Welcome, Guest
Pewter Report  >>  Boards  >>  The Red Board (Moderators: 3rd String Kicker, PRPatrol)  >>  Topic: Historically bad pass defense, talent or scheme? « previous next »
Page: 1 2 3

1sparkybuc

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 7267
Offline
#30 : March 30, 2013, 04:49:47 PM

A think it is a mix of both scheme and lack of talent. Talib's performance has been inconsistent at best. While there is some talent there, I don't think anyone could confuse him with being a CB1. Same deal with Wright.....decent but not a CB1. I think his injury issues slowed him down as well. Once Tailb/Wright made their way off the field, the lack of talent and experience really came into play. That whole **CENSORED** show that we trotted out there week after week was a joke. While some players improved week to week, they were never able to overcome the talent gap to become an effective CB corps. Can't overlook the safety play either. Barron was a rook and while the run support was there, he struggled at times in coverage. Same thing with Ronde. Smart, sure tackler but his lack of athletic ability at his advanced age made him a liability in coverage. Can't rule out pass rush either. I am a firm believer in pressure=picks, coverage=sacks. Lack of a consistent pass rush didn't help matters in the secondary.

Enter scheme. I agree that Schiano hasn't seen passing attacks like he witnessed last season coming from the Big East. However, Schiano didn't design this scheme in a vacuum. Bill Sheridan has been around for a while and don't forget what Butch Davis has brought to the table as a defensive consultant. Obviously, there are some tweaks that needed to be made, but at the end of the day, you have to tailor your scheme to the players you have. Im also looking the positional coaching. From all accounts, Ron Cooper was in way over his head. I think its obvious that that didn't help matters much and it's one of the main reasons he's gone. I'll give Schiano a little leniency for last season based on the fact that hasn't had the time to get his fingerprints on what he needs to build this team and had to pretty much play the cards he was dealt. You might see those as excuses. Whatever. It is what it is IMO. However, I don't think he gets as much slack this season nor should he.

Regarding the second Atlanta game, I think seeing that team before definitely helped our secondary, along with them gaining more experience week after week. That, and I believe that while Atlanta was trying to win the game, they lacked the sense of urgency that we saw in the weeks leading up to securing the division.

Schiano did double duty as the DB coach against Atlanta. Cooper was a paid spectator.

Your post is the most accurate and unbiased on this page. Nice effort. It's too bad some here lack that objectivity.

Speaking of accurate, unbiased, and objective, where did this notion of Schiano magically starting coaching the DB's in Week 17?  I'll need a link, please.

Apparently you didn't watch the game and don't read everything written by PR or posted on this board on the subject. It's not my problem.

Biggs3535

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 31580
Online
#31 : March 30, 2013, 04:59:47 PM

A think it is a mix of both scheme and lack of talent. Talib's performance has been inconsistent at best. While there is some talent there, I don't think anyone could confuse him with being a CB1. Same deal with Wright.....decent but not a CB1. I think his injury issues slowed him down as well. Once Tailb/Wright made their way off the field, the lack of talent and experience really came into play. That whole **CENSORED** show that we trotted out there week after week was a joke. While some players improved week to week, they were never able to overcome the talent gap to become an effective CB corps. Can't overlook the safety play either. Barron was a rook and while the run support was there, he struggled at times in coverage. Same thing with Ronde. Smart, sure tackler but his lack of athletic ability at his advanced age made him a liability in coverage. Can't rule out pass rush either. I am a firm believer in pressure=picks, coverage=sacks. Lack of a consistent pass rush didn't help matters in the secondary.

Enter scheme. I agree that Schiano hasn't seen passing attacks like he witnessed last season coming from the Big East. However, Schiano didn't design this scheme in a vacuum. Bill Sheridan has been around for a while and don't forget what Butch Davis has brought to the table as a defensive consultant. Obviously, there are some tweaks that needed to be made, but at the end of the day, you have to tailor your scheme to the players you have. Im also looking the positional coaching. From all accounts, Ron Cooper was in way over his head. I think its obvious that that didn't help matters much and it's one of the main reasons he's gone. I'll give Schiano a little leniency for last season based on the fact that hasn't had the time to get his fingerprints on what he needs to build this team and had to pretty much play the cards he was dealt. You might see those as excuses. Whatever. It is what it is IMO. However, I don't think he gets as much slack this season nor should he.

Regarding the second Atlanta game, I think seeing that team before definitely helped our secondary, along with them gaining more experience week after week. That, and I believe that while Atlanta was trying to win the game, they lacked the sense of urgency that we saw in the weeks leading up to securing the division.

Schiano did double duty as the DB coach against Atlanta. Cooper was a paid spectator.

Your post is the most accurate and unbiased on this page. Nice effort. It's too bad some here lack that objectivity.

