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Dolorous Jason

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#15 : May 20, 2013, 07:36:45 PM


I know more about Libertarianism than a pretty good number of self-proclaimed Libertarians that I have personally met.

Aren't you the guy who said everyone is either Liberal or Conservative , and Libertarians are just conservatives ?? Aren't you also the same guy that once said libertarians endorse anarchy ? I don't believe you have a goddamn clue about libertarianism.



As for being brainwashed : You don't have to be libertarian to not be brainwashed , you just have to recognize the two-party system for the rigged scam that it is. It's a crooked oligarchy we live under , masquerading as a democracy  , and we have no REAL say in the matter.

What is your point? I was wrong? Ok. You win. I was wrong.

           

CBWx2

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#16 : May 20, 2013, 08:18:39 PM


I know more about Libertarianism than a pretty good number of self-proclaimed Libertarians that I have personally met.

Aren't you the guy who said everyone is either Liberal or Conservative , and Libertarians are just conservatives ??

They are. Libertarianism is rooted within the Conservative wing of the American political system. Not to rehash, but how else do you explain the affiliation that Libertarian politicians have with the Republican party, and how a similar affiliation is non-existent with the Democratic party?

How else do you explain the fact that you, a self proclaimed Libertarian, are in agreement at least 80-90%  of the time with self proclaimed conservatives like spartan and dbucfan, and are in agreement with me, a self proclaimed liberal only on a handful of social issues, like gay marriage or war on drugs legislation?

I'm a "comrade" for being a liberal. A person that you personally attack for holding views that you find contradictory to your positions. There isn't a single conservative poster on this board that you hold with as much contempt, yet here you are arguing that Libertarianism isn't a form of Conservatism. Laughable how clueless you are...

Aren't you also the same guy that once said libertarians endorse anarchy ? I don't believe you have a goddamn clue about libertarianism.

They do, at least a rather large number of them do. Perhaps you should read more Lew Rockwell or Murray Rothbard. Making comments like this leads me to believe that it is you who doesn't have a goddamn clue about Libertarianism, Chachi.

As for being brainwashed : You don't have to be libertarian to not be brainwashed , you just have to recognize the two-party system for the rigged scam that it is. It's a crooked oligarchy we live under , masquerading as a democracy  , and we have no REAL say in the matter.

Oh we have a say. People ultimately make the choice. If politicians actually governed the way that they say they will when they campaign, then the government would function much better. The real enemy of democracy is corporate America. Third party enthusiasts who blame the two party system are missing the real issue. Whether there are two parties or twenty, in a government where influence can be bought and sold so easily, the number of parties means nothing.
: May 20, 2013, 08:32:44 PM CBWx2


Dolorous Jason

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#17 : May 20, 2013, 08:30:10 PM



They are. Libertarianism is rooted within the Conservative wing of the American political system. Not to rehash, but how else do you explain the affiliation that Libertarian politicians have with the Republican party, and how a similar affiliation is non-existent with the Democratic party?

Coming from the guy who just said this in his last post :


 I know more about Libertarianism than a pretty good number of self-proclaimed Libertarians that I have personally met. They are either hyper conservatives or hyper liberals

LOL .... wow.... Let me know when you can actually present a coherent position , Comrade , then get back to me on how much you know about the subject.











: May 20, 2013, 08:32:23 PM Fire Mark Dummynik

What is your point? I was wrong? Ok. You win. I was wrong.

           

CBWx2

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#18 : May 20, 2013, 08:37:01 PM



They are. Libertarianism is rooted within the Conservative wing of the American political system. Not to rehash, but how else do you explain the affiliation that Libertarian politicians have with the Republican party, and how a similar affiliation is non-existent with the Democratic party?

Coming from the guy who just said this in his last post :


 I know more about Libertarianism than a pretty good number of self-proclaimed Libertarians that I have personally met. They are either hyper conservatives or hyper liberals

LOL .... wow.... Let me know when you can actually present a coherent position , Comrade , then get back to me on how much you know about the subject.

What some people think Libertarianism is has no basis on what Libertarianism actually is, you moron. For example, you just argued that Libertarians don't endorse anarchism...

http://civilliberty.about.com/od/libertarianpolitics/g/Anarcho-Capitalism-Definition.htm


How else do you explain the fact that you, a self proclaimed Libertarian, are in agreement at least 80-90%  of the time with self proclaimed conservatives like spartan and dbucfan, and are in agreement with me, a self proclaimed liberal only on a handful of social issues, like gay marriage or war on drugs legislation?

I'm a "comrade" for being a liberal. A person that you personally attack for holding views that you find contradictory to your positions. There isn't a single conservative poster on this board that you hold with as much contempt, yet here you are arguing that Libertarianism isn't a form of Conservatism. Laughable how clueless you are...

