Welcome, Guest
Pewter Report  >>  Boards  >>  Pirate's Cove (Moderators: 3rd String Kicker, PRPatrol)  >>  Topic: Went To The Gun Show Saturday « previous next »
Page: 1 ... 3 4 5 6 7 ... 17

VinBucFan

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 19480
Online
#60 : July 09, 2013, 12:45:30 PM

"btw, you sell a car or a home . . . the government requires something from you, right?"

Gun sales are taxed like any other sale.

"what's the over-riding social interest"

Protection from the source where tyranny invariably originates.

"hat says guns should be exempt from ANY regulation just because its a private sale?"

They're not exempt from any regulation. You keep saying they are but you're a liar.

lmao . . . you're a cute little angry fella . . . don't get banned again, okay?

what's the regulation on a private sale?

btw, when you buy and sell a car or a home the transaction is a matter of Public Record . . . not just taxation


dbucfan

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 46179
Offline
#61 : July 09, 2013, 12:47:12 PM

Enforcement of laws is the issue.
Not "the" issue, enforcement is AN issue .., unless you can tell me what law is not being enforced when a private party sells a gun without a background check?

Like everything in life, the problem is not susceptible to improvement by flicking a single switch
So much of it is about enforcement it is ridiculous when you think about it, whether is it yet another law, or simply the effective use of the ones already on the books. 

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

VinBucFan

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 19480
Online
#62 : July 09, 2013, 12:57:08 PM

Enforcement of laws is the issue.
Not "the" issue, enforcement is AN issue .., unless you can tell me what law is not being enforced when a private party sells a gun without a background check?

Like everything in life, the problem is not susceptible to improvement by flicking a single switch
So much of it is about enforcement it is ridiculous when you think about it, whether is it yet another law, or simply the effective use of the ones already on the books.

well, I dont want to re-type it but I agreed and pointed out that Florida is the classic example of laws INTENTIONALLY written to be virtually unenforceable in an ealrier response to Spartan.

I dont really have a dog in the fight between how much is "enforcement" and how much is an "absence of laws,"  I just care about adding some common sense to the approach.  The fact that I can be a felon or an adjudicated crazy person and walk into a local brick and mortar gun dealer and be DENIED a sale by a background check . . . but then just go home an buy a gun online or through the classifieds etc. is beyond dumb. It means the "brick and mortar" law is nearly meaningless.

I agree though that all laws are meaningless without teeth.  Again, Florida's approach to the gun show loophole is a classic example


dbucfan

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 46179
Offline
#63 : July 09, 2013, 01:01:39 PM

Then perhaps rather than haranguing those who agree that more laws aren't the key, influencing the modification of existing laws and appropriate enforcement would be more productive.  Just a thought.

Sorry I missed your earlier comments completely.  I have been ignoring vast portions of threads to avoid the mudslinging portions, and sometimes I guess I skip too much

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

VinBucFan

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 19480
Online
#64 : July 09, 2013, 01:09:26 PM

Then perhaps rather than haranguing those who agree that more laws aren't the key, influencing the modification of existing laws and appropriate enforcement would be more productive.  Just a thought.

"haranguing" is a two-way street.

I didnt say that "the modification of existing laws and appropriate enforcement would be more productive"  that's your comment (and, frankly, sort of a NRA talking point***).  I said that closing obviously stupid openings in the law made basic common sense and that to do so takes (1) "modification of existing laws" and  (2)"appropriate enforcement" AND  (3)"more laws" because, as an example, I can buy an assault rfile right now even if I was a felon or a crazy person

**** the reason I say the "enforce existing laws" is an NRA talking point is because the reason many gun laws are INEFFECTIVE is specifically because of the NRA's influence, so guns owners saying "enforce the existing laws" is often nothing more than a talking point.  NRA influence led to a former ban on "assault rifles" that didnt actually ban most assault rifles, it led to Florida legislators closing the "gun show loophole" by requiring signs at gun shows . .  and little more.  The list I could give would go on for pages . . .


Bucfucious

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 3797
Offline
#65 : July 09, 2013, 01:09:49 PM

"what's the regulation on a private sale?"

You really don't know, do you? Maybe it's something you should look up, so as to be informed about the topic you're debating?

CBWx2

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 5931
Offline
#66 : July 09, 2013, 01:10:30 PM

Why don't you find someone who has a bunch of guns that they want to sell, have them set up a table in front of a Wal Mart, or Lowes, stack a bunch of guns with price tags on them, and report back to us how long it took before law enforcement asked you to leave the premises. The point being, you cannot sell guns "anywhere" as you seem to be suggesting."

Nor can you sell waffles in the parking lot without their permission. What an incredibly poor analogy.

Exactly, but you know where you can sell waffles? From your own home, or from a public event that allows you to set up a booth and sell waffles from it. My guess, however, is that anyone with an interest in selling a large amount of waffles would opt to do so at a commercial venue as opposed to opening a stand in their front yard. It's actually a perfect analogy. You just seem to be missing the point.

"While selling guns from your private residence, you may be subject to the same requirements as at a gun show, "

Now there's some refreshing honesty. Now let's go the extra step and admit that "gun show loophole" is a euphemism for "private sales." Americans don't like being told what they can or cannot do with their private property, thus we get this bit of subterfuge. If were going to have an honest discussion about this issue, it has to start with honesty.

