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VinBucFan

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: August 22, 2013, 12:12:12 PM

Good article:

A detail in the fatal shooting of 14-year-old Shaaliver Douse by a New York Police Department officer earlier this month has been stopping me from grieving his death.
 
The tragedy happened around 3 a.m.
 
Why was a 14-year-old boy out that late without his mother, Shanise Farrar, who called the shooting an assassination? Or his aunt, Quwana Barcene, who said the bloody gun police say was found near his body was part of a coverup? Where was the supervising adult who should have been with a 14-year-old boy walking the streets of New York at 3 o'clock in the morning?
 
 
"I'm not saying that he's the best one, but he's my angel," his grieving mother said.
 
Her "angel" was a suspected gang member who police say was chasing and shooting at an unidentified man when they encountered him. Her "angel" was arrested last month for attempted murder of a 15-year-old. Her "angel" left their apartment around 8 p.m. and she had no idea where he was until the next morning when detectives informed her that her son was dead.
 
I want to mourn for her loss, I really do.
 

But as callous and as heartless as this sounds, I just can't get past what awful parents she and the boy's father were. Children may be born angels, but with all the temptations out there in the world, it takes work to try to keep them that way.
 
I'm sure the three teenagers suspected in the death of 23-year-old Christopher Lane -- killed because they allegedly were bored -- started off as angels. But who, besides their parents, would call them angels now?
 
"I know my son. He's a good kid," said Jennifer Luna, the mother of the boy prosecutor Jason Hicks said pulled the trigger.
 

Australians shocked by Okla. murder


Australian student shot dead in U.S.
As a newspaper reporter, I covered and was around a fair number of crime scenes involving juvenile delinquents and few things bothered me more than listening to their parents. Crying, ranting, proclaiming how great their children were despite being kicked out of school or previous run-ins with the law.
 
That's not to say kids won't be kids. Of course they will be.
 
Which is why it is vitally important that parents be parents.
 
So when kids get bored, they don't think they should go "f**k with some n**gers," as then-18-year-old Deryl Dedmon Jr. suggested before he and his buddies ran over and killed 49-year-old auto worker James Craig Anderson, the first black person he saw, with his pickup truck back in 2011. Or randomly shoot a college student jogging down the street as entertainment -- though it seems the shooting may not have been as random as previously thought considering one of the suspects, who is black, tweeted that he hated white people back in April.
 
Parents are supposed to instill a sense of right and wrong in their children and then keep up the due diligence necessary to make sure they don't veer off that path. When parents don't do that, we end up with three 15-year-olds assaulting and breaking the arm of a 13-year-old on a school bus in Florida.
 
"This is life. I am sorry what happened to the victim," Julian McKnight Sr., whose son Julian was one of the boys accused in the attack, said after a court appearance. A second appearance is scheduled later this month.
 
"It's just the way it is. My son ain't never been no bad person, he just got mixed with bad people, that's all ... he sorry."
 

I am not a perfect parent with all the answers. But I do know that it was the father, and not the son, who was apologizing -- and that, my friends, is our problem in a nutshell.
 
We don't teach accountability, we don't expect accountability and I'm not even sure we even know what accountability looks like anymore. Some of us have become so addicted to pointing fingers at others for all the wrong that happens in our lives that self-assessment has become synonymous with blaming the victim.
 
Yes, there are cultural factors that make parenting difficult. And sometimes a bad seed is just that. But none of this excuses us from taking personal responsibility where we can.
 
I am tired of seeing "sorry" being used to cloak negligent parents.
 

Sorry won't bring back Christopher Lane or James Craig Anderson.
 
And they, too, were each somebody's "angel."
 
If sorry is not good enough to protect a bartender who serves alcohol to a visibly intoxicated person who drives and kills someone, why is sorry good enough for parents who, through negligence, are culpable for the crimes their undisciplined children commit?
 

If my son goes out and breaks the neighbor's window, I have to pay for it. Why is a window more sacred than another human life?
 
We need to hold parents more accountable, both culturally and legally, for the actions of their children. Maybe then more parents will be more engaged in the lives of their children on the front end, rather than the back end, in front of a judge. Society has avenues for juveniles who refuse to obey their parents. But where are the safeguards for society when parents decide not to use those avenues?
 
I'm tired of hearing how good the kids who commit heinous crimes are. Maybe we should start putting parents on the witness stand so they can tell us exactly what they did to raise such perfect children.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/08/22/opinion/granderson-criminal-kids-responsibility/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

Show the bravest of the brave kids that you have their back.  Go to http://www.childrenscancercenter.org/

Just check out the site or maybe like them on Facebook . .  or Share the site on Facebook, re-tweet one of their tweets.  Not everyone can give money to support this great cause, but its easy to give 10 seconds of your time to help spread the word about The Children\'s Cancer Center

spartan

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#1 : August 22, 2013, 12:51:01 PM

Start teaching and enforcing some respect and manners for one.

