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dbucfan

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« #30 : July 27, 2013, 08:09:31 PM »

Clever argument to get in SYG - still begs to show that it was part of a defense.  To show he lied would be a different point.

As to juror - I would offer she erred, in less of course she understood self defense and concluded Zimmerman felt in fear of his life.

The jury instruction baffles me, but honestly if the jury concluded it was self defense... it is the right conclusion. 

\"A Great Coach has to have a Patient Wife, A Loyal Dog, and a Great Quarterback. . . . but not necessarily in that order\" ~ Coach Bud Grant

Kelly Thomas

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« #31 : July 27, 2013, 08:31:46 PM »

"As to juror - I would offer she erred, in less of course she understood self defense and concluded Zimmerman felt in fear of his life."

Of course I can't say either, but she had the law and the jury instruction. So it wouldn't be hard to recognize the stand your ground portion of self defense.

Biggs3535

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« #32 : July 27, 2013, 09:24:14 PM »

There seems to be quite a bit of determination to include stand your ground as a part of the reason for the verdict.  Folks seem set on including that which was not presented, argued, nor a part of the final reckoning.  And that is from the president on down....

The ignorance of the masses continues.


VinBucFan

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« #33 : July 27, 2013, 09:58:11 PM »

There seems to be quite a bit of determination to include stand your ground as a part of the reason for the verdict.  Folks seem set on including that which was not presented, argued, nor a part of the final reckoning.  And that is from the president on down....

You're wrong.

1) There was extensive testimony given in this case about GZ knowledge of SYG. In fact it was shown that he was lying about his knowledge of SYG (in the Hannity interview) by one one of his own instructors.

2) The defense argued GZ had a right to be where he was and was not doing anything illegal.

3) Juror B37 is the juror that believed GZ to be not guilty before deliberations began said this when she was interviewd after the trial.

"COOPER: Because of the two options you had, second degree murder or manslaughter, you felt neither applied?

JUROR: Right. Because of the heat of the moment and the Stand Your Ground. He had a right to defend himself. If he felt threatened that his life was going to be taken away from him or he was going to have bodily harm, he had a right."



This was the written jury instructions given to the jury for them to consider.

If George Zimmerman was not engaged in an unlawful activity and was attacked in anyplace where he had a right to be, he had no duty to retreat and had the right to stand his ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he reasonably believed that it was necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.


Because the defense waived their right to a SYG hearing does not mean they excluded stand your ground from their self defense assertion. It is part of self defense.

There seems to be some confusion in this forum between a formal SYG hearing and self defense. Both of which allow  standing ones ground.

 The jury instruction also include information on credibility, lesser included offense, murder 2, evidence v argument . . . all kinds of things . . .  the point isn't what is in a 15-20 page form . . . ITS THAT THE JURY ACCEPTED THAT HE WAS AFRAID FOR HIS LIFE . . . .  basic self defense . . . no need for the jury to rely on SYG


Kelly Thomas

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« #34 : July 27, 2013, 10:11:18 PM »

"no need for the jury to rely on SYG"

Yet we know for a fact that at least one juror did consider it in her deliberation.

You should also know that if you want to argue the case (which you've done twice) there's already another thread for that. 


VinBucFan

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« #35 : July 27, 2013, 10:26:35 PM »

"no need for the jury to rely on SYG"

Yet we know for a fact that at least one juror did consider it in her deliberation.

You should also know that if you want to argue the case (which you've done twice) there's already another thread for that.

lmao -- go f yourself, I will post whatever I want dumb azz

The reason there is NOW such a focus on SYG is because there has to be something to blame.  It cant be that the jury got it right and it certainly cant be that the "innocent kid" doubled back over 4 minutes to attack a guy who happened to have a gun . . .  .  SO . . .  . it has to be that SYG is to blame . . .  its what people do . .  . (and you should know better than most-lol) .  . . . people look for simple explanations for things they dont agree with or understand . .  this is why conspiracy theories always pop up.  In this instance, it cant be that TM was to blame . .  so its got to be that the law is to blame . . .  and the jurors (with the exception of the first) will say the same thing because they want an out too.

