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cheveliar

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#45 : November 03, 2008, 10:51:56 AM

I hear ya Unc, just seems like, and maybe I'm taking it too persoanal, that people are looking for the bad in this team.  Looking for the flaws in this team.  Looking for the inadequicies of this team.  Believe me there are many!  We all know them.  The true fan watches the game and cheers yet winces @ the missed assignments, missed blocks, bad throws, fumbles, and dropped balls. 

There are times when you need to be critical.  When you want to be critical.  When the critisism you bring is so blatant that you have to bring it out.  But the delivery is crucial.  I know where you are coming from Unc, weve talked and debated enough where I know what you're thinking before you post it.   ;)

I just wanted to bring out some of the good things that lead to a victory when defeat was all but in our hands. I love Monte, but I also think he should retire, become a consultant to Raheem Morris, exclusively!  That way you keep one of the brighter, younger, and more innovative minds here in Tampa in Morris.  Kiffin doesn't loose face or status and can still get paid, stay near the game and have more time off. That along with Hainesworth in FA will make this the number one defense in the league...next year... :D

Without Carl Nix it feels like our running game just took a death blow to the face!


BuccanAy

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#46 : November 03, 2008, 11:01:29 AM

Was it on Monte that Barber bit on reverse pass, NO.  It's hard for us to gauge how ready the players were for this game.  Monte's system and personell have been one of the best in the last decade, Grudens system and personell have been one of the worst, since coming to the Bucs.  There's no denying where the stregth of this team is.  Yes, Monte's guys weren't at their best for this game but Tanard and the D made the play that saved this game.

rowdie

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#47 : November 03, 2008, 11:02:59 AM

Whats funny to me is how Kiffen is throw on the fire after one week when his defense was bad, even after having a dominant defense for mostly every other week. Then the same people will back Gruden when he hasn't had a dominant offensive performance in six years, and he has had MANY MANY bad games.

So why the difference? I agree Monte had a bad game and got flat out destroyed out there, but Gruden has been getting beat just about every week. Why the difference there?

Stop having a legitimate opinion and take a sip:




I love it.  One bad game vs 6yrs worth

How is getting on Monte sipping the koolaid?  That makes no sense at all.   :confused:

DYK, we have a college football forum... http://www.pewterreport.com/forum/index.php?board=5.0

ryan24

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#48 : November 03, 2008, 11:03:28 AM


As I said elsewhere. Felt the point need to be made that it wasn't all on Gruden.

That "balance" should include some reasonableness in placing "blame" constantly on someone.

In the NFL there are going to be games such as yesterday's game. Players may not play up to par on an individual basis or as a collective unit for a variety of reasons many of which may not be explainable. Sometimes teams can overcome them. All teams have them....the Giants got away with one just like this vs. the Bengals at home and they appear to be the best team in the league right now. Not every situation has to have the finger pointing at someone.

BTW....Chev is absolutely right. There is a subset of posters or either 1. are never happy , 2. are going to look for every negative they can find in a given game. 3 both 1 and 2.

Happy and Peppy and Bursting with love.

rowdie

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#49 : November 03, 2008, 11:05:59 AM


As I said elsewhere. Felt the point need to be made that it wasn't all on Gruden.

That "balance" should include some reasonableness in placing "blame" constantly on someone.

In the NFL there are going to be games such as yesterday's game. Players may not play up to par on an individual basis or as a collective unit for a variety of reasons many of which may not be explainable. Sometimes teams can overcome them. All teams have them....the Giants got away with one just like this vs. the Bengals at home and they appear to be the best team in the league right now. Not every situation has to have the finger pointing at someone.

BTW....Chev is absolutely right. There is a subset of posters or either 1. are never happy , 2. are going to look for every negative they can find in a given game. 3 both 1 and 2.

Why no ignore list?

