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Bucfucious

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« : June 19, 2013, 03:07:41 PM »

http://m.washingtonpost.com/blogs/right-turn/wp/2013/05/07/doj-gun-violence-down-semi-automatics-a-minor-issue/

The Post reports:

Gun violence has dropped dramatically nationwide over the past two decades, but nearly three-quarters of all homicides are still committed with a firearm, the Justice Department said in a report released Tuesday.

The report, by the department's Bureau of Justice Statistics, painted an encouraging picture of long-term trends at a time of divisive political debate over guns and legislation to regulate them. Firearms-related homicides declined 39 percent between 1993 and 2011, the report said, while nonfatal firearms crimes fell 69 percent during that period. . . . Less than 1 percent of state prison inmates who possessed a gun when they committed their offense obtained the firearm at a gun show, the report said.

Even the percent of homicides involving a gun has dropped from 1993 (71.2 percent) to 69.6 percent, and school violence has been declining without anti-gun laws. (“Homicides at schools declined from an average of 29 per year in the 1990s to an average of 20 per year in the 2000s.”) Total homicides at school dropped by half during the period of the study.

This is wonderful news for the country, and rotten data for anti-gun advocates trying to revive the Newtown, Conn., anti-gun legislative package.

As for the type of weapon used, it does not appear that “military style” weapons are the problem. According to the Justice Department report:

In 2004, an estimated 16% of state prison inmates and 18% of federal inmates reported that they used, carried, or possessed a firearm when they committed the crime for which they were serving a prison sentence

This represented a slight change from 1997, where an estimated 18% of state prison inmates and 16% of federal inmates reported having a firearm when they committed the crime for their current sentence. During the offense that brought them to prison, 13% of state inmates and 16% of federal inmates carried a handgun. In addition, about 1% had a rifle and another 2% had a shotgun. Of inmates armed with a firearm during the offense, about 7% of state inmates and 8% of federal inmates were armed with either a single shot firearm or a conventional semiautomatic, and 2% of state inmates and 3% of federal inmates were armed with a military-style semiautomatic or fully automatic firearm

What problem are the anti-gun advocates trying to solve? If it was Newtown, then we know none of the provisions in the recent anti-gun bill would have prevented the tragedy. If it was gun crime in general, that is already in steep decline and the so-called gun show loophole doesn’t matter. If it is concern about use of “military-style semiautomatic or fully automatic fire arms” (the latter are already illegal) it doesn’t seem to be a significant issue.

We have once again seen the triumph of good intentions over smart legislation. What we know works is good policing and incarcerating violent criminals. We have a mental-health problem that extends beyond gun violence, but which leaves too many adults on the streets untreated. If anything, the latter should be an area for further legislative action.

Simply re-running the same “we gotta do something” legislative effort may be emotionally satisfying for liberals or politically inviting for proponents, but it isn’t solving much of anything.

© Copyright 1996-2013 The Washington Post
« : June 19, 2013, 04:39:44 PM Von Mises »

VinBucFan

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« #1 : June 19, 2013, 03:48:49 PM »

seriously, the first clue you were heading down a bad path shouldve been the fact that you were cherry-picking an op-ed piece from a conservative column RATHER than the actual article or, heaven forbid, the actual DOJ report discussed in the article.  Did you misss that?  You realize you quoted a conservative advocacy piece, right? Well,  . .  here's an example of your folly . . . . before even getting to the actual DOJ report, the actual article that is SELECTIVELY quoted in the Op-Ed piece includes this "dramatic" omission:

"Yet the document also made clear that when people are killed, it is still most likely to be with a gun. In 2011, as in the past two decades, about 70 percent of all homicides were committed with a firearm, and the majority of those firearms were handguns."

If you  took the time to look closely, you perhaps would've seen that your Op-Ed author called "dramatic" a TWENTY YEAR drop in from 71.2% to 69.6%. LOL, what is that, .08% per year?

 :-[

/endthreadbeforeitevenstarts


Bucfucious

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« #2 : June 19, 2013, 03:56:52 PM »

"Firearms-related homicides declined 39 percent between 1993 and 2011, the report said, while nonfatal firearms crimes fell 69 percent during that period."

This is what was called dramatic. The statistics you cited refer only to percentage of homicides involving a firearm, which stayed about the same, although homicides did decrease substantially.

 You really show no shame in your intellectual dishonesty.

Bucfucious

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« #3 : June 19, 2013, 03:58:53 PM »

And once again, those statistics are from the Department Of Justice, or, as you like to call them the op-ed guys.

VinBucFan

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« #4 : June 19, 2013, 04:26:10 PM »

And once again, those statistics are from the Department Of Justice, or, as you like to call them the op-ed guys.

I will never understand this kind of foolishness (in bold). How does your argument get stronger by lying about what I said, especially when its actually in print right above this comment? lol

I didnt call the DOJ "the op-ed guys." I said you quoted an op-ed pice rather than the actual news article.  Someone else can decide why you made that choice, but this omission from your op-ed peice might explain, at least in part:

"Yet the document also made clear that when people are killed, it is still most likely to be with a gun. In 2011, as in the past two decades, about 70 percent of all homicides were committed with a firearm, and the majority of those firearms were handguns."

