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CalcuttaRain

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« : October 07, 2013, 04:07:21 PM »

One world is occupied by people fed a steady diet of NRA propoganda, a world where guns are needed to protect ourselves, from marauding murderrs and the government.  The other world, The Annenberg Policy Center. 

Here's the anti-gun control rant, entitled a "Little Gun History Lesson" with the theme that guns are essential to preventing crime and protecting liberty:

In 1929, the Soviet Union established gun control. From 1929 to 1953, about 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
 
In 1911, Turkey established gun control. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
 
Germany established gun control in 1938 and from 1939 to 1945, a total of 13 million Jews and others who were unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated
 
China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million  political dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and  exterminated.
 
Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000  Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and  exterminated.
 
Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000  Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated..
 
Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, one  million ‘educated’ people, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up  and exterminated.
 
Defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century  because of gun control: 56 million.
 
It has now been 12 months since gun owners in Australia were forced by new law to surrender 640,381 personal firearms to be destroyed by their own government, a program costing Australia taxpayers more than $500 million dollars. The first year results are now in:
 
Australia-wide, homicides are up 3.2 percent.
 
Australia-wide, assaults are up 8.6 percent.
 
Australia-wide, armed robberies are up 44 percent (yes, 44 percent)!
 
In the state of Victoria alone, homicides with firearms are now up
 300 percent. Note that while the law-abiding citizens turned them in,
 the criminals did not, and criminals still possess their guns!
 
It will never happen here? I bet the Aussies said that too!
 
While figures over the previous 25 years showed a steady decrease in armed robbery with firearms, this has changed drastically upward in the past 12 months, since criminals now are guaranteed that their prey is  unarmed.
 
There has also been a dramatic increase in break-ins and assaults of the ELDERLY. Australian politicians are at a loss to explain how public safety has decreased, after such monumental effort and expense was expended in successfully ridding Australian society of guns. The Australian experience and the other historical facts above prove it.
 
You won’t see this data on the US evening news, or hear politicians disseminating this information.
 
Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws adversely affect only the law-abiding citizens..
 
Take note my fellow Americans, before it’s too late!
 
The next time someone talks in favor of gun control, please remind him of this history lesson.
 
With Guns…………We Are ‘Citizens’.
 
Without Them……..We Are ‘Subjects’..
 
During W.W…II the Japanese decided not to invade America because they knew most Americans were ARMED!
 
Note: Admiral Yamamoto who crafted the attack on Pearl Harbor had attended Harvard U 1919-1921 & was Naval Attaché to the U. S… 1925-28. Most of our Navy was destroyed at Pearl Harbor & our Army had been deprived of funding & was ill prepared to defend the country.
 
It was reported that when asked why Japan did not follow up the Pearl Harbor attack with an invasion of the U. S. Mainland, his reply was that he had lived in the U. S. & knew that almost all households had guns.
 
If you value your freedom, spread this anti-gun control message to your friends!


Here's the Anneberg reponse  (I left off the part responding to the laughable claim that the Japanese did not attck the US in WWII becuase US citizens were armed)

"The e-mail says that "t has now been 12 months since gun owners in Australia were forced by new law to surrender 640,381 personal firearms." Actually, it’s been 13 years since Australian gun law was originally changed. In 1996, the government banned some types of guns, instituted a buyback program and imposed stricter licensing and registration requirements. Gun ownership rates in Australia declined from 7 percent to 5 percent. Another law in 2002 tightened restrictions a bit more, restricting caliber, barrel length and capacity for sport shooting handguns.
 
Have murders increased since the gun law change, as claimed? Actually, Australian crime statistics show a marked decrease in homicides since the gun law change. According to the Australian Institute of Criminology, a government agency, the number of homicides in Australia did increase slightly in 1997 and peaked in 1999, but has since declined to the lowest number on record in 2007, the most recent year for which official figures are available."




Furthermore, murders using firearms have declined even more sharply than murders in general since the 1996 gun law. In the seven years prior to 1997, firearms were used in 24 percent of all Australian homicides. But most recently, firearms were used in only 11 percent of Australian homicides, according to figures for the 12 months ending July 1, 2007. That’s a decline of more than half since enactment of the gun law to which this message refers.
 
