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ufojoe

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« #30 : June 12, 2007, 01:42:29 PM »

Unless they are underground Joe, IMO I think the number of photos taken of Mars, particularly by satellites, rovers, explorers etc would have come up with at least some inclination of ruins. There are vast expanses of rocky terrain so I don't think we can explain it by simply saying they would be buried under sand or similar.

In theory, if a civilization WAS on Mars 500,000 years ago and then died out for one reason or another, what
would we expect to see? Is Mars known for sandstorms? How would 500,000 years (or longer) of sandstorms
affect the ruins? Would they be eroded? Would they be buried? Have you ever seen photos of the Sphinx
when it was found? The body is buried under sand with the head sticking out.



And that is only after a few thousand years. Imagine what the Giza plateau (or the Cydonia region of Mars)
would look like after 500,000 years of sandstorms?

For those interested in the evidence for artificial ruins on Mars and the Moon, check out:

http://spsr.utsi.edu

It features the work of over thirty scientists and independent researchers. Some of the work is in
peer reviewed journals.

spartan

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« #31 : June 12, 2007, 01:57:49 PM »

With all due respect Joe, some of this stuff is pretty fascinating and can be construed as areas of interest should we actually go and have a extended look on Mars, but I see faces, animals, objects and all kinds of wierd and wonderful things in the clouds, but what does that proove? It is certainly not a basis for debuncting any kind of religion.

dr3z

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« #32 : June 12, 2007, 02:01:57 PM »

I bet there are Dinosaur egs on Mars that are going to hatch at anytime now. And when they do it will spawn the begining of a new age in the world.
Man and Dinosaur living together again, it'll be like the Flintstones!! WILMA!!!!!!!!!!

ufojoe

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« #33 : June 12, 2007, 02:06:45 PM »

With all due respect Joe, some of this stuff is pretty fascinating and can be construed as areas of interest should we actually go and have a extended look on Mars, but I see faces, animals, objects and all kinds of wierd and wonderful things in the clouds, but what does that proove? It is certainly not a basis for debuncting any kind of religion.

If you actually read the books and/or papers that have been written on the subject you will see how it's not
about seeing weird and wonderful things in the clouds or on Mars. With all due respect, have you read any of
the serious work that has been done on this topic or are you assuming things?

Debunking religion? I didn't start this thread and it's not the angle I usually take when talking about
Cydonia. I responded to the original post and even then didn't say it would debunk religion. Now, if
someone else had a hand in the creation/evolution of Mankind? That's another story.

dr3z

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« #34 : June 12, 2007, 02:07:45 PM »

What about the Dinosaurs!!!!!!!

With all due respect Joe, some of this stuff is pretty fascinating and can be construed as areas of interest should we actually go and have a extended look on Mars, but I see faces, animals, objects and all kinds of wierd and wonderful things in the clouds, but what does that proove? It is certainly not a basis for debuncting any kind of religion.

If you actually read the books and/or papers that have been written on the subject you will see how it's not
about seeing weird and wonderful things in the clouds or on Mars. With all due respect, have you read any of
the serious work that has been done on this topic or are you assuming things?

Debunking religion? I didn't start this thread and it's not the angle I usually take when talking about
Cydonia. I responded to the original post and even then didn't say it would debunk religion. Now, if
someone else had a hand in the creation/evolution of Mankind? That's another story.

spartan

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« #35 : June 12, 2007, 02:29:04 PM »

I read some of it Joe, obviously haven't got time to do an in depth study, but some of it went right over my head and other bits did look like it was spotting things in the clouds. I put the debunking religion bit in because that was after all the intent of the initial thread.

FYI, and I think I have said this before, I am actually extremely interested in the whole SciFi, extra terrestial thing. Outside of sports I think the SciFi Channel is my favorite. Ok, it might compete with the History Channel but it's a close call. This isn't some kind of anti-science fiction/fantasy/<insert some un-insulting phrase here>, I just try to put things into perspective and rationalize. I would be totally fascinated if stuff was found on Mars, but I try to see things that are there rather than try to see things I want to be there. If I don't see something I say so, simple as that.

ufojoe

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« #36 : June 12, 2007, 02:49:25 PM »

FYI, and I think I have said this before, I am actually extremely interested in the whole SciFi, extra terrestial thing. Outside of sports I think the SciFi Channel is my favorite. Ok, it might compete with the History Channel but it's a close call. This isn't some kind of anti-science fiction/fantasy/<insert some un-insulting phrase here>, I just try to put things into perspective and rationalize. I would be totally fascinated if stuff was found on Mars, but I try to see things that are there rather than try to see things I want to be there. If I don't see something I say so, simple as that.