Utterly clueless...


Dolorous Jason

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#19 : May 20, 2013, 10:55:15 PM


LOL....I'm willing to bet I'm more liberal on social issues than you are .  Political beliefs are a LOT more nuanced than you seem to want to make it out , you mental midget , so stop trying to lump the entire world into two groups .

Besides , you can't even get your story straight . In one thread you are calling libertarianism fascist , in the next it's anarchy. You aren't interested in the truth at all , you are interested in your own narrow world view and trying to discredit all else with whatever pathetic fear mongering narrative is your flavor of the day.

 Brainwashed.. or just flat out stupid ? I vote for the latter in this case.

What is your point? I was wrong? Ok. You win. I was wrong.

           

CBWx2

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#20 : May 21, 2013, 01:32:39 AM


LOL....I'm willing to bet I'm more liberal on social issues than you are . 

I'm willing to bet you aren't.

Besides , you can't even get your story straight . In one thread you are calling libertarianism fascist , in the next it's anarchy.

I didn't call Libertarianism fascism. I called Von Mises and Hayek borderline fascists. You are the one who seems to be struggling with getting the story straight.

You aren't interested in the truth at all , you are interested in your own narrow world view and trying to discredit all else with whatever pathetic fear mongering narrative is your flavor of the day.

You consider yourself to be the arbiter of truth? You can't even acknowledge the basic truth that Von Mises and Hayek supported fascist regimes because it contradicts your fantasy of who they are. You can't even face the basic truth that they were, in some respects, idiologically unpure, flawed human beings, and instead cling to some false narrative fed to you by people with a vested interest in whitewashing their legacies. Don't you dare lecture me about truth, you lemming.

I'd also like some evidence of what fear I've mongered. Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I seem to recall that it is you and your ilk who are suggesting that America as we know it will sink into an abyss of hellfire and brimstone unless we end the government and adopt Libertarian economic principles, priciples that you yourself seem to be lacking a certain basic level of understanding.


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#21 : May 21, 2013, 05:53:30 AM


I know more about Libertarianism than a pretty good number of self-proclaimed Libertarians that I have personally met. What I have found is actually the opposite of what this statement suggests. A pretty large number of Libertarians haven't got a clue as to what it actually is.

That's our CBW. "I know more about what "X" group believes than "X" group does."  And "They don't even understand what they believe in, but I know what they are thinking".


CBWx2

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#22 : May 21, 2013, 06:57:06 AM


I know more about Libertarianism than a pretty good number of self-proclaimed Libertarians that I have personally met. What I have found is actually the opposite of what this statement suggests. A pretty large number of Libertarians haven't got a clue as to what it actually is.

That's our CBW. "I know more about what "X" group believes than "X" group does."  And "They don't even understand what they believe in, but I know what they are thinking".

I'm not your anything, imbecile.


CBWx2

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#23 : May 21, 2013, 07:17:44 AM

DJ and caradoc, in their unyielding ignorance, have proven my point. The problem with Libertarianism is that Libertarianism itself seems to have an identity crisis. This is why you have self proclaimed Libertarians like DJ denying that Libertarianism subscribes to any form of anarchy when it does, and caradoc claiming that the Tea Party is a Libertarian organization when it isn't. It's also why you have Bill Maher and Glenn Beck, two people I doubt would even want to share an elevator with one another much less want to be associated with the same political philosophy as the other, both claiming to be/have been Libertarians.



Dolorous Jason

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#24 : May 21, 2013, 07:28:35 AM


LOL....I'm willing to bet I'm more liberal on social issues than you are . 

I'm willing to bet you aren't.



So you are in favor or legalization of all drugs ? You are in favor of legalization of prostitution ? You are in favor of releasing everyone in Gitmo due to human rights violations ? You are in favor of letting anyone get married who wants to get married - including polygamists ? You are in favor of a open border immigration policy ?

Just making sure you are as "conservative" as I am, Mr. Black-and-White....

What is your point? I was wrong? Ok. You win. I was wrong.

           

Dolorous Jason

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#25 : May 21, 2013, 07:47:06 AM

DJ and caradoc, in their unyielding ignorance, have proven my point. The problem with Libertarianism is that Libertarianism itself seems to have an identity crisis. This is why you have self proclaimed Libertarians like DJ denying that Libertarianism subscribes to any form of anarchy when it does, and caradoc claiming that the Tea Party is a Libertarian organization when it isn't. It's also why you have Bill Maher and Glenn Beck, two people I doubt would even want to share an elevator with one another much less want to be associated with the same political philosophy as the other, both claiming to be/have been Libertarians.