Some scholars even credit the 1996 gun law with causing the decrease in deaths from firearms, though they are still debating that point. A 2003 study from AIC, which looked at rates between 1991 and 2001, found that some of the decline in firearm-related homicides (and suicides as well) began before the reform was enacted. On the other hand, a 2006 analysis by scholars at the University of Sydney concluded that gun fatalities decreased more quickly after the reform. Yet another analysis, from 2008, from the University of Melbourne, concluded that the buyback had no significant effect on firearm suicide or homicide rates.
 
So there’s no consensus about whether the changes decreased gun violence or had little to no effect. But the only argument we’ve seen arguing that it caused an increase in murder comes from our anonymous e-mail author.
 
The claims about Australian gun control were circulating as far back as 2001, when Snopes.com went over them and concluded that they were a "small, mixed grab bag of short-term statistics" signifying little

Show the bravest of the brave kids that you have their back.  Go to http://www.childrenscancercenter.org/

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spartan

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« #1 : October 07, 2013, 04:55:05 PM »

You're nothing if not persistent I will grant you that.

Problem is, I remember you rejecting out of hand the studies and statistics that those States that have enacted concealed weapon laws have seen a reduction in murder and violent crime. Something to do with trees, woods, running into them or something.  So explain to me why this should be treated any different?

CalcuttaRain

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« #2 : October 07, 2013, 05:20:22 PM »

You're nothing if not persistent I will grant you that.

Problem is, I remember you rejecting out of hand the studies and statistics that those States that have enacted concealed weapon laws have seen a reduction in murder and violent crime. Something to do with trees, woods, running into them or something.  So explain to me why this should be treated any different?

I am not sure I follow? I dont recall the specific report you're speaking of? Who was the source?

Without recalling though - I think I see why I may have "rejected" it (your word, not mine) in your comment:  "those States that have enacted concealed weapon laws have seen a reduction in murder and violent crime."  That is what I like to call the "Illuminator argument".  Was "murder and violent crime" down overall?  There's a reason that pro-gun people like to tie GUNS to the broader topics of "murder and violent crime" rather than gun violence and its usually because the pro-gun person is trying to create an argument for  causation.  If you notice the Anneberg report actually references GUN violence or homicides and the fact they dropped quicker than other violence or homicides during the same period.  That is a BIG difference because its indicative of causation (i.e., gun control reduced gun violence) that pro gun types say does not exist (i.e., that you're just as likely to bump into a tree in the ocean as a forest).

That said, the Anneberg report above supports and does not support my position. It's basically down the middle EXCEPT it debunks the notion that more guns = more safety, which is the point made by the pro-gun person who wrote the email (and not coincidentally, a big theme for the NRA). That argument is the "fear" I reference occassionally ("if you take away our guns you'll leave me exposed")

On the persistence claim, I dont expect or care is most of you guys read it, nothing would change your minds. I just came across it so I posted it. Consider it an exercise of free speech . .  . that everyone is free to ignore.
« : October 07, 2013, 05:22:38 PM VinBucFan »

Show the bravest of the brave kids that you have their back.  Go to http://www.childrenscancercenter.org/

Just check out the site or maybe like them on Facebook . .  or Share the site on Facebook, re-tweet one of their tweets.  Not everyone can give money to support this great cause, but its easy to give 10 seconds of your time to help spread the word about The Children\\\\\\\'s Cancer Center

CalcuttaRain

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« #3 : November 01, 2013, 03:21:17 PM »

http://www.cnn.com/2013/11/01/us/lax-gunfire/

Show the bravest of the brave kids that you have their back.  Go to http://www.childrenscancercenter.org/

Just check out the site or maybe like them on Facebook . .  or Share the site on Facebook, re-tweet one of their tweets.  Not everyone can give money to support this great cause, but its easy to give 10 seconds of your time to help spread the word about The Children\\\\\\\'s Cancer Center
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