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JC5100

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#30 : March 29, 2013, 01:44:35 PM

All the other stuff is pure garbage. 

Like the defense?


JC5100

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#31 : March 29, 2013, 01:46:59 PM

Its true. He limited the offense.

Again, tied for 5th in yards per play and tied for 10th in offensive touchdowns. So what is an "unlimited" offense, #1 in yards per play and #5 in offensive touchdowns? I'm being serious.

1sparkybuc

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#32 : March 29, 2013, 01:53:13 PM

Spin, spin, spin...it all comes down to W/L.  If Josh doesn't LEAD us to the playoffs this season, he's gone.  No doubt about it.  All the other stuff is pure garbage.  Win or you are replaced.  It is the nature of the beast.  Five years and no playoffs=you're fired.  There's nothing much to say after that, is there?

Drew Brees is a HOF QB, but even he couldn't overcome a pathetic defense, and the Saints have had a much more stable situation over the last FOUR years (3 1/2 if you want to get technical). The coaching staff has been upgraded, and the roster is much improved since 2009. If Freeeman stays healthy, the Bucs will be a playoff team and you will have to find some other axe to grind.

acacius

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#33 : March 29, 2013, 01:59:49 PM

Spin, spin, spin...it all comes down to W/L.  If Josh doesn't LEAD us to the playoffs this season, he's gone.  No doubt about it.  All the other stuff is pure garbage.  Win or you are replaced.  It is the nature of the beast.  Five years and no playoffs=you're fired.  There's nothing much to say after that, is there?
BRING BACK SHAUN KING!!!!! HE KNEW HOW TO WIN!!!!!!
All Vince Young does is win games!

The Anomaly

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#34 : March 29, 2013, 02:04:10 PM

Spin, spin, spin...it all comes down to W/L.  If Josh doesn't LEAD us to the playoffs this season, he's gone.  No doubt about it.  All the other stuff is pure garbage.  Win or you are replaced.  It is the nature of the beast.  Five years and no playoffs=you're fired.  There's nothing much to say after that, is there?
BRING BACK SHAUN KING!!!!! HE KNEW HOW TO WIN!!!!!!
All Vince Young does is win games!

I'll phrase this very easy for you...do you think Josh will be back if we go 7-9 again?  Better yet, do you think he would be resigned if he had an identical season as last year?

I don't.  He's NOT Schiano's pick.  He seems to like to have his "men".

bradentonian

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#35 : March 29, 2013, 02:08:49 PM

Spin, spin, spin...it all comes down to W/L.  If Josh doesn't LEAD us to the playoffs this season, he's gone.  No doubt about it.  All the other stuff is pure garbage.  Win or you are replaced.  It is the nature of the beast.  Five years and no playoffs=you're fired.  There's nothing much to say after that, is there?
BRING BACK SHAUN KING!!!!! HE KNEW HOW TO WIN!!!!!!
All Vince Young does is win games!

I'll phrase this very easy for you...do you think Josh will be back if we go 7-9 again?  Better yet, do you think he would be resigned if he had an identical season as last year?

I don't.  He's NOT Schiano's pick.  He seems to like to have his "men".

Not that there's anything wrong with that


BucBalla85

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#36 : March 29, 2013, 02:11:13 PM

Its true. He limited the offense.

Again, tied for 5th in yards per play and tied for 10th in offensive touchdowns. So what is an "unlimited" offense, #1 in yards per play and #5 in offensive touchdowns? I'm being serious.

Well just watch that 5 game losing streak JC5100. Its not all on him but you cant look at me with a strait face and say Freeman did not play like **CENSORED** and limited what the offense was capable of doing. Its not all on him but he deserves blame. Theres no question that the guy needs to play better than he did in those games. No question.

acacius

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#37 : March 29, 2013, 02:14:08 PM

I'll phrase this very easy for you...do you think Josh will be back if we go 7-9 again?  Better yet, do you think he would be resigned if he had an identical season as last year?
Probably not.  But I also think if the team continues to give up over 6000 yards on defense with an OQBR of 90+, the fanbase is going to be quick enough to turn on the guy the team replaces him with.

Look, I'm not saying that Freeman isn't without flaws.  He certainly has them, some of them quite significant.  For example, imo, he *has* to get his completion percentage back above 60% if he wants to have any long term success.  But I still think there's a certain amount of scapegoat-ism going on.

Naismith

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#38 : March 29, 2013, 02:15:28 PM

I think if Freeman has an identical year as last year, he comes back under a franchise tag and the team uses a high pick on another QB.

There\'s a very real chance the Bucs waive [Revis] before next season. At the very least, it will be a discussion worth having.

The Anomaly

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#39 : March 29, 2013, 02:25:27 PM

Looking back at Freeman's time at KSU and you can see a lot of similarities.   It is strange.  Not sure when he started his freshman year but the team was an ordinary 17-20 while he was there.  He also feasted on bad teams and racked up a lot of his stats versus crap teams. 

He's been consistently inconsistent going on a decade now.  I don't see it changing.

TBTrojan

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#40 : March 29, 2013, 03:13:03 PM

Spin, spin, spin...it all comes down to W/L.  If Josh doesn't LEAD us to the playoffs this season, he's gone.  No doubt about it.  All the other stuff is pure garbage.  Win or you are replaced.  It is the nature of the beast.  Five years and no playoffs=you're fired.  There's nothing much to say after that, is there?