Speaking of accurate, unbiased, and objective, where did this notion of Schiano magically starting coaching the DB's in Week 17?  I'll need a link, please.

Apparently you didn't watch the game and don't read everything written by PR or posted on this board on the subject. It's not my problem.

I get it.  You bent over, reached high up your anal canal, and pulled out that bit of accurate, unbiased, and objective information.  That sounds like a problem for you.  Either post the link or STFU.


1sparkybuc

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 7267
Offline
#32 : March 30, 2013, 05:19:05 PM

Too bad we can't all recall all the positives of last year's pass defense to please 1sparkybuc?

Scheme, scheme and more scheme. It's impossible to ignore the fact that Talib played great for NE last year.

If you watched the NYG game and you don't think scheme was an issue,  you have no business posting.

There were very few positives about our pass defense last year, and I'm not asking you to manufacture more sh!t than you already do. Just once in a while I'd like to see something from you that would make me question my conviction that you are nothing but a troll.

 As for the NYG game, Eli threw 3 interceptions in the first half and the Bucs held him in check as far as scoring goes.Blame it on scheme or lack of talent or whatever, the Bucs fell apart in the second half. Our pass defense definitely coast us a playoff spot. Get that fixed and we have a contender. As inconsistent as Freeman was, we still would have been a WC with even a mediocre pass defense. I don't expect a worst to first situation like with our run defense, but I do expect a ranking in the top half of the league with or without Revis. The focus will shift to pass defense this offseason. We have a new DB coach and Goldson so far, and we have the draft and more free agents will be released. They will adjust the scheme to fit the new personnel.

1sparkybuc

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 7267
Offline
#33 : March 30, 2013, 05:26:07 PM

A think it is a mix of both scheme and lack of talent. Talib's performance has been inconsistent at best. While there is some talent there, I don't think anyone could confuse him with being a CB1. Same deal with Wright.....decent but not a CB1. I think his injury issues slowed him down as well. Once Tailb/Wright made their way off the field, the lack of talent and experience really came into play. That whole **CENSORED** show that we trotted out there week after week was a joke. While some players improved week to week, they were never able to overcome the talent gap to become an effective CB corps. Can't overlook the safety play either. Barron was a rook and while the run support was there, he struggled at times in coverage. Same thing with Ronde. Smart, sure tackler but his lack of athletic ability at his advanced age made him a liability in coverage. Can't rule out pass rush either. I am a firm believer in pressure=picks, coverage=sacks. Lack of a consistent pass rush didn't help matters in the secondary.

Enter scheme. I agree that Schiano hasn't seen passing attacks like he witnessed last season coming from the Big East. However, Schiano didn't design this scheme in a vacuum. Bill Sheridan has been around for a while and don't forget what Butch Davis has brought to the table as a defensive consultant. Obviously, there are some tweaks that needed to be made, but at the end of the day, you have to tailor your scheme to the players you have. Im also looking the positional coaching. From all accounts, Ron Cooper was in way over his head. I think its obvious that that didn't help matters much and it's one of the main reasons he's gone. I'll give Schiano a little leniency for last season based on the fact that hasn't had the time to get his fingerprints on what he needs to build this team and had to pretty much play the cards he was dealt. You might see those as excuses. Whatever. It is what it is IMO. However, I don't think he gets as much slack this season nor should he.

Regarding the second Atlanta game, I think seeing that team before definitely helped our secondary, along with them gaining more experience week after week. That, and I believe that while Atlanta was trying to win the game, they lacked the sense of urgency that we saw in the weeks leading up to securing the division.

Schiano did double duty as the DB coach against Atlanta. Cooper was a paid spectator.

Your post is the most accurate and unbiased on this page. Nice effort. It's too bad some here lack that objectivity.

Speaking of accurate, unbiased, and objective, where did this notion of Schiano magically starting coaching the DB's in Week 17?  I'll need a link, please.

Apparently you didn't watch the game and don't read everything written by PR or posted on this board on the subject. It's not my problem.

I get it.  You bent over, reached high up your anal canal, and pulled out that bit of accurate, unbiased, and objective information.  That sounds like a problem for you.  Either post the link or STFU.

YOU get bent. I'll post whatever I want whenever I want wherever I want. It's not my sole purpose in life to educate people like you who are too lazy to make an effort for themselves.

tbc_bucs

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 4044
Offline
#34 : March 30, 2013, 05:35:53 PM

I think it's both. This is a scheme that you can run with great to elite coverage players. We had poor to average players covering and it compounded the problem. If we get Revis to pair with goldson, then the scheme will be well on its way to being fixed.

Page: 1 2 3
Pewter Report  >>  Boards  >>  The Red Board (Moderators: 3rd String Kicker, PRPatrol)  >>  Topic: Historically bad pass defense, talent or scheme? « previous next »
:

Hide Tools Show Tools