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jerseybucsfan

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#60 : December 11, 2006, 08:37:51 PM

I like Joe Thomas as well. But if he's gone, and if we can't trade down, I wouldn't mind either Adams or Branch.

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dalbuc

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#61 : December 11, 2006, 09:15:41 PM

Why would we go after Peterson, I like him but we have a talented running back already.  The problem is the oline, crap you could put Barry sanders himself back there and he couldn't do anything because they are hit before taking there first two steps, our oline is horrible. Caddy can run and he finishes his runs, theres no problem with him, peterson would be one of the dumbest picks for us. no offense cause i tryin to get in a war or words. but damn Caddy is a talent, and he has the ability to run.  I say draft either Calvin Johnson, or Thomas those two could come in and help us right away.

Gruden's exact comment was "Jim Brown wouldn't have run for more than 48 yards today."

If you think back to the last game in 2004 and the way Gruden harped about we have to run the ball, we will run the ball and then what do we do, we draft Caddy.  His post-game and PC today reminded me of that rant. He was pissed off about the run blocking and if that sort of energy led to Caddy I can see where he's gonna lean all over Thomas to help shore this thing up.

All posts are opinions in case you are too stupid to figure that out on your own without me saying it over and over.

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#62 : December 11, 2006, 09:17:54 PM

Why would we go after Peterson, I like him but we have a talented running back already.  The problem is the oline, crap you could put Barry sanders himself back there and he couldn't do anything because they are hit before taking there first two steps, our oline is horrible. Caddy can run and he finishes his runs, theres no problem with him, peterson would be one of the dumbest picks for us. no offense cause i tryin to get in a war or words. but damn Caddy is a talent, and he has the ability to run.  I say draft either Calvin Johnson, or Thomas those two could come in and help us right away.

Gruden's exact comment was "Jim Brown wouldn't have run for more than 48 yards today."

If you think back to the last game in 2004 and the way Gruden harped about we have to run the ball, we will run the ball and then what do we do, we draft Caddy.  His post-game and PC today reminded me of that rant. He was pissed off about the run blocking and if that sort of energy led to Caddy I can see where he's gonna lean all over Thomas to help shore this thing up.

Thomas/Gaines look like the most likely options.  Right now Thomas has the edge it looks like even though it will make me cringe to see another offensive player drafted in the first round.

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#63 : December 11, 2006, 10:51:56 PM

need new QB and more WR


Mohawkbucs

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#64 : December 12, 2006, 01:29:57 AM

I dont want to draft a QB, but after hearing Gruden's PC yesterday, I think thats the direction we are heading. I like Calvin Johnson to go along with Clayton and Stovall for our future WR core.

I think until yesterday the Coach didn't think he'd be picking high enough. A shame that Vince Young came out last season instead of this season. I think Gruden would love that kid in his offense.


Troy Smith maybe?


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#65 : December 12, 2006, 08:31:20 AM

If we are picking #1, I try my best to trade with Houston for Carr plus their 1st rounder (#4 or #5), and get BADP there (Adams/Branch).  If that doesn't work, I go Joe Thomas and hope for a guy like Garcia in FA.


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#66 : December 12, 2006, 08:38:25 AM

Franchise Player Joe Thomas.


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#67 : December 12, 2006, 08:45:01 AM

Only options at number 1 are Brady Quinn,Joe Thomas & Calvin Johnson. Personally after Gruden's press conference we NEED Brady Quinn.


cvillebucfan

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#68 : December 12, 2006, 08:56:47 AM

The fact that you are even debating this speaks volumes...

Dude, why in the hell would draft peterson this year when 2 years ago you spent a top 5 pick on a running back (caddy)???

Its makes absolutely zero sense and is not even up for debate....

Caddy has had close to 2 years, this isn't madden football. Caddy is fine, and can be a very capable back. Is Peterson a stud, sure looks like it at this point.

This is nuts, lunacy man, the more I think about it the more ridiculous you sound. This teams has holes galore and to even think for a second to draft another runningback, its the dumbest freaking thing I've ever heard in my life...

Personally, I would trade down, as the Bucs have too many holes to fill.

Caddy is NOT a franchise back. He is a nice back to be sure, but a franchise guy he isn't. He is an undersized between the tackles type that doesn't scare opposing defenses. There is nothing wrong with Caddy per se, but the Bucs need a big time guy back there, and Caddy isn't that kind of guy.