Drew Brees is a HOF QB, but even he couldn't overcome a pathetic defense, and the Saints have had a much more stable situation over the last FOUR years (3 1/2 if you want to get technical). The coaching staff has been upgraded, and the roster is much improved since 2009. If Freeeman stays healthy, the Bucs will be a playoff team and you will have to find some other axe to grind.
What a great example, pick the team that used 2 head coaches last season and neither was THE head coach, I'm sure that had nothing to do with the Saints record.
How about the Skins who's D was just as bad as ours, a team that made the playoffs even though their rookie start missed time and was replaced by a rookie backup.
There's always an excuse with Josh...
"Oh the coaching isn't very good."
"He's set some worthless franchise records in a time where EVERY passing record is being challenged."
"He didn't have any weapons."
"It's a new scheme, and Eli took 43 years to learn it."
"He's only 22, 23, 24, 25, 26 - 37, he'll improve with time."
"It's the defense that makes him stare down his target and make idiotic decisions even when his has plenty of time."

The guy is the same as he was in college, all of the same exact problem exist now that existed when he was a college freshman, at what point do people accept that he is what he is and that isn't going to change, he's not being held back by problems on the team, he is one of the problems holding the team back. As somebody put it perfectly "he's a franchise killer, you dump a BAD QB quickly but a QB like Josh slowly drains a team over decade."

Feel Real Good

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#41 : March 29, 2013, 03:21:34 PM

Spin, spin, spin...it all comes down to W/L.  If Josh doesn't LEAD us to the playoffs this season, he's gone.  No doubt about it.  All the other stuff is pure garbage.  Win or you are replaced.  It is the nature of the beast.  Five years and no playoffs=you're fired.  There's nothing much to say after that, is there?
BRING BACK SHAUN KING!!!!! HE KNEW HOW TO WIN!!!!!!
All Vince Young does is win games!

I'll phrase this very easy for you...do you think Josh will be back if we go 7-9 again?  Better yet, do you think he would be resigned if he had an identical season as last year?

I don't.  He's NOT Schiano's pick.  He seems to like to have his "men".
It may happen. The Bucs also have a history of letting go QB's getting run out of town and then winning Super Bowls for other teams.

FRG is the most logical poster on this board.  You guys just don\'t like where the logical conclusions take you.

1sparkybuc

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#42 : March 29, 2013, 04:07:25 PM

Spin, spin, spin...it all comes down to W/L.  If Josh doesn't LEAD us to the playoffs this season, he's gone.  No doubt about it.  All the other stuff is pure garbage.  Win or you are replaced.  It is the nature of the beast.  Five years and no playoffs=you're fired.  There's nothing much to say after that, is there?
BRING BACK SHAUN KING!!!!! HE KNEW HOW TO WIN!!!!!!
All Vince Young does is win games!

I'll phrase this very easy for you...do you think Josh will be back if we go 7-9 again?  Better yet, do you think he would be resigned if he had an identical season as last year?

I don't.  He's NOT Schiano's pick.  He seems to like to have his "men".

Schiano has a much better grasp on how difficult it would be to find an upgrade over Freeman than you do. Freeman will be more consistent and the focus will be on fixing the pass defense. The defense went from worst to first in defending the run in Schiano's first year. I'm sure he has a plan in mind to correct the problem. 2012 will be the last losing season for the Bucs in this decade.

The Anomaly

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#43 : March 29, 2013, 04:12:51 PM

FRG:  Should we let Freeman go I will bet the farm, house, and whatever else you want that he won't quarterback a team to a SB.  Two of those qb were on Culverhouse's watch.  Dilfer?  I think he had six seasons here.  I don't think anyone that was around back then would argue for keeping Dilfer for another six seasons.

JC5100

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#44 : March 29, 2013, 05:57:18 PM

What a great example, pick the team that used 2 head coaches last season and neither was THE head coach, I'm sure that had nothing to do with the Saints record.
How about the Skins who's D was just as bad as ours, a team that made the playoffs even though their rookie start missed time and was replaced by a rookie backup.
There's always an excuse with Josh...
"Oh the coaching isn't very good."
"He's set some worthless franchise records in a time where EVERY passing record is being challenged."
"He didn't have any weapons."
"It's a new scheme, and Eli took 43 years to learn it."
"He's only 22, 23, 24, 25, 26 - 37, he'll improve with time."
"It's the defense that makes him stare down his target and make idiotic decisions even when his has plenty of time."

The guy is the same as he was in college, all of the same exact problem exist now that existed when he was a college freshman, at what point do people accept that he is what he is and that isn't going to change, he's not being held back by problems on the team, he is one of the problems holding the team back. As somebody put it perfectly "he's a franchise killer, you dump a BAD QB quickly but a QB like Josh slowly drains a team over decade."

So your brilliant argument against Freeman is that the Redskins won 10 games with their QBs throwing 24 TDs and 8 INTs. In 2010 the Bucs won 10 games with Freeman throwing 25/6.

Throws 17 TDs and 3 INTs in 8 game stretch, team only goes 4-4. Team is 0-8 since 2009 when he doesn't start. But he's holding the team back and he's a franchise killer. Makes sense.
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