I brook no disrespect or attitude in my house. My kids are allowed to disagree with me, but the moment they get attitude, conversation over.

It's a bit like enforcing your please and thank you's. They might not understand it, and it may seem trivial, but by the time they are 7 or 8 it is automatic. Then when you speak politely to someone, they speak politely to you and life is so much easier.
: August 22, 2013, 12:53:17 PM spartan

John Galt?

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#2 : August 22, 2013, 01:15:50 PM

I completely agree with this article.

Quote
If my son goes out and breaks the neighbor's window, I have to pay for it. Why is a window more sacred than another human life?
 
We need to hold parents more accountable, both culturally and legally, for the actions of their children. Maybe then more parents will be more engaged in the lives of their children on the front end, rather than the back end, in front of a judge. Society has avenues for juveniles who refuse to obey their parents. But where are the safeguards for society when parents decide not to use those avenues?
 

I believe that parents should be held responsible for the actions of their (under 18) children. If the kid breaks a window, the parent has to pay to replace it. If the kid steals a car, the parent pays for all costs to retrieve the car and any repairs to restore it. If a kid shots someone, parent is liable for all medical bills, lost wages, pain and suffering, etc. etc. Also if a kid shots someone, at that point, the parents ability to maintain custody of any other children should be questioned. If the 17 yo is in prison, the 14yo is jailed for armed robbery, then for God's sake, remove the 6 and 10 yo while they can still be saved.


VinBucFan

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#3 : August 22, 2013, 01:39:11 PM

since absentee fathers is such a huge issue, is there a solution there? Forced paternity testing and forced support? Not sure that replaces an engaged father but it might slow the decision to have children? Right now its almsot no-fault

Show the bravest of the brave kids that you have their back.  Go to http://www.childrenscancercenter.org/

Just check out the site or maybe like them on Facebook . .  or Share the site on Facebook, re-tweet one of their tweets.  Not everyone can give money to support this great cause, but its easy to give 10 seconds of your time to help spread the word about The Children\'s Cancer Center

John Galt?

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#4 : August 22, 2013, 01:58:00 PM

There is plenty of paternity testing and as to forced support, get behind on your child support in Fl and see what happens (hint suspended DL, arrest warrants, wage garnishment, etc.).

I'd bet that most of those absentee fathers were involved in unplanned pregnancies. Now condoms and BC pills are free (via Planned Parenthood) but still there are millions of unplanned pregnancies. So it must be concluded that "free give-aways" doesn't make irresponsible people act responsibly.


VinBucFan

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#5 : August 22, 2013, 02:13:25 PM

There is plenty of paternity testing and as to forced support, get behind on your child support in Fl and see what happens (hint suspended DL, arrest warrants, wage garnishment, etc.).

I'd bet that most of those absentee fathers were involved in unplanned pregnancies. Now condoms and BC pills are free (via Planned Parenthood) but still there are millions of unplanned pregnancies. So it must be concluded that "free give-aways" doesn't make irresponsible people act responsibly.

well, and some pregnancies were intentional but planned to be single parent, particulalry in the poorest neighborhoods

Show the bravest of the brave kids that you have their back.  Go to http://www.childrenscancercenter.org/

Just check out the site or maybe like them on Facebook . .  or Share the site on Facebook, re-tweet one of their tweets.  Not everyone can give money to support this great cause, but its easy to give 10 seconds of your time to help spread the word about The Children\'s Cancer Center

John Galt?

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#6 : August 22, 2013, 03:16:08 PM

There is plenty of paternity testing and as to forced support, get behind on your child support in Fl and see what happens (hint suspended DL, arrest warrants, wage garnishment, etc.).

I'd bet that most of those absentee fathers were involved in unplanned pregnancies. Now condoms and BC pills are free (via Planned Parenthood) but still there are millions of unplanned pregnancies. So it must be concluded that "free give-aways" doesn't make irresponsible people act responsibly.

well, and some pregnancies were intentional but planned to be single parent, particulalry in the poorest neighborhoods


I doubt the number of those is very significant. Far more unplanned pregnancies where the mom decides afterward "it will be fun to be a mom". In either case a very poorly thought out decision. If any single women (young girl) actually knew and believed that a baby would consume 120-130% of her free time (it will consume work/school hours too), she would not be so quick to have one.


spartan

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#7 : August 22, 2013, 04:53:06 PM

since absentee fathers is such a huge issue, is there a solution there? Forced paternity testing and forced support? Not sure that replaces an engaged father but it might slow the decision to have children? Right now its almsot no-fault

Once bitten twice shy.

Young girl can make a mistake, but not twice. You get no handouts or benefits for the 2nd child. Bit harsh and puts the onus on the girl I know, but I'm betting in the long run girls will either learn to either not have sex or take better precautions. Whether you like it or not, the girl has the controlling commodity here.