There's no identity crisis . There is simply a lot of nuance in what people believe , and what they see themselves as.   There are people with differing views who prefer to go by the same generic label in every facet of politics , not just libertarianism. It's another reason why your attempt to say "everyone is either conservative or liberal" is so stupid.



You asked why I don't hold guys like Spartan or Dbuc or Vinny in as much disdain as I do you ? It's nothing to do with their conservatism . On the latest topic of gay marriage I was in agreement with YOU , not them.  It's their attitude. While I may disagree with them , they make a consistent argument that is at least based on something real , and that you can tell they really believe it.  You , on the other hand , start by trying to pretend to be the smartest guy in the room , then to discredit the messenger , and finally attempt to deflect and muddy the waters with endless spin and .  For example , if you were to be the one debating me on gay marriage , your counter-argument would have been . " Well  , libertarians only support gay marriage because libertarians are gay themselves." Followed by a google search for " homosexual libertarians" you would attempt to cite as undeniable  proof of that point.

In short , you have no integrity.

What is your point? I was wrong? Ok. You win. I was wrong.

           

Dolorous Jason

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#26 : May 21, 2013, 07:48:45 AM


I know more about Libertarianism than a pretty good number of self-proclaimed Libertarians that I have personally met. What I have found is actually the opposite of what this statement suggests. A pretty large number of Libertarians haven't got a clue as to what it actually is.

That's our CBW. "I know more about what "X" group believes than "X" group does."  And "They don't even understand what they believe in, but I know what they are thinking".

...and what an arrogant condescending asinine thing to say. He wonders why no one likes him....

What is your point? I was wrong? Ok. You win. I was wrong.

           

CBWx2

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#27 : May 21, 2013, 08:06:37 AM


LOL....I'm willing to bet I'm more liberal on social issues than you are . 

I'm willing to bet you aren't.


So you are in favor or legalization of all drugs ?

Yes.

You are in favor of legalization of prostitution ?

Yes.

You are in favor of releasing everyone in Gitmo due to human rights violations ?

Yes.

You are in favor of letting anyone get married who wants to get married - including polygamists ?

Yes.

You are in favor of a open border immigration policy ?

Yes.

Just making sure you are as "conservative" as I am, Mr. Black-and-White....

So you support market socialism, the welfare state, progressive taxation, and environmentalism? Just making sure you are as "liberal" as I am, Mr. free thinker.


Dolorous Jason

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#28 : May 21, 2013, 08:09:34 AM

So what you are telling me is that you are a conservative also?  LOL

What is your point? I was wrong? Ok. You win. I was wrong.

           

CBWx2

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#29 : May 21, 2013, 08:29:23 AM

DJ and caradoc, in their unyielding ignorance, have proven my point. The problem with Libertarianism is that Libertarianism itself seems to have an identity crisis. This is why you have self proclaimed Libertarians like DJ denying that Libertarianism subscribes to any form of anarchy when it does, and caradoc claiming that the Tea Party is a Libertarian organization when it isn't. It's also why you have Bill Maher and Glenn Beck, two people I doubt would even want to share an elevator with one another much less want to be associated with the same political philosophy as the other, both claiming to be/have been Libertarians.

There's no identity crisis . There is simply a lot of nuance in what people believe , and what they see themselves as.   There are people with differing views who prefer to go by the same generic label in every facet of politics , not just libertarianism. It's another reason why your attempt to say "everyone is either conservative or liberal" is so stupid.

Oh come off it you bottom feeder. You know as well as I do that Libertarianism has clear-cut defining characteristics. You know as well as I do that neither Bill Maher nor Glenn Beck fit those characteristics. Libertarianism has morphed from being a defined ideology to being a dump off affiliation for jaded conservatives and liberals who are merely attracted to a slice of Libertarianism with little understanding of what the entire pie looks like. Libertarianism itself is to blame for it. In it's never-ending quest towards gaining broader acceptance, it has simplified it's message to appeal to splinter elements of other ideologies.

You asked why I don't hold guys like Spartan or Dbuc or Vinny in as much disdain as I do you ?

Actually, I didn't ask that. I told you why you don't. Let's not pretend that you haven't gotten into flame wars with them when they disagreed with you on a topic. How much respect and lack of disdain did you have for Vin in the gun law thread? The bottom line is that you resort to ad hominem attacks and drag conversations into flame wars with anyone who disagrees with you on anything. The only difference between those guys and myself when it comes to you is that you don't disagree with them nearly as often as you disagree with me.

You are a hypocritical joke who has become a characterization of yourself, Delirious. The reason I act like I'm smarter than you is because I am. Tell me what anarcho-capitalism is, Delirious? Tell me how Libertarians don't endorse it, Delirious?

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