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sammy8887

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#30 : October 29, 2007, 03:05:19 PM

Gray was the 3rd string QB going into training camp. He is a legit third stringer in this league and we didn't force him into bad decisions like the Colts did.

What the hell does it matter what he was going into training camp??? Hell, he was a starter in college, therefore he is starter quality by your twisted logic of thinking.

The fact is that the Jags decided that he was better than Leftwich and cut Leftwich, making Gray THE 2ND-STRING QB. Why am I even trying to help you think logically???



Biggs,

If somebody wants to call Quinn a "third-string QB," people shouldn't have that big a problem with it. Coming into training camp, it was Leftwich, Garrard, Quinn. It sounds like Leftwich got cut for more reasons than his playing ability. It's not b/c Quinn outplayed him in training camp.

MiltonMack21

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#31 : October 29, 2007, 03:08:47 PM

Gray was the 3rd string QB going into training camp. He is a legit third stringer in this league and we didn't force him into bad decisions like the Colts did.

What the hell does it matter what he was going into training camp???  Hell, he was a starter in college, therefore he is starter quality by your twisted logic of thinking.

The fact is that the Jags decided that he was better than Leftwich and cut Leftwich, making Gray THE 2ND-STRING QB.  Why am I even trying to help you think logically???


Look... he was the 3rd stringer coming... he is still a 3rd stringer. Thats all he is good for and yet we couldn't force him into bad plays.


Biggs3535

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#32 : October 29, 2007, 03:11:43 PM

Sammy...you think that the Jags didn't think about the fact that Garrard could get hurt?  They made the decision to make Gray their back-up, not third string.  They weren't down and out with bad luck at the QB position, like the Bucs were last year with Gradkowski.  They decided to cut Leftwich.  I don't care what number QB he was 3 months ago or 3 years ago, the fact of the matter is that he is the Jags 2nd-string QB.



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#33 : October 29, 2007, 03:14:10 PM

Gray was the 3rd string QB going into training camp. He is a legit third stringer in this league and we didn't force him into bad decisions like the Colts did.

What the hell does it matter what he was going into training camp???  Hell, he was a starter in college, therefore he is starter quality by your twisted logic of thinking.

The fact is that the Jags decided that he was better than Leftwich and cut Leftwich, making Gray THE 2ND-STRING QB.  Why am I even trying to help you think logically???


Look... he was the 3rd stringer coming... he is still a 3rd stringer. Thats all he is good for and yet we couldn't force him into bad plays.

Actually we did force him into bad plays, but we didn't get turnovers from them.
I felt the playcalling was excellent overall on offense, and just brilliant at times.  There were drops and overthrows by Garcia, and the 2 picks that killed us offensively.  Much like the Lion's game, we put together an impressive offensive performance against a good defense.  We were undone by some critical mistakes and poor defense at critical times.




sammy8887

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#34 : October 29, 2007, 03:19:17 PM

Sammy...you think that the Jags didn't think about the fact that Garrard could get hurt? They made the decision to make Gray their back-up, not third string. They weren't down and out with bad luck at the QB position, like the Bucs were last year with Gradkowski. They decided to cut Leftwich. I don't care what number QB he was 3 months ago or 3 years ago, the fact of the matter is that he is the Jags 2nd-string QB.



You're logic is that the Jags carry two QB's. Well, of course you can't have a "third-string QB" if you only carry two QBs. The logic on the other side would be when the Jags had three QBs, he was the "third-string QB." Or even if the Jags decided once again to carry three QBs, he quite likely could be once again a "third-string QB."

Let's make this simple: Can we agree he's not that good?

Biggs3535

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#35 : October 29, 2007, 03:22:34 PM

Sammy...you think that the Jags didn't think about the fact that Garrard could get hurt? They made the decision to make Gray their back-up, not third string. They weren't down and out with bad luck at the QB position, like the Bucs were last year with Gradkowski. They decided to cut Leftwich. I don't care what number QB he was 3 months ago or 3 years ago, the fact of the matter is that he is the Jags 2nd-string QB.



You're logic is that the Jags carry two QB's. Well, of course you can't have a "third-string QB" if you only carry two QBs. The logic on the other side would be when the Jags had three QBs, he was the "third-string QB." Or even if the Jags decided once again to carry three QBs, he quite likely could be once again a "third-string QB."

Let's make this simple: Can we agree he's not that good?

My logic is that the Jags decided to carry 2 QB's and they decided that Gray was better for their team than Leftwich was.  Gray is their back-up.  Gray is their 2nd-string QB...not their 3rd.

