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bradentonian

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#15 : October 09, 2007, 12:37:35 PM

I thought that Jerry Jones was the GM in Dallas. You mean the Tuna was telling him what to do!

Yes, with the exception of TO


Feel Real Good

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#16 : October 09, 2007, 12:47:45 PM

I understand that there are many people involved in talent evaluation. All I am saying is that Bill Parcells is a better talent evaluator than Jon Gruden, Bruce Allen, or Doug Williams.

Based on?
The difference between the Cowboys' roster from 2004 to 2007 and the Bucs' roster from 2004 to 2007? I can't even believe this could be disputed.

FRG is the most logical poster on this board.  You guys just don\'t like where the logical conclusions take you.

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#17 : October 09, 2007, 12:50:33 PM

The difference between the Cowboys' roster from 2004 to 2007 and the Bucs' roster from 2004 to 2007? I can't even believe this could be disputed.

Oh, so you're saying Bill Parcells alone and no one else had anything to do with building that roster. I see.

redbeard10

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#18 : October 09, 2007, 12:56:15 PM

I understand that there are many people involved in talent evaluation. All I am saying is that Bill Parcells is a better talent evaluator than Jon Gruden, Bruce Allen, or Doug Williams.

Based on?
The difference between the Cowboys' roster from 2004 to 2007 and the Bucs' roster from 2004 to 2007? I can't even believe this could be disputed.
You know, they weren't mired in the cap hell we were during that same period. I'm just saying. They also had the picks to play with in the years before that, which we did not. It's a credit to their scouting department that they have found some of the gems they have.

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#19 : October 09, 2007, 12:58:18 PM

Can't trust Parcells, he retires, unretires, and retires again far too often.  He might take over for a year, then blow town and we have nothing.

Pass....


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#20 : October 09, 2007, 01:00:46 PM

The difference between the Cowboys' roster from 2004 to 2007 and the Bucs' roster from 2004 to 2007? I can't even believe this could be disputed.

Oh, so you're saying Bill Parcells alone and no one else had anything to do with building that roster. I see.
He's the CEO. He controls who works under him. When a corporation boasts record profits, the boss gets the credit. When things go south, the boss takes the fall. The boss may or may not have done every piece of work but it shouldn't be a revelation the buck stops with him.

Just for fun:

7th round pick Patrick Crayton: 19 receptions, 335 yards, 3 touchdowns through 5 games
1st round pick Michael Clayton and 3rd round pick Maurice Stovall COMBINED: 3 receptions, 36 yards, 0 touchdowns through 5 games

4th round pick Marion Barber III: 26 career touchdowns in 2+ seasons
1st round pick Carnell Williams: 10 career touchdowns in 2+ seasons

FRG is the most logical poster on this board.  You guys just don\'t like where the logical conclusions take you.

DanTurksGhost

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#21 : October 09, 2007, 01:02:51 PM

So how does that equate to Bill Parcells is a superior evaluator of player talent? Are you saying that if Parcells came here, the entire staff from Dallas would come as well so that they could re-create the same dynamic? Will Jerry Jones be joining them?

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#22 : October 09, 2007, 01:06:49 PM

You know, they weren't mired in the cap hell we were during that same period. I'm just saying. They also had the picks to play with in the years before that, which we did not. It's a credit to their scouting department that they have found some of the gems they have.
The Bucs were in cap hell because they actually had assets - good players under contract. Multiple pro bowlers who were being paid up to their level of play. The Cowboys had none. Parcells inherited a team with Quincy Carter and Chad Hutchinson the incumbent quarterbacks, Emmitt Smith as the leading rusher he promptly got rid of, and Joey Galloway as the leading receiver who he promtly got rid of. Then he changed the defense from a 4-3 to 3-4. Parcells inherited way more challenges than Gruden.

FRG is the most logical poster on this board.  You guys just don\'t like where the logical conclusions take you.

ShotCaller

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#23 : October 09, 2007, 01:10:20 PM

So how does that equate to Bill Parcells is a superior evaluator of player talent? Are you saying that if Parcells came here, the entire staff from Dallas would come as well so that they could re-create the same dynamic? Will Jerry Jones be joining them?

someone must have evaluated the "talent" in the talent evaluation dept. anotherwards, if the talent evaluators are not good enough, why not change them? you can't say parcells didn't do everything .. at the end of the day the buck stops here. not sure how we can argue that parcells isn't a good talent evaluator -- the man has built multiple championship caliber teams .. spotting great defensive talent and RBs.

i support gruden and i like him. i want him to stay. however, parcells has proven he can build a team.

he signed off on romo. he signed off on barber III. he signed off on demarcus. he signed off on ... the list goes on and on .. and on. who are gruden's big finds?

lets face it. talent evaluation is not the strength of the bucs over the past 5 years.

redbeard10

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#24 : October 09, 2007, 01:14:16 PM

You know, they weren't mired in the cap hell we were during that same period. I'm just saying. They also had the picks to play with in the years before that, which we did not. It's a credit to their scouting department that they have found some of the gems they have.
The Bucs were in cap hell because they actually had assets - good players under contract. Multiple pro bowlers who were being paid up to their level of play. The Cowboys had none. Parcells inherited a team with Quincy Carter and Chad Hutchinson the incumbent quarterbacks, Emmitt Smith as the leading rusher he promptly got rid of, and Joey Galloway as the leading receiver who he promtly got rid of. Then he changed the defense from a 4-3 to 3-4. Parcells inherited way more challenges than Gruden.
I'd say our cap hell stemmed more from overpaying certain underachievers and people who had a tendency to not show up in some games. Our cap hell stemmed more from just flat out bad contracts than talent level. Gotta credit them for hitting on more draft picks than usm but how much of that is the difference in scouting departments?

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#25 : October 09, 2007, 01:15:47 PM

Ok guys, you apparently have a better understanding of the inner workings of Parcell's operation than I do, so I'll defer to you guys with the insider information on that.

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#26 : October 09, 2007, 01:20:05 PM

Ok guys, you apparently have a better understanding of the inner workings of Parcell's operation than I do, so I'll defer to you guys with the insider information on that.

sarcastic surrender duly noted. ;)

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#27 : October 09, 2007, 01:20:55 PM

So how does that equate to Bill Parcells is a superior evaluator of player talent? Are you saying that if Parcells came here, the entire staff from Dallas would come as well so that they could re-create the same dynamic? Will Jerry Jones be joining them?
So it's just a tremendous coincidence Bill Parcells can take 4 different teams virtually devoid of all talent and nearly completely re-make them in 2-3 years? He just keeps walking into the perfect situation surrounded by good people time after time?

FRG is the most logical poster on this board.  You guys just don\'t like where the logical conclusions take you.

DanTurksGhost

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#28 : October 09, 2007, 01:22:36 PM

So it's just a tremendous coincidence Bill Parcells can take 4 different teams virtually devoid of all talent and nearly completely re-make them in 2-3 years? He just keeps walking into the perfect situation surrounded by good people time after time?

Like I said, you guys have more information than I do. I'm not sufficiently connected to the Parcells universe to get a good read on his specific ability to evaluate talent.

Feel Real Good

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#29 : October 09, 2007, 01:27:28 PM

So it's just a tremendous coincidence Bill Parcells can take 4 different teams virtually devoid of all talent and nearly completely re-make them in 2-3 years? He just keeps walking into the perfect situation surrounded by good people time after time?

Like I said, you guys have more information than I do. I'm not sufficiently connected to the Parcells universe to get a good read on his specific ability to evaluate talent.
Shocking for you to play this card.

FRG is the most logical poster on this board.  You guys just don\'t like where the logical conclusions take you.
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