3rd down was killer for Bucs

[sammy8887]

Penalties killed the team in this game.

Definitely another factor...

Sears with 2 holding calls and an ineligible receiver and Trueblood with an unsportsmanlike should be the most penalties the O-line racks up this year if the offense wants to be successful...

[TheRealist]

Your right....he does have a history of throwing interceptins, but so did Favre and everybody wanted him here, I really want to see that Bucs run the ball 30 times this game, up this middle, outside like that play was on the 45 yarder by Graham, they need to switch it up, running effectively is the foundation of a ball control offense

exactly.... and even that wish bone look they had was working but I think they only used it once or twice, after waching Peterson last night they ran like 15 different running playing, tosses, up the middle, counters, everything...it keeps they D on their toes

And let's run out of the shotgun and run with three wides, and let's put Dexter in the game and run a couple of reverses, one fake and one real.

the 2-12 on Third Down conversions isn't the CAUSE of the problem, its the effect.  The CAUSE is having a WEAK offense.     we knew that was a problem last year, and we did little about it.  We'd rather hold onto our useless 3rd or 4th round draft pick in '09,  then do what it takes to land a proven QB or WR.   And the Bucs prefer to SIT on $30 million in cap money this year.  There's a CAUSE if I've ever seen one.

[yuccaneers]

DTG - While I understand what you are saying this is where opinions will differ is that with the team running and have great success and Garcia rusty the team should have been running more on first and second down to set the team up for manageable third down situations, which Gruden wasnt or when he did run on first and second downs is when he should have been taking at shot at the endzone rather then trying something that has been done a thousand times in the past with the same result with Dunn up the middle for very little gain.

You know what REALLY hurts this team? Our wide receivers - it seems like they struggle to get open. Eddie Royal made Deangelo Hall look like a moron last night

[TheRealist]

You know what REALLY hurts this team? Our wide receivers - it seems like they struggle to get open. Eddie Royal made Deangelo Hall look like a moron last night

The only reciever on this team who knows how to get open is Ike Hilliard, Galloway just uses his speed, and Bryant im not sure about yet, he didn't look to good, especially on the slant in the endzone, he ran outside the defender when he was suposed to get inside him

[sammy8887]

You know what REALLY hurts this team? Our wide receivers - it seems like they struggle to get open. Eddie Royal made Deangelo Hall look like a moron last night

The only reciever on this team who knows how to get open is Ike Hilliard, Galloway just uses his speed, and Bryant im not sure about yet, he didn't look to good, especially on the slant in the endzone, he ran outside the defender when he was suposed to get inside him

A lot of that I believe is on Garcia and his "rustiness"...Bryant had an opportunity in the middle of the field that Garcia threw behind him...had a one-on-one matchup down the right side that Garcia overthrew...Galloway and Garcia were clearly never on the same page...

That comes with repetitions together in practice and games...

[TheRealist]

You know what REALLY hurts this team? Our wide receivers - it seems like they struggle to get open. Eddie Royal made Deangelo Hall look like a moron last night

The only reciever on this team who knows how to get open is Ike Hilliard, Galloway just uses his speed, and Bryant im not sure about yet, he didn't look to good, especially on the slant in the endzone, he ran outside the defender when he was suposed to get inside him

A lot of that I believe is on Garcia and his "rustiness"...Bryant had an opportunity in the middle of the field that Garcia threw behind him...had a one-on-one matchup down the right side that Garcia overthrew...Galloway and Garcia were clearly never on the same page...

That comes with repetitions together in practice and games...

ya....it definetely doesn't help that Garcia's throws were everything, but on the mark

[DanTurksGhost]

DTG - While I understand what you are saying this is where opinions will differ is that with the team running and have great success and Garcia rusty the team should have been running more on first and second down to set the team up for manageable third down situations, which Gruden wasnt or when he did run on first and second downs is when he should have been taking at shot at the endzone rather then trying something that has been done a thousand times in the past with the same result with Dunn up the middle for very little gain.

In looking at the charts, I counted 18 first-and-second downs situations in which they attempted a run. I counted 26 times in which on first-and-second downs they attempted a pass. Going deeper, I looked at the two-minute offense (end of the half possession began with 1:38 on the clock, and end of the game possession started with 2:24 on the clock) and during those situations, they threw on first or second down 9 times.

So considering the expected reliance on the pass in the two minute offense, it was 18 runs and 17 passes on first or second down.

Now, considering the effectiveness of those early down passes:

Of 26 early down pass attempts, 9 were for no gain (due either to sack, incompletion or penalty). Two of them were because it was first and 17 and second and 24. Of the 17 remaining which all produced positive yardage, 8 of them produced a first down conversion (that is, either on first or second down, the pass was sufficient to gain another first down).

Doesn't seem all that out of whack to me.

[Lamond]

A lot of the 3rd downs that we were unable to complete were as a result of penalties. Not many teams in the league can convert 3rd and 15's or greater.

QFT

How many of those 12 3rd downs were over 10 yards? It seemed like most of them.

[sammy8887]

A lot of the 3rd downs that we were unable to complete were as a result of penalties. Not many teams in the league can convert 3rd and 15's or greater.

QFT

How many of those 12 3rd downs were over 10 yards? It seemed like most of them.

Someone posted them up above...3rd and double digits leads to a very low % of 1st downs...penalties put us in those situations each time...

[DanTurksGhost]

Half of them were 3rd-and-9 or longer.

[yuccaneers]

DTG -Not saying it is out of whack, just saying that Gruden knew his receivers and QB were rusty and tried to get them in a groove even though the running game was working, in the end the game plan should have been to run, run, then pass considering Garcia was banged up and had not play or practiced much.

So in my mind this loss is more on the game plan and Grudens inability to chnage in mid swing to things that were working.

[DanTurksGhost]

Ok, then.

[Lamond]

Sorry, somehow I missed it.