the Freeman trade or we suck anyway. After 2013 we either overpay Freeman or find a new guy, getting nothing for Freeman. But if you think Freeman could be extendable after 2013, why not try to sign him to a cheap contract NOW? That's what i would do then, should we not be able to find a trade partner.

But just hoping for Freeman to suddenly break through next year seems naive, especially if you have doubts about his abilities already NOW anyway. We saw him for FOUR years, but now you wanna base your decision on ONE single year, 2013?

Dude, I didn't know you had it in you.  That was actually a good post.  Kudos.   You must be reading my posts and learning.


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#71 : February 03, 2013, 04:58:10 PM

Hopefully at this time next year, we are debating on should Freeman be tagged, or signed long term after his great 2013 season.

This would be the best case for sure.
Just it seems a lot more likely to debate about keeping Freeman after a good but not great 2013 season, or lets say debate about letting walk a guy still having a few flaws at the age of 26.

I say try to trade him NOW. The what seems to be a weak draft class and FA class, QB wise, just makes Freeman more valuable. I would not have an issue throwing away our 2013 season, we will have to have found our QB after 2013 anyway. We either find him with a few more draft picks of the Freeman trade or we suck anyway. After 2013 we either overpay Freeman or find a new guy, getting nothing for Freeman. But if you think Freeman could be extendable after 2013, why not try to sign him to a cheap contract NOW? That's what i would do then, should we not be able to find a trade partner.

But just hoping for Freeman to suddenly break through next year seems naive, especially if you have doubts about his abilities already NOW anyway. We saw him for FOUR years, but now you wanna base your decision on ONE single year, 2013?




It is a pivotal year for him.   Why sign him now?  That would be the worst option IMO.  Say you sign him to a 4-5 year deal, and he comes out next season looking like crap, then you stuck with him long term.

I think they are doing what's best for the team. He shines in 2013, he gets rewarded, he stinks it up, sayonara baby.


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QaZ

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#72 : February 03, 2013, 06:06:50 PM



It is a pivotal year for him.   Why sign him now?  That would be the worst option IMO.  Say you sign him to a 4-5 year deal, and he comes out next season looking like crap, then you stuck with him long term.

I think they are doing what's best for the team. He shines in 2013, he gets rewarded, he stinks it up, sayonara baby.

Why should Freeman play like crap next year, and why should this mean Freeman does for the next 3-4 years? I guess he will have a few more average, good, but not great season.  There is a lot in between 'he shines' and 'he stinks'. Average is prolly most likely his future.

We can still pick almost everyone in the draft, IF we like him. Russel Wilson was an option for us last year, we passed, prolly because we thought Freeman would be better. Having Freeman does not hurt. Just without Freeman we are pretty much forced to draft one. Why do you think we can get a guy like Wilson, when we just passed on him? Desperatly looking for a great QB wont help here either.

Freeman is our insurance in case the QB we get plays like crap. A drafted QB playing like crap seems a lot more likely than Freeman really stinking it up.
Should we have found our elite QB, say sayonara to Freeman. I will drive him to the airport if needed. We might still be able to trade him for a late round pick than, especially if we sign him to a nice deal. At worst we have to take a big cap hit for ONE year. But then having having found our elite QB, this makes it a lot easier to get through such a year.
Indy cut Peyton. Why should Freeman refuse to sign a similar contract? Should we cut him in the next few years, he is still under 30. He should not be scared to become a FA. He might even get a bigger contract elsewhere.

Making a decision after 2013 will just work if Freeman finally shows he is the elite QB we all want him to be. But who does really think Freeman will do this NEXT year? The decision next year most likely will be a lot tougher than this year, having to franchise tag a non elite QB. Should Freeman win a SB elsewhere, so be it, but  i would feel better atleast having got something for him, a lot better than having him let walk for nothing, because he were not willing to pay him big when he still was mediocre.

Extending Freeman wont allow us to stop looking for upgrades at QB. The most important thing is to keep look for upgrades. Everyone on this team should be compared to outside players available, especially if you just finished 7-9.
: February 03, 2013, 06:08:43 PM QaZ

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#73 : February 03, 2013, 06:18:37 PM

If Cian Fehey says it on Rant Sports we should do it!!

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The Anti-Java

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#74 : February 03, 2013, 06:25:29 PM



It is a pivotal year for him.   Why sign him now?  That would be the worst option IMO.  Say you sign him to a 4-5 year deal, and he comes out next season looking like crap, then you stuck with him long term.

I think they are doing what's best for the team. He shines in 2013, he gets rewarded, he stinks it up, sayonara baby.

Why should Freeman play like crap next year, and why should this mean Freeman does for the next 3-4 years? I guess he will have a few more average, good, but not great season.  There is a lot in between 'he shines' and 'he stinks'. Average is prolly most likely his future.

We can still pick almost everyone in the draft, IF we like him. Russel Wilson was an option for us last year, we passed, prolly because we thought Freeman would be better. Having Freeman does not hurt. Just without Freeman we are pretty much forced to draft one. Why do you think we can get a guy like Wilson, when we just passed on him? Desperatly looking for a great QB wont help here either.

Freeman is our insurance in case the QB we get plays like crap. A drafted QB playing like crap seems a lot more likely than Freeman really stinking it up.
Should we have found our elite QB, say sayonara to Freeman. I will drive him to the airport if needed. We might still be able to trade him for a late round pick than, especially if we sign him to a nice deal. At worst we have to take a big cap hit for ONE year. But then having having found our elite QB, this makes it a lot easier to get through such a year.
Indy cut Peyton. Why should Freeman refuse to sign a similar contract? Should we cut him in the next few years, he is still under 30. He should not be scared to become a FA. He might even get a bigger contract elsewhere.

Making a decision after 2013 will just work if Freeman finally shows he is the elite QB we all want him to be. But who does really think Freeman will do this NEXT year? The decision next year most likely will be a lot tougher than this year, having to franchise tag a non elite QB. Should Freeman win a SB elsewhere, so be it, but  i would feel better atleast having got something for him, a lot better than having him let walk for nothing, because he were not willing to pay him big when he still was mediocre.

Extending Freeman wont allow us to stop looking for upgrades at QB. The most important thing is to keep look for upgrades. Everyone on this team should be compared to outside players available, especially if you just finished 7-9.




I don't think Dom will be as fast and loose with the cash as you think.  If they resign Freeman, it will most likely involve big money and guaranteed money also.  I don't think they go that route unless they are 100% sure he is the guy.  And if they low ball him, he will just say F-you and become a free agent.  They could tag him, but I would think that will require a very successful 2013 season before that happens.


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