Of course we can agree that he is not that good, Sammy, my boy! :)



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#36 : October 29, 2007, 03:29:54 PM

The fact is that the Jags decided that he was better than Leftwich and cut Leftwich, making Gray THE 2ND-STRING QB. Why am I even trying to help you think logically???

There are many other options besides talent that factor into roster construction.

Maybe money factored. Maybe potential factored. Maybe they just didn't want Garrard looking over his shoulder all year.

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#37 : October 29, 2007, 03:33:20 PM

Maybe so, but either way, Gray is the Jags back-up QB, not 3rd string....right?





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#38 : October 29, 2007, 04:51:12 PM

2nd string.

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#39 : October 30, 2007, 01:32:04 AM

As much as I would like to be wrong, the Bucs just don't have the fire power on offense. Their running game is virtually gone. If Pittman can come back soon they have a chance there. They only have one viable receiver in Galloway. What I would like to see is the Bucs utilizing the tight ends more. There is nothing wrong with short passes. Question: How long is the football field? Most people would say 100 yards, and I'd say they would be wrong. The way to think of it is the football field is 10 yards long (three downs to make 10 yards since 4th down is a punting situation). The key to this game isn't the 80 yard bomb, but in making first downs. If a team can concentrate on stringing first downs together the next thing you know they are at the other team's goal line, not to mention they control the clock and time of possesion.

Anyway I'm rambling a bit. The point is I don't believe the Bucs have enough (uninjured) weapons on offense to be consistent. As I said I hope I'm wrong.
Our ground game will take great strides in the second half of the season. The OL will have much greater success. Bennett will become more of a factor and Graham will show that Detroit was not a fluke game for him. Pittman will return but I doubt he will be greatly involved. Bennett and Graham will be more effective as the season moves on. This young OL help put 23 points up on Jacksonville's defense and it easily could have been more without a few missed passes. They've gained valuable experience and will win now because of it.

I seriously doubt Cadillac Williams would have changed our W-L record at all. Pittman was the bigger loss IMO, but I believe the ground game will be a pleasant surprise from here on out.

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#40 : October 30, 2007, 02:00:29 AM

As much as I would like to be wrong, the Bucs just don't have the fire power on offense. Their running game is virtually gone. If Pittman can come back soon they have a chance there. They only have one viable receiver in Galloway. What I would like to see is the Bucs utilizing the tight ends more. There is nothing wrong with short passes. Question: How long is the football field? Most people would say 100 yards, and I'd say they would be wrong. The way to think of it is the football field is 10 yards long (three downs to make 10 yards since 4th down is a punting situation). The key to this game isn't the 80 yard bomb, but in making first downs. If a team can concentrate on stringing first downs together the next thing you know they are at the other team's goal line, not to mention they control the clock and time of possesion.

Anyway I'm rambling a bit. The point is I don't believe the Bucs have enough (uninjured) weapons on offense to be consistent. As I said I hope I'm wrong.
Our ground game will take great strides in the second half of the season. The OL will have much greater success. Bennett will become more of a factor and Graham will show that Detroit was not a fluke game for him. Pittman will return but I doubt he will be greatly involved. Bennett and Graham will be more effective as the season moves on. This young OL help put 23 points up on Jacksonville's defense and it easily could have been more without a few missed passes. They've gained valuable experience and will win now because of it.

I seriously doubt Cadillac Williams would have changed our W-L record at all. Pittman was the bigger loss IMO, but I believe the ground game will be a pleasant surprise from here on out.

I hope you are right Sparky. Time will tell. As a side note the Bucs should trade all injury prone players, such as Kelly and Williams for draft picks. I don't care how good a player is, if they are injured most of the time they are useless. Caddy and Kelly in particular are made of glass.

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#41 : October 30, 2007, 12:29:03 PM

The team has learned that they can still be productive without Kelly and Williams. In that sense they are better off for the future. I believe the Bucs will be much stronger next year because of the experience gained by our backups. Bennett and Graham will make Williams an afterthought. Kelly is nearing the end of his career. Buchanon will only get better. Greg White should get more opportunities with Spires injured. In recent years we lacked talent in the starting lineup. Now we have talented backups on the roster. The only way they get in the game is by injury or rotation. Injury has forced Gruden to use his backups. I hope he now sees the benefit of a rotation and uses it more often. It keeps the starters fresh and gives the backups game experience.

I am confident that the Bucs will have great success over the next two months, and next year.
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