Remember the first three games of last year? That is the only way this Buc team is going to win. Run the ball early and often, then hit a few with play action. Caddy isn't going to be that kind of back for us again because heavy duty means he will be hurt. Sure, we spent the 5th pick in the draft on him in 2005, but that doesn't mean we have to live with no running game.

What part of 20-48 with a fumble is shocking people? BTW, this was against Atlanta, who can't stop anyone.

IF Gruden keeps his job, a rookie QB makes no sense. Joe Thomas is a good player, but I just don't see him as a #1 overall selection type. Pace was that kind of guy. Thomas is more along the lines of Lachey.

Peterson is a game changer. Caddy can be traded for a high #2 from a team like the Browns who need a RB. You then have Peterson in the backfield with 3 #2's to work with in the draft to get a WR and help for the defense. If you Re-sign Simms, you have all the makings of the formula we used in 2005. Have teams respect the run, then hit them deep with Simms' arm throwing to a tandem of Galloway and a guy like Gonzalez from OSU.

HAHA, I cannot believe this! Ok look I'm sorry for being hard on you, I don't mean to come across that way but do you really advocate drafting Adrian Peterson when have holes basically across the board? You would like to draft Peterson instead of addressing the vast needs on this team when we have a 2nd year running back we picked #5 overall who is the reigning rookie of the year?

I think Peterson is a bada$$ too but lets be reasonable...



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dalbuc

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#69 : December 12, 2006, 09:02:40 AM

Peterson has one big problem for an RB  - he's brittle. That problem is especially bad with a guy who is a big upright runner like he is.

All posts are opinions in case you are too stupid to figure that out on your own without me saying it over and over.

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#70 : December 12, 2006, 09:54:22 AM


Thomas/Gaines look like the most likely options.  Right now Thomas has the edge it looks like even though it will make me cringe to see another offensive player drafted in the first round.

That plan worked out well for the Lions. Of course they decided to go ahead and draft defense last year.  >:(

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#71 : December 12, 2006, 01:41:25 PM

The fact that you are even debating this speaks volumes...

Dude, why in the hell would draft peterson this year when 2 years ago you spent a top 5 pick on a running back (caddy)???

Its makes absolutely zero sense and is not even up for debate....

Caddy has had close to 2 years, this isn't madden football. Caddy is fine, and can be a very capable back. Is Peterson a stud, sure looks like it at this point.

This is nuts, lunacy man, the more I think about it the more ridiculous you sound. This teams has holes galore and to even think for a second to draft another runningback, its the dumbest freaking thing I've ever heard in my life...

Personally, I would trade down, as the Bucs have too many holes to fill.

Caddy is NOT a franchise back. He is a nice back to be sure, but a franchise guy he isn't. He is an undersized between the tackles type that doesn't scare opposing defenses. There is nothing wrong with Caddy per se, but the Bucs need a big time guy back there, and Caddy isn't that kind of guy.

Remember the first three games of last year? That is the only way this Buc team is going to win. Run the ball early and often, then hit a few with play action. Caddy isn't going to be that kind of back for us again because heavy duty means he will be hurt. Sure, we spent the 5th pick in the draft on him in 2005, but that doesn't mean we have to live with no running game.

What part of 20-48 with a fumble is shocking people? BTW, this was against Atlanta, who can't stop anyone.

IF Gruden keeps his job, a rookie QB makes no sense. Joe Thomas is a good player, but I just don't see him as a #1 overall selection type. Pace was that kind of guy. Thomas is more along the lines of Lachey.

Peterson is a game changer. Caddy can be traded for a high #2 from a team like the Browns who need a RB. You then have Peterson in the backfield with 3 #2's to work with in the draft to get a WR and help for the defense. If you Re-sign Simms, you have all the makings of the formula we used in 2005. Have teams respect the run, then hit them deep with Simms' arm throwing to a tandem of Galloway and a guy like Gonzalez from OSU.

HAHA, I cannot believe this! Ok look I'm sorry for being hard on you, I don't mean to come across that way but do you really advocate drafting Adrian Peterson when have holes basically across the board? You would like to draft Peterson instead of addressing the vast needs on this team when we have a 2nd year running back we picked #5 overall who is the reigning rookie of the year?

I think Peterson is a bada$$ too but lets be reasonable...

The problem is what other scenario makes the Bucs better?  Thomas is a heck of a tackle, but as bad as Davis is, he isn't the reason this team is last in offense.  As good as Quinn may be, the history of drafting a QB at #1 and having him work out is very very low.  Big time RB's can and do hit the ground running (pun intended) from day one.  You can live with Simms if you have a big time RB.  Caddy is  nice, but that is all he is. 

