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: September 24, 2007, 01:26:44 AM

This is an unbelievable picture. What can be said about this picture. Can you imagine a player doing that to Ditka, Reid, Cowher, Del Rio, Denny Green, Holmgren...what can be read into this picture? Even a guy like Dungy who you know isn't going to rip anyone's head off I can't imagine that being done. Did Clayton step over the line, or does Gruden accept this stuff? Gruden being the emotional guy he is, maybe understands and accepts this kind of behavior, knowing the players feel the same emotion? Or is this flat out disrespect? I'd like to see a time line of photos. I saw the confrontation on the side line, but the TV panned over once the argument started. I wonder if the argument was started because of this, or if this during it. I don't remember seeing Mike grab Jon during their sideline argument on TV.


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#1 : September 24, 2007, 01:33:52 AM

I haven't seen the game yet, but that is shocking.   I would never even consider grabbing the shirt of what is the equivalent of  my boss, regardless of how angry I was.   That's a low class move by Clayton.   

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#2 : September 24, 2007, 01:38:08 AM

A player that does that should be suspended by the team.

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#3 : September 24, 2007, 01:38:16 AM

I am stunned by this. Clayton drops a pass. Few plays later, he catches one but fumbles it. How could he not expect to get an earful from Gruden. Any coach would have given him hell for the way he played, so what was his arguement? Alex Smith recovered the fumble? Seriously. He's got nothing. The Tampa Bay Buccaneer organization is home to professionals. That action today, was disgraceful to the name and I'm sure plenty of radio hosts will stir the pot with this story.

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#4 : September 24, 2007, 01:40:23 AM

Unless Clayton was holding Gruden back from attacking a ref.

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#5 : September 24, 2007, 01:45:50 AM

I think that with the way Clayton has played he should be happy Gruden is even still playing him. That picture speaks volumes about the kind of person Clayton is IMO. Huge ego and zero accountability.

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#6 : September 24, 2007, 01:49:20 AM

A player that does that should be suspended by the team.

I totally agree.   No player should ever be allowed to lay a hand on any of the coaches like that.

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#7 : September 24, 2007, 01:50:38 AM

I think that with the way Clayton has played he should be happy Gruden is even still playing him. That picture speaks volumes about the kind of person Clayton is IMO. Huge ego and zero accountability.
Maybe it also speaks volumes about the amount of respect, or lack there of for their head coach. That picture is not good no matter how you look at it, or why it happened.

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#8 : September 24, 2007, 01:53:21 AM

What I think happened, and I did catch that he did this during the game, was that Gruden jumped all over him when he came to the sideline. After Gruden jumped all over him Clayton seemed to be pleading his case to him, in which he grabbed Gruden's shirt, and put his hand on Gruden's back as well. When I was watching the game, at first I thought it was Clayton mouthing off to him as others have said, but I think he was actually apologizing for the fumble / drop. I don't know that for sure, but I think that's what happened or at least that was my interpretation from watching it.

Gruden doesn't tolerate this. He didn't tolerate it with Key and he was our #1 WR. Clayton couldn't have been badmouthing him. Also, Clayton was put back in the game. If he was badmouthing Gruden I doubt that would have happened.

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#9 : September 24, 2007, 01:54:24 AM

Actually, Mike was just giving Gruden a purple nurple and congratulating him on coaching a good game.

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#10 : September 24, 2007, 01:54:42 AM

I don't know that it relates to lack of respect as much as it relates to the way Gruden handles the players.   Most coaches stand apart from the players.   Gruden does crazy crap like lining up on defense and covering the receivers and things like that.    When he does things like that, he's crossing the line if you ask me.   I've always thought that Gruden doing things like covering the receivers can do nothing more than cause the players to act too familiar with him.    It's not a coaches job to do that, and I think it's a huge mistake by Gruden.   I know Gru enjoys that kind of crap, but he needs to realize the place of the coach relative to the players.

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#11 : September 24, 2007, 01:56:06 AM

Well Abuccs the PR guys have done a couple of stories asking players off the record about their opinions on Gruden and it always comes back favorable. The last guy I'd expect to be against Gruden is Clayton, simply because he is still allowed to play given his poor play. If Clayton does have something against Gruden I'd wager he is in the extreme minority.

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#12 : September 24, 2007, 01:56:41 AM

I don't know that it relates to lack of respect as much as it relates to the way Gruden handles the players.   Most coaches stand apart from the players.   Gruden does crazy crap like lining up on defense and covering the receivers and things like that.    When he does things like that, he's crossing the line if you ask me.   I've always thought that Gruden doing things like covering the receivers can do nothing more than cause the players to act too familiar with him.    It's not a coaches job to do that, and I think it's a huge mistake by Gruden.   I know Gru enjoys that kind of crap, but he needs to realize the place of the coach relative to the players.
Oh boy, you're going to get crap for that post java.

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#13 : September 24, 2007, 01:58:49 AM

Well Abuccs the PR guys have done a couple of stories asking players off the record about their opinions on Gruden and it always comes back favorable. The last guy I'd expect to be against Gruden is Clayton, simply because he is still allowed to play given his poor play. If Clayton does have something against Gruden I'd wager he is in the extreme minority.
That's how you interperted those stories? Favorable? I wouldn't say they went to either side of the fence. Mostly got from those stories, that he's the coach, and we have to deal with him in that manner.

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#14 : September 24, 2007, 02:06:01 AM

Yeah, that's what I get from the stories. Of course I do read them while keeping in mind that losing will make any player question their coach. I bet if they did another story like that right now you would get some a boat load of pro Gruden responses.
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