It will get repeated and repeated so many times that it will become the "truth" or the "reality"  . .  . because people like you cant accept that you were just simply wrong . .  and so it has to be something else . . .  it was that damn law . .  .simple . . . except for the fact it didn't matter given the facts  ;)


VinBucFan

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« #36 : July 27, 2013, 10:27:47 PM »

Its no coincidence that those who were the most outspoken against Zimmerman from day one of the TM thread . . . are also the ones who are now so accepting of the SYG nonsense
« : July 27, 2013, 10:41:16 PM VinBucFan »


Kelly Thomas

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« #37 : July 27, 2013, 10:47:38 PM »

He's my little dancing monkey. Just pull the string and watch him go.


Skull and Bones

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« #38 : July 29, 2013, 06:03:12 AM »

I'm not sure of your point.  Either this lady is erroneously fighting something that she believes to be used in the defense of Zimmerman (like the other ignoramuses, i.e. Stevie Wonder) or she is out to make $$$$ after the death of her kid.  Neither shows very well on the "parent" of young Martin.
you mean the mother who let another woman raise her son since the age if 3 and after having him move back in with her when he was 16 because his cheating father was currently homeless, quickly kicks him out for getting suspended? 


Runole

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« #39 : July 29, 2013, 06:44:34 AM »

I'm not sure of your point.  Either this lady is erroneously fighting something that she believes to be used in the defense of Zimmerman (like the other ignoramuses, i.e. Stevie Wonder) or she is out to make $$$$ after the death of her kid.  Neither shows very well on the "parent" of young Martin.
you mean the mother who let another woman raise her son since the age if 3 and after having him move back in with her when he was 16 because his cheating father was currently homeless, quickly kicks him out for getting suspended?

HUH?  How dare you besmirch that church going choir boy deans list student who was going to be president one day!   Hey Obama said if he had a son he would be just like Trayvon!  :o ;)

VinBucFan

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« #40 : July 29, 2013, 10:24:49 AM »

I'm not sure of your point.  Either this lady is erroneously fighting something that she believes to be used in the defense of Zimmerman (like the other ignoramuses, i.e. Stevie Wonder) or she is out to make $$$$ after the death of her kid.  Neither shows very well on the "parent" of young Martin.
you mean the mother who let another woman raise her son since the age if 3 and after having him move back in with her when he was 16 because his cheating father was currently homeless, quickly kicks him out for getting suspended?

HUH?  How dare you besmirch that church going choir boy deans list student who was going to be president one day!   Hey Obama said if he had a son he would be just like Trayvon!  :o ;)

Runole, never one to miss an opportunity to go lower than those he holds in contempt.  The way to combat closed minds is NOT to be even more close minded Runole.


Runole

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« #41 : July 29, 2013, 07:57:00 PM »

I'm not sure of your point.  Either this lady is erroneously fighting something that she believes to be used in the defense of Zimmerman (like the other ignoramuses, i.e. Stevie Wonder) or she is out to make $$$$ after the death of her kid.  Neither shows very well on the "parent" of young Martin.
you mean the mother who let another woman raise her son since the age if 3 and after having him move back in with her when he was 16 because his cheating father was currently homeless, quickly kicks him out for getting suspended?

HUH?  How dare you besmirch that church going choir boy deans list student who was going to be president one day!   Hey Obama said if he had a son he would be just like Trayvon!  :o ;)

Runole, never one to miss an opportunity to go lower than those he holds in contempt.  The way to combat closed minds is NOT to be even more close minded Runole.

Guess you aren't a fan of a little sarcasm.   Seriously, even though sarcasm such quotes have been made about Trayvon Martin from his supporters.  Seems the poster above me had the exact same type of comment though far worse.   So do you eat Bacon?   8)
« : July 29, 2013, 07:58:56 PM Runole »
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