Maybe you know, why would your op-ed writer leave that part out? Maybe the same reason you are now claiming I called the DOJ "the op-ed guys" 

 ::)


Bucfucious

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« #5 : June 19, 2013, 04:28:50 PM »

Did you say handguns? Maybe we should ban assault weapons.

Bucfucious

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« #6 : June 19, 2013, 04:38:04 PM »

Alright Vin, taking into account that you are not only an exceptionally stupid individual, but a dishonest one as well, I'll go back and edit out the opinion part of the article, which in fact consists of only the first sentence. After that it clearly states "The Post reports" so even someone with your severely curtailed intellectual capacity should be able to figure out that it's from the paper, and not an opinion piece.

Bucfucious

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« #7 : June 19, 2013, 04:41:52 PM »

Clutch at them straws, boy, clutch 'em!

VinBucFan

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« #8 : June 19, 2013, 04:44:02 PM »

Alright Vin, taking into account that you are not only an exceptionally stupid individual, but a dishonest one as well, I'll go back and edit out the opinion part of the article, which in fact consists of only the first sentence. After that it clearly states "The Post reports" so even someone with your severely curtailed intellectual capacity should be able to figure out that it's from the paper, and not an opinion piece.

LMAO. Gotta love some guy calling me dishonest and dumb after all that nonsense you have posted. Are you by any chance related to . . . . ugh .  . never mind.

Anyway . .  .the op-ed piece is NOT just the first sentence, it is its selective use of infromation from the actual news article:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/report-sharp-drop-in-gun-violence-but-most-killings-still-involve-firearms/2013/05/07/28f96904-b694-11e2-92f3-f291801936b8_story.html?hpid=z1

I said the DOJ Report says what it says, I dont dispute that . . .  but it paints a MIXED picture  . . you chose the op-ed piece, which paints a one sided picture INTENTIONALLY . . . maybe you selected in in haste . . . who knows  . . you said you were here on your leisure . .  or something like that  ;)


Bucfucious

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« #9 : June 19, 2013, 04:47:42 PM »

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/report-sharp-drop-in-gun-violence-but-most-killings-still-involve-firearms/2013/05/07/28f96904-b694-11e2-92f3-f291801936b8_story.html?hpid=z1

Why that article has the same statistics...

 Weird.

VinBucFan

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« #10 : June 19, 2013, 04:57:24 PM »

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/report-sharp-drop-in-gun-violence-but-most-killings-still-involve-firearms/2013/05/07/28f96904-b694-11e2-92f3-f291801936b8_story.html?hpid=z1

Why that article has the same statistics... AND THEN SOME (lol)

 Weird.

Yeah . .  I know  . . . I know . . . "dishonest" "dumb"  "uneducated" . .  . . . .  :-[


Biggs3535

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« #11 : June 19, 2013, 05:28:36 PM »

You really show no shame in your intellectual dishonesty.

None.

Of course being completely oblivious helps.


VinBucFan

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« #12 : June 19, 2013, 05:31:26 PM »

You really show no shame in your intellectual dishonesty.

None.

Of course being completely oblivious helps.

says the guy who thinks you dont need a license to buy beer

Quote
and yet here you are again . . . posting about me     man, if you think I comment on your stalking me to feel important . . . . wow . . .  you are beyond getting a grip ... you might be in lobotomy land.   

Let me prove my point to you and Biggsy by letting you guys step all over yourselves as I know you will.  Here's the challenge:

Between the three of us, let's see who is the first from this point forward to post ABOUT THE OTHER POSTER, not the substance of the discussion, but the person making the comment. Between you, me and Biggsy, let's see who is the very next poster, after I post this comment,  to post a comment referencing the other poster instead of the substance.  That shouldn't be a problem right . . . because you're not stalking me . . . right?  I look forward to both of you proving me wrong. 


lol -- 7:04 pm . . . .  tick, tock . . . tick. . . .tock



olafberserker

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« #13 : June 19, 2013, 05:55:03 PM »

says the guy who thinks it is easier to get an AR-15 than a case of beer ......

VinBucFan

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« #14 : June 19, 2013, 06:02:53 PM »

says the guy who thinks it is easier to get an AR-15 than a case of beer ......

Never far behind. First and only post again? Yep! Lol

Quote
and yet here you are again . . . posting about me     man, if you think I comment on your stalking me to feel important . . . . wow . . .  you are beyond getting a grip ... you might be in lobotomy land.   

Let me prove my point to you and Biggsy by letting you guys step all over yourselves as I know you will.  Here's the challenge:

Between the three of us, let's see who is the first from this point forward to post ABOUT THE OTHER POSTER, not the substance of the discussion, but the person making the comment. Between you, me and Biggsy, let's see who is the very next poster, after I post this comment,  to post a comment referencing the other poster instead of the substance.  That shouldn't be a problem right . . . because you're not stalking me . . . right?  I look forward to both of you proving me wrong. 


lol -- 7:04 pm . . . .  tick, tock . . . tick. . . .tock

« : June 19, 2013, 06:07:24 PM VinBucFan »

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