And so do I. I have seen plenty of "evidence" of artificial stuff on Mars that I think is pure crap.

But, the difference between me (and a lot of other people who are into this stuff) and some
others is that I don't go in with an biased opinion. Most people hear the words "Intelligent Life
on Mars In The Past" and immediately dismiss it because they have been taught that it is
impossible. They let their emotions and preconceived notions get in the way. Just like
when people first heard about the Wright Brothers were flying. "A bunch of hoaxers!,"
claimed Scientific American. How unscientific.

When I first heard about Mars, I was like, "What? I have never heard of that. How can that
be?" I DID have a bit of a negative opinion about it but vowed to look at a decent amount
of the evidence before forming a more solid opinion. And that's what I did.

I still don't know if there are artificial ruins up there but IMO, there is enough evidence
there to warrant a rover being sent to Cydonia.

As an example of what I am talking about, do you remember when I posted photos of
objects that looked like banyan trees? It was from a satellite photo. I asked everybody,
"What Are These?" And I told them the photos were taken over an area of the SW
United States. Most people said they looked like vegetation or trees. Do you think they
would have said the same thing if I had told them the photos were taken over Mars?

A priori...



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« #37 : June 12, 2007, 04:28:53 PM »

It's fun to fantasize or wonder about life on other planets cause it keeps us from being bored, but even if there was other life going on by the time they get the technology to discover it all most of us will be dead and gone(so why worry about it so much).  :-

ufojoe

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« #38 : June 12, 2007, 04:32:40 PM »

Who's worried? And you're wrong about the technology. You need to get up on the latest.

dr3z

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« #39 : June 12, 2007, 04:40:00 PM »

Im telling you guys Dinosaurs!!!



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« #40 : June 12, 2007, 05:09:36 PM »

Joe we barely have any decent PHOTOS from up in space aboard the space shuttle much less landing on any planet to explore, and that space program has been up and running for what - 25 years now.  :-

ufojoe

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« #41 : June 12, 2007, 09:18:57 PM »

We have plenty of awesome photos from satellites and rovers. And the technology I'm talking about is
about a decade away. I don't know about you but I plan on at least another 40-50 years. I plan to
be alive when we have a breakthrough on life on other planets. If we have the breakthrough.





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« #42 : June 13, 2007, 05:16:48 PM »

That's a biiiig IF Joe, so I wouldn't get my hopes up.

Snook

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« #43 : June 13, 2007, 06:08:16 PM »

Sorry but Wiki is not the only place with info. on the scrolls.

And yes, some of it seems to contradict the Bible in a big way.

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0193627.html

The scrolls also shed light on the time when Jesus and John the Baptist lived and early Christians began to organize. Specifically, they offer evidence that early Christian beliefs and practices had precedents in the Jewish sects of the time. Sectarian scrolls tell of people who, like the early Christians, did not believe in the Temple worship of the Pharisees, people who had their own literature, their own rituals—including baptism—and their own beliefs, most significantly beliefs in a messiah, a divine judgment, and an apocalypse. Three different scrolls depict a sacred meal of bread and wine. These similarities as well as parallels between the literary style of certain scrolls and that of the New Testament have led some scholars to claim that Jesus and John the Baptist were either part of or strongly influenced by a sect at the Dead Sea. But no direct link has been established, and it is likely that similarities can be attributed to each being derived from a like strain of Judaism. Still, this debate has furthered speculation about the historical Jesus, such as the claim that he was a Zealot rather than a pacifist, a theory that does not fit with New Testament tradition but does fit with the history of this period. And one of the most important discoveries in the scrolls has been the use of the name Son of God to refer to someone other than Jesus, implying a cultural use of the term that was not itself synonymous with God.

I'm with Joe on this.  The BIG flaw with the Bible is that its edited by man.  Man has chosen what parts to include and what parts to leave out in the "bible".  I have a hard time believing something is the 'word of God' after its been edited by religious and church officials through thousands of years.




Guest
« #44 : June 13, 2007, 07:37:37 PM »

I pick and choose the parts that I think are believable, but I will never just dismiss the entire bible and all it's contents like some people tend to do.
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