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bradentonian

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« #30 : January 10, 2008, 03:50:26 PM »

So we should have blitzed and given up 38 points instead of 24?

So you have a crystal ball, then?

Of course not, but I understand the game and our team well enough to know the likely result. 


bradentonian

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« #31 : January 10, 2008, 03:51:23 PM »

How do you know we would give up 38?  Not blitzing wasn't working.  I would have had faith in the secondary to cover up their receivers and see if we can get pressure by blitzing in various ways.  Eli is not his brother and won't be reading the defense and calling the correct audibles at the line.

Eli (and the backup center) picked up most of the few blitzes we showed and beat them for first downs.


keeponbucn

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« #32 : January 10, 2008, 03:51:46 PM »

There is no excuse...  the defensive game plan was solid.  Monte didn't want to blitz because he didn't want to give up the big play, especially with the threat of Burress.  Stopping the run and daring Eli to play mistake-free football was our best opportunity to win.

I agree but while the Giants adjusted the Bucs didn't, offensively and defensively. Both DC and OC stayed pat with what they thought would be effective and didn't change it when it wasn't. The Giants OC brought in the back-up RB for a change or pace because Jacobs wasn't doing jack, Monte should have adjusted.

Gruden should have used Stevens and Bennett and I'm pissed he didn't give them any opportuinty.

sammy8887

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« #33 : January 10, 2008, 03:52:22 PM »

Why are you holding the defensive coaching staff to a higher standard than the offensive coaching staff?

I can't speak for anyone else, but for me it's simple. The defense was supposed to be the strength of this team, and it is certainly more talented than the offense. Everyone knew going into this game that the Giants defensive line was going to give our OL fits, that Garcia may be on his back all afternoon, that we were starting an inexperienced cast-off at LOT against a high-pressure DL. Pundits talked about how Eli was going to struggle against our defense, that the league's most-intercepted QB might get picked off three times against the Bucs, that Manning was sure to struggle when facing the Monte Kiffin-led unit.

Yet, despite the fact that Manning sliced through the defense like a hot knife through butter, Monte was unable to provide an answer. Did the offense fail us? Sure did, as did the ST (those two turnovers were probably the difference in the game). But neither of those two units were deemed among the best in the league, while the Bucs defense is (at least statistically).


I'll answer that more directly:

What side of the ball have the brunt of our injuries occurred on this year?

escobar

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« #34 : January 10, 2008, 03:53:09 PM »

Eli is no Peyton, Eli can be rattled and typically makes bad decisions when pressured, problem is Monte didn't try to create any. I bet even Eli said to himself after the game, "wow are the Bucs the only team that haven't figured me out yet?" If we had blitzed in the second half I bet we win that game. We made it far too easy on him and if coming up with zero turnovers off of a turnover machine at QB isn't proof that this Tampa 2 is useless without pressure then I don't know what is.

bradentonian

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« #35 : January 10, 2008, 03:53:16 PM »

Why are you holding the defensive coaching staff to a higher standard than the offensive coaching staff?

I can't speak for anyone else, but for me it's simple. The defense was supposed to be the strength of this team, and it is certainly more talented than the offense. Everyone knew going into this game that the Giants defensive line was going to give our OL fits, that Garcia may be on his back all afternoon, that we were starting an inexperienced cast-off at LOT against a high-pressure DL. Pundits talked about how Eli was going to struggle against our defense, that the league's most-intercepted QB might get picked off three times against the Bucs, that Manning was sure to struggle when facing the Monte Kiffin-led unit.

Yet, despite the fact that Manning sliced through the defense like a hot knife through butter, Monte was unable to provide an answer. Did the offense fail us? Sure did, as did the ST (those two turnovers were probably the difference in the game). But neither of those two units were deemed among the best in the league, while the Bucs defense is (at least statistically).


I'll answer that more directly:

What side of the ball have the brunt of our injuries occurred on this year?

So if we had no injuries our offense would have been top-5 like our defense was?


sammy8887

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« #36 : January 10, 2008, 03:55:21 PM »

I'll answer that more directly:

What side of the ball have the brunt of our injuries occurred on this year?

So if we had no injuries our offense would have been top-5 like our defense was?

Are we talking about the offense or defense?

Did they play like a top 5 defense Sunday or not?

If not, can they not be called out? The offense will get called out without a doubt by the anti-Gruden folks...

DanTurksGhost

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« #37 : January 10, 2008, 03:55:46 PM »

Eli (and the backup center) picked up most of the few blitzes we showed and beat them for first downs.

Because we showed them nothing they didn't expect.

bradentonian

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« #38 : January 10, 2008, 03:58:11 PM »

I'll answer that more directly:

What side of the ball have the brunt of our injuries occurred on this year?

So if we had no injuries our offense would have been top-5 like our defense was?

Are we talking about the offense or defense?

Did they play like a top 5 defense Sunday or not?

