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naplesbuc

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#15 : November 23, 2006, 08:34:19 PM

Did you not see Gruden rip into Bruce?  Even Pam Oliver saw it.  Remember all the chatter when he undressed Simms in Atlanta.

This wears thin on players when their coach chews them out in public.

Gruden is one passionate dude and HATES to lose.  I love that about him but sometimes you need to walk before you can run.

rocko23

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#16 : November 23, 2006, 08:38:29 PM

sure Gru has passion i like it also but it needs to translate to the players and on the filed

cyberdude557

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#17 : November 23, 2006, 08:45:50 PM

If Gruden is fired, I don't expect Grads to be starting next year. So maybe that would be a good thing.
If Gruden is fired, I don't expect a winning season in Tampa for quite some time. Because there isn't any coach out there that will come in and do anything different than what we are doing right now. No matter what, this team has a lot of rebuilding to do and a lot of growing pains to go through. It doesn't matter who the head coach is, we need to go through that period whether the fans or the media like it or not.

Itchalot

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#18 : November 23, 2006, 08:59:27 PM

wow cyberdude you are making too much sense. Are you sure you're a Buc fan?


alldaway

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#19 : November 23, 2006, 09:24:53 PM

Other franchises have displayed far more patience with less hardware in the case.

Detroit fans and Bucs fans are famous for running off every single young QB with potential becuase of the lack of patience. It is a vicious cycle in that if you are not patient with a young QB you will end up switching to another young QB and continue to lose.  We as Bucs fans know this very well from the past and yet some Bucs fans forget about the lessons of the past.  And Lions fans have it worse as they have no Lomardi they can point too!

nflinsider

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#20 : November 23, 2006, 09:07:59 PM

I say if we dont see a dramatic turnaround next year, it will be time for a change.

alldaway

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#21 : November 23, 2006, 09:08:49 PM

I still think Gruden is a great coach on the x's and o's but I don't think he has the temperament to handle the down cycles. In his case, he was handed a terrible down cycle with the dearth of draft picks and the cap hell from the McKay era. he then compounded it with some terrible FA signings in 2004.

Now the defense has to completely reload and the offense is a WIP. He's the type of coach that is great when he has the pieces in place to succeed. I'm not sure he's good at building a foundation because he is seriously impatient.
OK let see now. The offense is a work in progress. But your not sure he's good at building a foundation.  Do you think you can just grow an offense like a Chia pet?  He's got three rookie starters and most of the rest 2nd and 3rd year guys.  So he is rebuilding the offense, and yet people rip him for not having the patience to do that. Is Gruden coming out in the press and ripping his young players?  No he's having patience with them.

I don't know whats more of a joke, the Bucs or the Bucs fans.  You knock Gruden because he doesn't have the patience to rebuild. Now he is patiently rebuilding from the ground up, and guess what the fans are bashing him for not winning now with a bunch of kids!

Way back when the Bucs first hit the skids after the infamous free agent spending spree, you all ripped Gruden a new one and said REBUILD FROM THE DRAFT! Gruden will never have the pateince to rebuild from the draft!  I said "Will you stick with Gruden during the hard times if he actually does that?"  You all went "Hmm Haw well um but this and that blah blah blah"  You had no answer.  And of course now you still have no answer, because you are....

HYPOCRITES

I normally do not agree with you Itch but this time I do.  Has hell frozen over?

Like I said before I wanted to see progress on offense and I saw it. Next baby step is to do it for an whole football game.   Carnell was chewing up yards in the first half of the game.  The o-line was giving him room. Gradkowski managed that first drive well. 


mjs020294

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#22 : November 23, 2006, 09:10:36 PM

I say if we dont see a dramatic turnaround next year, it will be time for a change.

But by next year we might have no cap space.


rombarrone

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#23 : November 23, 2006, 09:12:24 PM

If Gruden is fired, I don't expect Grads to be starting next year. So maybe that would be a good thing.
If Gruden is fired, I don't expect a winning season in Tampa for quite some time. Because there isn't any coach out there that will come in and do anything different than what we are doing right now. No matter what, this team has a lot of rebuilding to do and a lot of growing pains to go through. It doesn't matter who the head coach is, we need to go through that period whether the fans or the media like it or not.

I would totaly agree with you if going into this season we were rebuilding. The only reason we are trying to rebuild right now is because of injuries and plain old age. We did nothing in FA of the draft to show rebuilding. Yes, Trueblood and Joseph. But they are not on the side of the ball giving up 35 points a game. If you think this year is a rebuilding year you may as well go into hibernation till the 2008 season. Because history proves next year will be worse.

alldaway

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#24 : November 23, 2006, 09:12:44 PM

I say if we dont see a dramatic turnaround next year, it will be time for a change.

But by next year we might have no cap space.

Well that is why some people have forecasted a change in a coach might happen this year.  A new coach would come into a new situation with cap space and draft picks to work with.

Like I said before for Gruden to stay he has three goals the rest of the year.

1.  Win at least 2 more games to avoid being fired by the Glazers.
2. Cotinue to let the young kids play on offense and learn.  And the young kids on offense continue to show progress.
3.  Keep the team together.

naplesbuc

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#25 : November 23, 2006, 09:15:58 PM

adw, with this defense in its current state and Buenning going down I don't see 2 more wins.  Three of the games are cold weather road games.  Seattle will have Hasselbeck and Alexander cranking by time they come to RJS.  Atlanta at home is possible, especially with the improved run defense and Vick's spotty passing.

The Buenning injury destroys any chance of building continuity between this year and next.  Mahan is terrible.  Apparently Terry is even worse.

cyberdude557

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#26 : November 23, 2006, 09:19:05 PM

Would someoene explain to me who is going to come in here and turn things around? I keep hearing everyone beat the drum to fire Gruden. But be warned, the guy we get is going to have very limited experience. And he's going to come in here and change everything once again. So we will end up with at least another 2 losing seasons.

naplesbuc

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#27 : November 23, 2006, 09:22:07 PM

I started this thread and you'll see I never advocated firing Gruden.  My point was the rebuilding process is only getting started and somehow Gruden is supposed to turn it around by next year?  That's a  tall order.

If Gruden had an opportunity to get out and the Glazers could get some draft picks or $$ it could be a win-win.

You just don't fire a coach so fresh off a Lombardi.  Other franchises have displayed far more patience with less hardware in the case.

GrudenFan63

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#28 : November 23, 2006, 09:29:07 PM

You just don't fire a coach so fresh off a Lombardi. 

Not unless you're Jerry Jones; I suppose.

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naplesbuc

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#29 : November 23, 2006, 09:30:00 PM

You just don't fire a coach so fresh off a Lombardi. 

Not unless you're Jerry Jones; I suppose.

Haha.  Good point.
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