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BaghdadJoe54

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#30 : April 28, 2013, 01:43:09 PM

Don't know how you can say spence is better.  We don't even know if he can play at this level and being he left school early he will probably need some time to develop.  And is his upside really significantly better than Miller's?  All I know is Miller had the better college career and was more polished and they have similar builds, strength and athleticism.  And before you tell me how strong Spence is.  Why dont you see how strong Miller is.  Pretty comparable.

I'll give you the better college career, and they may have similar strength on paper but to say they have similar builds to me negates all your credibility because it clearly demonstrates you haven't seen Spence.

GameTime

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#31 : April 28, 2013, 01:46:28 PM

Trading a talent we didn't use for a no-talent that we'll use isn't an upgrade. Talent is talent. If Martin goes down, and it seems like we're pretty set on running him into the ground, we will have zero quality running backs that can carry the load. Unless Demps comes in and returns kicks, that trade was awful. It's amazing how Dominik drafts players and people fall in love with them. News flash, Spence had 1 sack last year and James has as many career 100-yard games as I do (that's ZERO). And Dallas Clark doesn't set the world on fire but he's a good option. Luke Stocker on the other hand has proven to be nothing short of incapable of being anything resembling a productive player. So yes, that's a dowgrade.

Take the Red goggles off. Our secondary might've gone from worst to first (I actually believe talent-wise, ours is as good as it gets) but the rest of the roster got worse.
if we use mike james then i would think its an upgrade, as unfortunate as it sounds.  if james can be adequate at pass pro, and hit the correct hole hard then thats quality.  spence isnt here to get sacks, neither was roy miller.  and tell me how dallas clark is a good option again?  who does he play for?  he filled a role, and its crazy to me that people dont think crabtree could fill the same role.

\"Lets put the O back in Country\"

TheChronicHotAir

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#32 : April 28, 2013, 01:47:57 PM

Did we get better on the O-line? No.
Did we get better on the D-line? No.
Did we get better at Linebacker? No.
Did we get better at TE? No.
Did we get better at WR? Not really-- just more 'rejects' added to the slot position.

Did we 'maybe' get better at back-up QB?  Yes-- at the expense of a possible STARTING DE or DT.



This whole theory that "you draft/settle for back-ups" in Rounds 5-7 is just plain LOSER MENTALITY. You should be drafting for STARTERS in every Round, imo.


BaghdadJoe54

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#33 : April 28, 2013, 01:52:12 PM

Did we get better on the O-line? No.
Did we get better on the D-line? No.
Did we get better at Linebacker? No.
Did we get better at TE? No.
Did we get better at WR? Not really-- just more 'rejects' added to the slot position.

Did we 'maybe' get better at back-up QB?  Yes-- at the expense of a possible STARTING DE or DT.



This whole theory that "you draft/settle for back-ups" in Rounds 5-7 is just plain LOSER MENTALITY. You should be drafting for STARTERS in every Round, imo.

I would agree if we are solely looking at for the near term and from the perspective of adding new players versus losing old players.

GameTime

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#34 : April 28, 2013, 01:52:40 PM

Did we get better on the O-line? No.

who were our starters for the majority of last season?  who do we expect to start this season?

\"Lets put the O back in Country\"

Skull and Bones

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#35 : April 28, 2013, 01:53:39 PM

Don't know how you can say spence is better.  We don't even know if he can play at this level and being he left school early he will probably need some time to develop.  And is his upside really significantly better than Miller's?  All I know is Miller had the better college career and was more polished and they have similar builds, strength and athleticism.  And before you tell me how strong Spence is.  Why dont you see how strong Miller is.  Pretty comparable.

I'll give you the better college career, and they may have similar strength on paper but to say they have similar builds to me negates all your credibility because it clearly demonstrates you haven't seen Spence.
i mean they are both around 6'1" 310.  Spense might look better in underwear but I do believe Miller put up 36 to his 37.  Here's Roy's measurables.  Where is the difference?  http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=57220&draftyear=2009&genpos=DT
: April 28, 2013, 01:55:55 PM Skull and Bones


TheChronicHotAir

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#36 : April 28, 2013, 01:57:08 PM

Outside of the secondary did the Bucs improve this offseason?