It's actually a euphemism for "private sales at gun shows", where guns are being sold at a high volume in a concentrated, and  otherwise regulated area. If it didn't specifically apply to gun shows, then it would just be called a "loophole", as opposed to a "gun show loophole". If you expect honesty from others, then you should try and refrain from starting conversations by accusing others of arguing a position that they never claimed to be arguing.
: July 09, 2013, 01:14:36 PM CBWx2


VinBucFan

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 19480
Online
#67 : July 09, 2013, 01:11:06 PM

"what's the regulation on a private sale?"

You really don't know, do you? Maybe it's something you should look up, so as to be informed about the topic you're debating?

^^^ a comfortable assumption by a guy who doesnt want to answer the question . . . that's okay, I wasnt expecting any more from Illuminator .  ..  oops . .  Von Mises . .  both play the same tedious games so sometimes I get them confused.
: July 09, 2013, 01:16:11 PM VinBucFan


VinBucFan

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 19480
Online
#68 : July 09, 2013, 01:14:21 PM

Why don't you find someone who has a bunch of guns that they want to sell, have them set up a table in front of a Wal Mart, or Lowes, stack a bunch of guns with price tags on them, and report back to us how long it took before law enforcement asked you to leave the premises. The point being, you cannot sell guns "anywhere" as you seem to be suggesting."

Nor can you sell waffles in the parking lot without their permission. What an incredibly poor analogy.

Exactly, but you know where you can sell waffles? From your own home, or from a public event that allows you to set up a booth and sell waffles from it. My guess, however, is that anyone with an interest in selling a large amount of waffles would opt to do so at a commercial venue as opposed to opening a stand in their front yard. It's actually a perfect analogy. You just seem to be missing the point.

Even the Florida statute that ineffectively "closed" Florida's gun show loophole is based on sales at places of PUBLIC ACCESS. That means a gun seller who was scared by the signs* posted at a gun show (a place of public access) could just give the would-be purchaser a phone number and go make the sale at some other location.  The purpose of a gun show -- as CBW correctly pointed out -- is to put a lot of buyers and sellers together


* signs and county ordinances, now there's a law that was written to change conduct . . lol . .  . .hope the sarcasm is OBVIOUS
: July 09, 2013, 01:17:49 PM VinBucFan


Bucfucious

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 3797
Offline
#69 : July 09, 2013, 01:17:31 PM

"My guess, however, is that anyone with an interest in selling a large amount of waffles would opt to do so at a commercial venue as opposed to opening a stand in their front yard."

Anyone wanting to sell "a large amount of waffles" needs to obtain a Federal Waffle License. It is illegal for someone holding a FWL to sell a waffle without a background check.

VinBucFan

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 19480
Online
#70 : July 09, 2013, 01:18:55 PM

"My guess, however, is that anyone with an interest in selling a large amount of waffles would opt to do so at a commercial venue as opposed to opening a stand in their front yard."

Anyone wanting to sell "a large amount of waffles" needs to obtain a Federal Waffle License. It is illegal for someone holding a FWL to sell a waffle without a background check.

some posters on here would respond  to that comment ^^^^with a "surrender noted."   lol  Not a big fan of that though


Bucfucious

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 3797
Offline
#71 : July 09, 2013, 01:20:49 PM

Some posters on here are entirely oblivious to the laws already in place, yet instead of looking them up they just keep clamoring for more.

VinBucFan

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 19480
Online
#72 : July 09, 2013, 01:24:23 PM

Some posters on here are entirely oblivious to the laws already in place, yet instead of looking them up they just keep clamoring for more.

Illuminator games ^^^^ 


I feel a poll coming on . . .


VinBucFan

*
Hall of Famer
******
Posts : 19480
Online
#73 : July 09, 2013, 01:25:18 PM

"btw, you sell a car or a home . . . the government requires something from you, right?"

Gun sales are taxed like any other sale.

"what's the over-riding social interest"

Protection from the source where tyranny invariably originates.

"hat says guns should be exempt from ANY regulation just because its a private sale?"

They're not exempt from any regulation. You keep saying they are but you're a liar.

lmao . . . you're a cute little angry fella . . . don't get banned again, okay?

what's the regulation on a private sale?

btw, when you buy and sell a car or a home the transaction is a matter of Public Record . . . not just taxation


CBWx2

******
Hall of Famer

Posts : 5931
Offline
#74 : July 09, 2013, 01:33:49 PM

"My guess, however, is that anyone with an interest in selling a large amount of waffles would opt to do so at a commercial venue as opposed to opening a stand in their front yard."

Anyone wanting to sell "a large amount of waffles" needs to obtain a Federal Waffle License. It is illegal for someone holding a FWL to sell a waffle without a background check.

It is illegal for waffle dealers to sell waffles in a commercial venue without a license. To the best of my knowledge, there is no "waffle loophole" in regards to that law.

Page: 1 ... 3 4 5 6 7 ... 17
Pewter Report  >>  Boards  >>  Pirate's Cove (Moderators: 3rd String Kicker, PRPatrol)  >>  Topic: Went To The Gun Show Saturday « previous next »
:

Hide Tools Show Tools