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alldaway

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: November 25, 2007, 12:12:42 AM

His draft record is not as good some have led you to believe (especially recently as highly in this thread).

Carroll contributed to the decline of the team.  But the team was already on the decline and that is why Bill bolted (as he usually does).  Parcells is not about building a team or drafting for the "long term".  Bill Parcells is all about the win now and always has been that way.


BucsPirate

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#1 : October 09, 2007, 12:09:05 PM

Let me preface this by saying that I am a Gruden/ Allen/ Doug Williams fan, and I feel that they have done a decent job with our personnel over the last few years. That said, I think all of us would agree that Parcells did a much better job in Dallas over that same time.

I do not believe that Allen is a puppet to Gruden, but I do believe that he probably defers to the requests of his coaching staff on personnel moves more than most GMs do. Parcells would bring a different dynamic as someone who has been evaluating NFL talent for 30 years. Ideally Allen and Williams would stay on board, Allen being in more of a cap management type role, as that is where he has proven to be extremely talented, but Parcells would have the last say on Personnel. I also think that the give and take between Parcells and Gruden would make for even better personnel acquisitions than what Parcells did in Dallas.

bradentonian

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#2 : October 09, 2007, 12:10:46 PM

I think Parcells is a very good talent evaluator


DanTurksGhost

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#3 : October 09, 2007, 12:10:53 PM

If Parcells came here, Allen would be out. They would not co-exist. Additionally, as a coach, Parcells wanted say-so over personnell, as does Gruden. I don't see either one wanting to give in to the other on that here.

Boid Fink

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#4 : October 09, 2007, 12:13:24 PM

So basically the Allen is Grudens puppet (mouthpiece) theory is true then?

Don't get me wrong, I would not want to lose Allen.

But if Gruden gets canned, I would mos def like to see him as a HC candidate, even though he has said he is not desirous of HCing again...


BucsPirate

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#5 : October 09, 2007, 12:14:48 PM

If Parcells came here, Allen would be out. They would not co-exist. Additionally, as a coach, Parcells wanted say-so over personnell, as does Gruden. I don't see either one wanting to give in to the other on that here.

Does Allen have the rep to get another GM job right away? If not I don't know that he wouldn't choose to stay.

If Gruden goes somewhere else to coach, he probably will not have close to the say in personnel moves that he has here anyway.

BucsPirate

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#6 : October 09, 2007, 12:17:45 PM

So basically the Allen is Grudens puppet (mouthpiece) theory is true then?

Don't get me wrong, I would not want to lose Allen.

But if Gruden gets canned, I would mos def like to see him as a HC candidate, even though he has said he is not desirous of HCing again...

That is not what I am saying. Allen doesn't do whatever Gruden wants. My only point is that the impression exists that Allen's primary skill is not talent evaluation. Maybe that is a false impression, but the way players are chosen at One Buc that assumption can be made.

DanTurksGhost

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#7 : October 09, 2007, 12:19:32 PM

So basically the Allen is Grudens puppet (mouthpiece) theory is true then?

No, but Bruce has the sort of personality that allows him to work with Coach and sort of "massage" situations to the best advantage of the team. Parcells doesn't, he's a "my way or the highway" guy.

DanTurksGhost

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#8 : October 09, 2007, 12:20:36 PM

My only point is that the impression exists that Allen's primary skill is not talent evaluation.

I think you may have a mis-guided impression of how talent evaluation works.

bizkitlimped

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#9 : October 09, 2007, 12:23:54 PM

i wouldn't mind having him at either staffing spot...gm or head ball coach


BucsPirate

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#10 : October 09, 2007, 12:26:36 PM

My only point is that the impression exists that Allen's primary skill is not talent evaluation.

I think you may have a mis-guided impression of how talent evaluation works.

I understand that there are many people involved in talent evaluation. All I am saying is that Bill Parcells is a better talent evaluator  than Jon Gruden, Bruce Allen, or Doug Williams.

DanTurksGhost

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#11 : October 09, 2007, 12:27:30 PM

I understand that there are many people involved in talent evaluation. All I am saying is that Bill Parcells is a better talent evaluator  than Jon Gruden, Bruce Allen, or Doug Williams.

Based on?

redbeard10

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#12 : October 09, 2007, 12:30:09 PM

So basically the Allen is Grudens puppet (mouthpiece) theory is true then?

Don't get me wrong, I would not want to lose Allen.

But if Gruden gets canned, I would mos def like to see him as a HC candidate, even though he has said he is not desirous of HCing again...

That is not what I am saying. Allen doesn't do whatever Gruden wants. My only point is that the impression exists that Allen's primary skill is not talent evaluation. Maybe that is a false impression, but the way players are chosen at One Buc that assumption can be made.
There's a reason teams have scouts. Bruce can't possibly keep track of all the free agents, guys available in trades, and college prospects. The scouts have to pick up some of the slack. If anything you should be questioning our scouting department.

The Q

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#13 : October 09, 2007, 12:34:28 PM

I thought that Jerry Jones was the GM in Dallas. You mean the Tuna was telling him what to do!



The BUCS are gonna surprise people this year!

DanTurksGhost

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#14 : October 09, 2007, 12:36:24 PM

There's a reason teams have scouts. Bruce can't possibly keep track of all the free agents, guys available in trades, and college prospects. The scouts have to pick up some of the slack. If anything you should be questioning our scouting department.

As you say, Allen simply can't evaluate personnel on that level. He's not a scout, and not a coach. Pre-Allen, McKay determined that all personnel decisions were made through his scouting staff and himself. Coaches were essentially excluded, except in rare circumstances (Warrick Dunn is a prime example). Post-McKay, the Bucs employ a collaborative evaluation system that includes the scouts and contributing staff, the coaches (assistants, coordinators, and HC) and the GM.
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