Shooter Jennings,
When you have to look PAST the 2013 free agency and PAST the 2013 Draft to find a way to say we 'improved THIS offseason-- i think you pretty much answered the question...


GameTime

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#37 : April 28, 2013, 02:02:52 PM

Outside of the secondary did the Bucs improve this offseason?

Shooter Jennings,
When you have to look PAST the 2013 free agency and PAST the 2013 Draft to find a way to say we 'improved THIS offseason-- i think you pretty much answered the question...
?

i think we stayed even or improved many places through injury returns, FA, trades, and draft along with player development.  im not sure why thats an issue.

\"Lets put the O back in Country\"

ufojoe

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#38 : April 28, 2013, 02:05:48 PM

c'mon.  there's no changing peoples minds here.  you either want to see it as half full or half empty.

Exactly. Add to that, so many others have already gotten into specifics as to why we improved. Not much more to say.

I loved the "We weren't smart in improving the secondary," line by the mostly negative Dalbuc. LMAO at that line. I thought the
Bucs were brilliant in improving it the way they did.




Naismith

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#39 : April 28, 2013, 02:07:40 PM

All projections, of course.

Offensive line is better, because it's healthier.
Defensive line is worse.
Linebackers are slightly better.
Tight ends are slightly better.
Wide Receivers are worse.
Quarterbacks are better.
Running backs are slightly worse.

There\'s a very real chance the Bucs waive [Revis] before next season. At the very least, it will be a discussion worth having.

Skull and Bones

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#40 : April 28, 2013, 02:11:23 PM

I think Dal's argument is we did it by making Revis the highest paid CB and Goldston one of the highest paid FS in the league and we had to give up a first and a 3rd for a 28 year old who is probably only going to give us 4 years max.  Is that sound team building?  Not really but it did make us better. 


BaghdadJoe54

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#41 : April 28, 2013, 02:12:14 PM

Don't know how you can say spence is better.  We don't even know if he can play at this level and being he left school early he will probably need some time to develop.  And is his upside really significantly better than Miller's?  All I know is Miller had the better college career and was more polished and they have similar builds, strength and athleticism.  And before you tell me how strong Spence is.  Why dont you see how strong Miller is.  Pretty comparable.

I'll give you the better college career, and they may have similar strength on paper but to say they have similar builds to me negates all your credibility because it clearly demonstrates you haven't seen Spence.
i mean they are both around 6'1" 310.  Spense might look better in underwear but I do believe Miller put up 36 to his 37.  Here's Roy's measurables.  Where is the difference?  http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=57220&draftyear=2009&genpos=DT

Build.  They have two completely different body types which you can't tell by looking at a piece of paper.  The most obvious components are the mid section and arms.

GameTime

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#42 : April 28, 2013, 02:13:23 PM

I think Dal's argument is we did it by making Revis the highest paid CB and Goldston one of the highest paid FS in the league and we had to give up a first and a 3rd for a 28 year old who is probably only going to give us 4 years max.  Is that sound team building?  Not really but it did make us better.

and the minute the team does "sound team building" 100 other fans will complain that they arent trying to win now.

\"Lets put the O back in Country\"

Madman

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#43 : April 28, 2013, 02:13:40 PM

WRs are worse? How? Unchanged if anything. Lost Benn but no real loss there. Added Steve Smith and Ogletree.

GameTime

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#44 : April 28, 2013, 02:15:25 PM

All projections, of course.

Offensive line is better, because it's healthier.
Defensive line is worse.
Linebackers are slightly better.
Tight ends are slightly better.
Wide Receivers are worse.
Quarterbacks are better.
Running backs are slightly worse.

why are WR's worse?  i can understand the DL if you love bennett, but not sure why the addition of clayborn doesnt cancel it out.  i can undertand the RB is you love blount, but having a RB the coaches can trust is much more effective than a highlight reel.

\"Lets put the O back in Country\"
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