If not, can they not be called out? The offense will get called out without a doubt by the anti-Gruden folks...

Absolutely they can be (and should be) called out for having a poor game.  But suggesting that the DC should be axed is insanity.


keeponbucn

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« #39 : January 10, 2008, 03:58:42 PM »

Eli (and the backup center) picked up most of the few blitzes we showed and beat them for first downs.

Because we showed them nothing they didn't expect.

I was disappointed that Monte didn't have something different for Eli, he's one of the best but he's got to evolve here. Gruden didn't adjust either, they both deserve huge blame for that putrid display.

Bidwell aslo hust the Bucs, twice, and Sprulocks fumble was horrible.

escobar

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« #40 : January 10, 2008, 04:02:15 PM »

A dominant three technique makes the whole defense a lot better. But there was still no excuse for not being creative on defense against the Giants -- particularly when you know that you don't have a dominant three technique.

There is no excuse...  the defensive game plan was solid.  Monte didn't want to blitz because he didn't want to give up the big play, especially with the threat of Burress.  Stopping the run and daring Eli to play mistake-free football was our best opportunity to win.

So in other words, he wanted to play it safe. Hmm, well that will get you beat almost everytime. Their only deep threat was an injured Burress, blitzing Eli and covering Plaxico in man coverage is a risk I wish we would have taken as opposed to letting the league leader in Int's pick us apart as effortlessly as his brother did.

Really?  It put our defense in the top 5 and helped us win the division and get to the playoffs.


Check out our record over the last 5 games including the playoff loss, it's 1-4. What was the common theme in all of those games, no pressure. Case closed. If this defense can't get pressure then it will get picked apart with long drives and they will be exhausted, has nothing to do with the offense.

sammy8887

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« #41 : January 10, 2008, 04:04:33 PM »

Eli (and the backup center) picked up most of the few blitzes we showed and beat them for first downs.

Because we showed them nothing they didn't expect.

I was disappointed that Monte didn't have something different for Eli, he's one of the best but he's got to evolve here. Gruden didn't adjust either, they both deserve huge blame for that putrid display.

Bidwell aslo hust the Bucs, twice, and Sprulocks fumble was horrible.

Individual performances are not being highlighted enough here...even simple things like unusually poor kicks that led to worse field position...

Spurlock fumbles...the D holds to make it 17-7 and then the Bucs start driving until Garcia throws the INT in the end zone...if people want to blame all that on Gruden, that's their perrogative, I suppose...Garcia and Galloway are the "G's" that get blame before Gruden, IMO...

bradentonian

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« #42 : January 10, 2008, 04:05:56 PM »

Eli (and the backup center) picked up most of the few blitzes we showed and beat them for first downs.

Because we showed them nothing they didn't expect.

I was disappointed that Monte didn't have something different for Eli, he's one of the best but he's got to evolve here. Gruden didn't adjust either, they both deserve huge blame for that putrid display.

Bidwell aslo hust the Bucs, twice, and Sprulocks fumble was horrible.

Individual performances are not being highlighted enough here...even simple things like unusually poor kicks that led to worse field position...

Spurlock fumbles...the D holds to make it 17-7 and then the Bucs start driving until Garcia throws the INT in the end zone...if people want to blame all that on Gruden, that's their perrogative, I suppose...Garcia and Galloway are the "G's" that get blame before Gruden, IMO...

The fact that all the facets of the team failed (offense, defense, special teams) should fall squarely on the shoulders of the HC.


keeponbucn

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« #43 : January 10, 2008, 04:08:01 PM »

The fact that all the facets of the team failed (offense, defense, special teams) should fall squarely on the shoulders of the HC.

I agree and so does the HC

escobar

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« #44 : January 10, 2008, 04:08:35 PM »

Eli (and the backup center) picked up most of the few blitzes we showed and beat them for first downs.

Because we showed them nothing they didn't expect.

I was disappointed that Monte didn't have something different for Eli, he's one of the best but he's got to evolve here. Gruden didn't adjust either, they both deserve huge blame for that putrid display.

Bidwell aslo hust the Bucs, twice, and Sprulocks fumble was horrible.

Individual performances are not being highlighted enough here...even simple things like unusually poor kicks that led to worse field position...

Spurlock fumbles...the D holds to make it 17-7 and then the Bucs start driving until Garcia throws the INT in the end zone...if people want to blame all that on Gruden, that's their perrogative, I suppose...Garcia and Galloway are the "G's" that get blame before Gruden, IMO...


I agree, in the end the players have to play and need to shoulder some of the responsibility as well. Galloway was useless, Garcia made some of the worst decisions he has all year, Spurlock took the wind out of our sails before we even left the dock in the second half, and we had too many injuries to overcome. MANY things happened that had nothing to do with Gruden or Kiffin for that matter, I guess one could say that things went as bad as they possibly could have that day.
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