Bottom line, I agree that the Bucs have a ton of holes, and would benefit from a trade down more than any one player.  But IF we have to take one player, we have to take one that will make an immediate impact.  That guy is Peterson.   

naplesbuc

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#72 : December 12, 2006, 01:44:05 PM

Easy Choice.  Vince Young has opened the door for this guy to rocket up the boards:



From http://www.fftoolbox.com/nfl_draft/profile_display.cfm?Prospect_ID=384

    * He is a player at the quarterback position with the skill level to be a top 5 selection in the NFL draft once he decides to declare
    * He is a physical quarterback, who physically reminds me of current NFL quarterback "Duante Cullpepper", though at the same stage in their collegiate careers Cullpepper was more likely to scramble once the pocket began to break down
    * Though he brings a legitimate running threat from the quarterback position and for opposing defenses to defend, he is a throw first, scramble second type quarterback
    * He is a player that stands tall in the pocket, who is willing to take on oncoming hits from defenders to complete balls down field, and is fearless both inside and outside the pocket
    * He shows good natural movement within the pocket, with the versatility to extend passing plays with his legs and make passes on the move
    * He is a quarterback that plays within the system and does not force plays in the passing game, he provides both command and leadership to the Tigers offense, and possesses a calm demeanor which reflects on his teammates around him
    * He has the skill to deliver the ball with a flick of the wrist, with excellent arm strength,  who delivers balls on a rope with high velocity, with the skill to throw any number of passes along the the field, and with the variety of touch needed on each pass 
    * His versatility to throw within or outside the pocket in a smooth and fluid manner, is one of many skills he possesses that separates him from most quarterbacks, one play he can  be the prototype pocket passer, and the next play he can complete passes with his mobility
    * He is one of the few collegiate quarterbacks I know who can throw the ball across his body into the middle of the field and completing those passes on a regular basis, and his quick decision making to throw or tuck the ball and and run seems to go unnoticed
    * Once he knows the pass is not available and he decides to run upfield he can be a load to bring down, along with possessing above average speed and movement on the run
    * He has franchise type skill and size that is rare to find in one player at the quarterback position, if he stays on course it should culminate in him being a high draft pick in the NFL draft when he becomes eligible, baring injury
    * I would like to see him work on his conditioning, because I have seen quarterbacks at his size eat their way out of the game, and worse yet never reach their potential, but at this point he has a bright future to look forward to

leeroybuc93

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#73 : December 12, 2006, 02:33:58 PM

I pick up the phone and call any team in the top 5 that needs a QB.

You mean like us?  If we have the #1 pick, we take Quinn.  The golden rule of the draft is that if you don't have a franchise QB, you don't pass on one. 

However, in a more realistic draft where we pick 3rd, I say we try to trade down and pick up Russell who I also think is a franchise QB.  If we stayed at 3, we have to pick Thomas or Gaines in that order.

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#74 : December 12, 2006, 02:49:57 PM

As good as Quinn may be, the history of drafting a QB at #1 and having him work out is very very low.

Really?  QBs taken #1 overall since 1982:

1983 : John Elway
1987 : Vinny Testaverde
1989 : Troy Aikman
1990 : Jeff George
1993 : Drew Bledsoe
1998 : Payton Manning
1999 : Tim Couch
2001 : Mike Vick
2002 : David Carr
2003 : Carson Palmer
2004 : Eli Manning
2005 : Alex Smith

Of that list, I see ONE bona fide bust.  Every single other name on the list was or is a long-time starter.  Some of the members of that list are among the greatest to ever play the game.  If you mean simply in the first round rather than first overall, there are certainly more busts, but there are also more success stories.  You'd be hard-pressed to prove that their success rate is noteably lower than that at any other position.  65% of QBs taken in the first round from 1995-2004(10 year span) have started at least one game for their team this year.  That's way, waaaaay more than the qbs taken in any other round.  Yeah, it would be just our luck to draft the next Tim Couch, but with our luck and his injury history, it was also be just like us to draft the next Ki-Jana Carter.

Drafting Peterson would be as insane, if not moreso than the Lions drafting WRs in the first round for three years in a row.  "The problem is what other scenario makes the Bucs better? "  Pretty much any one that doesn't involve replacing the best player on the team's offense.
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