Bucfucious

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#8 : August 22, 2013, 04:56:25 PM

Commodities can increase in value if you sit on them for a while.

cyberdude558

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#9 : August 22, 2013, 05:01:26 PM

Dont they still do that thing in schools where a girl carries around an electronic baby doll? Its like programmed to start crying in the middle of the night and that kind of stuff.

Skull and Bones

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#10 : August 22, 2013, 06:31:34 PM

All my high school could afford was an egg.


VinBucFan

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#11 : August 22, 2013, 07:09:57 PM

There is plenty of paternity testing and as to forced support, get behind on your child support in Fl and see what happens (hint suspended DL, arrest warrants, wage garnishment, etc.).

I'd bet that most of those absentee fathers were involved in unplanned pregnancies. Now condoms and BC pills are free (via Planned Parenthood) but still there are millions of unplanned pregnancies. So it must be concluded that "free give-aways" doesn't make irresponsible people act responsibly.

well, and some pregnancies were intentional but planned to be single parent, particulalry in the poorest neighborhoods


I doubt the number of those is very significant. Far more unplanned pregnancies where the mom decides afterward "it will be fun to be a mom". In either case a very poorly thought out decision. If any single women (young girl) actually knew and believed that a baby would consume 120-130% of her free time (it will consume work/school hours too), she would not be so quick to have one.

Yeah, I wasn't suggesting it was an educated choice but I have seen several article describing the scenario I described as a partial explanation for the large number of single mom families in poor African American communities.

Show the bravest of the brave kids that you have their back.  Go to http://www.childrenscancercenter.org/

Just check out the site or maybe like them on Facebook . .  or Share the site on Facebook, re-tweet one of their tweets.  Not everyone can give money to support this great cause, but its easy to give 10 seconds of your time to help spread the word about The Children\'s Cancer Center

VinBucFan

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#12 : August 22, 2013, 07:11:37 PM

since absentee fathers is such a huge issue, is there a solution there? Forced paternity testing and forced support? Not sure that replaces an engaged father but it might slow the decision to have children? Right now its almsot no-fault

Once bitten twice shy.

Young girl can make a mistake, but not twice. You get no handouts or benefits for the 2nd child. Bit harsh and puts the onus on the girl I know, but I'm betting in the long run girls will either learn to either not have sex or take better precautions. Whether you like it or not, the girl has the controlling commodity here.

That may be true but of the two the person most often not meeting their obligation is the guy

Show the bravest of the brave kids that you have their back.  Go to http://www.childrenscancercenter.org/

Just check out the site or maybe like them on Facebook . .  or Share the site on Facebook, re-tweet one of their tweets.  Not everyone can give money to support this great cause, but its easy to give 10 seconds of your time to help spread the word about The Children\'s Cancer Center

spartan

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#13 : August 22, 2013, 09:03:39 PM

since absentee fathers is such a huge issue, is there a solution there? Forced paternity testing and forced support? Not sure that replaces an engaged father but it might slow the decision to have children? Right now its almsot no-fault

Once bitten twice shy.

Young girl can make a mistake, but not twice. You get no handouts or benefits for the 2nd child. Bit harsh and puts the onus on the girl I know, but I'm betting in the long run girls will either learn to either not have sex or take better precautions. Whether you like it or not, the girl has the controlling commodity here.

That may be true but of the two the person most often not meeting their obligation is the guy

That is true, but you are talking after the fact. Being blunt and practical, not judgmental, the girls keep their legs closed and there is no "after the fact". If they take precautions there is no "after the fact". Preventative is normally ten times cheaper and more effective than the "cure".

VinBucFan

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#14 : August 22, 2013, 10:08:07 PM

since absentee fathers is such a huge issue, is there a solution there? Forced paternity testing and forced support? Not sure that replaces an engaged father but it might slow the decision to have children? Right now its almsot no-fault

Once bitten twice shy.

Young girl can make a mistake, but not twice. You get no handouts or benefits for the 2nd child. Bit harsh and puts the onus on the girl I know, but I'm betting in the long run girls will either learn to either not have sex or take better precautions. Whether you like it or not, the girl has the controlling commodity here.

That may be true but of the two the person most often not meeting their obligation is the guy

That is true, but you are talking after the fact. Being blunt and practical, not judgmental, the girls keep their legs closed and there is no "after the fact". If they take precautions there is no "after the fact". Preventative is normally ten times cheaper and more effective than the "cure".

fair point

Show the bravest of the brave kids that you have their back.  Go to http://www.childrenscancercenter.org/

Just check out the site or maybe like them on Facebook . .  or Share the site on Facebook, re-tweet one of their tweets.  Not everyone can give money to support this great cause, but its easy to give 10 seconds of your time to help spread the word about The Children\'s Cancer Center
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