DYK, we have a college football forum... http://www.pewterreport.com/forum/index.php?board=5.0

finnbluebucs

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#50 : November 04, 2008, 08:47:07 AM

Was it on Monte that Barber bit on reverse pass, NO. It's hard for us to gauge how ready the players were for this game. Monte's system and personell have been one of the best in the last decade, Grudens system and personell have been one of the worst, since coming to the Bucs. There's no denying where the stregth of this team is. Yes, Monte's guys weren't at their best for this game but Tanard and the D made the play that saved this game.

You know what I'd love to see, just out of curiosity? The cumulative Offensive and Defensive stats from 2002-2008 and see where our O and D rank against the rest of the league in that time period.

\"We are frustrated at not making the playoffs. It is a good start. That is all it is. It is a good start for something that we are going to be in the future. - Josh Freeman

TBayXXXVII

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#51 : November 04, 2008, 08:51:12 AM

There was absolutely no excuse for some of the defensive play calling.

Virtually every team is using some form of the wildcat at some point in the game.

Are you telling me we can't recognize the number of the QB and see he is not behind the ball?

We can't recognize a direct snap is likely?

We can't stop a 3rd string rusher?

The first half points, I lay all on Kiffin's doorstep.

Same for the ten points he handed to them.

Seeing as Barber is part of the defense, that's Kiffin's fault for keeping him in there when he is costing us.

There is plenty of blame to go around for today. IMO, Kiffin deserves most of it.

Hopefully, he got it out of his system.


Two words...  IT   HAPPENS

Let it go.  Non-conference road game.  Over the last 7 seasons, BOTH the offense AND defense play like crap in those games.

GameTime

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#52 : November 04, 2008, 09:04:02 AM

Head Coach - GM

Offensive Coordinator - Defensive Coordinator

Position Coaches

And people wonder why gruden catches flak?  responsibility moves up, and gruden holds half the top spots, and im willing to bet he has a strong influence over the GM.

but back to the point, monte deserves criticism this week sure.  the first 3 drives were not good.  but for almost 3 quarters the D played well.  grudens O deserves some praise this week.  they made plays when it counted.  i still think that the way our O is run leads to a lot of yards, but not so many points.  and that will be magnified once we get to the playoffs and play against some quality teams.  we have a stretch against some below average teams and our O will certainly look improved.  the question we have to ask, are we happy with one and done in the playoffs?  i am.   but i was happy with dungy when he did the same thing.  anything after that is gravy imo.


\"Lets put the O back in Country\"

loweredexpectations

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#53 : November 04, 2008, 09:51:16 AM

another useless thread.
ronde thought he fumbled he ball so he stepped up and made a bad decision. kiffin did pull him on 3rd downs half the time because the way he's been playing. but you don't bench a future HOF because he's having a below average year. whats wrong with you?
how about the halftime adjustments he made and only gave up 3 points in the second half. how about the fact we've been a top 10 defense 12 out the last 13 years. and PPG was 15 before the sart of that game. if you did not know, thats 2nd in the league. do your homework before you post.

and people blame gruden because our offense NEVER scores in the first half. we finally get our TD's in the 4th about 75% of the time.

rowdie

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#54 : November 04, 2008, 11:05:43 AM

Head Coach - GM

Offensive Coordinator - Defensive Coordinator

Position Coaches

And people wonder why gruden catches flak?  responsibility moves up, and gruden holds half the top spots, and im willing to bet he has a strong influence over the GM.

but back to the point, monte deserves criticism this week sure.  the first 3 drives were not good.  but for almost 3 quarters the D played well.  grudens O deserves some praise this week.  they made plays when it counted.  i still think that the way our O is run leads to a lot of yards, but not so many points.  and that will be magnified once we get to the playoffs and play against some quality teams.  we have a stretch against some below average teams and our O will certainly look improved.  the question we have to ask, are we happy with one and done in the playoffs?  i am.   but i was happy with dungy when he did the same thing.  anything after that is gravy imo.



Don't forget the Owner at the top!


I'm all about home wins and a home playoff game.

DYK, we have a college football forum... http://www.pewterreport.com/forum/index.php?board=5.0

bucjoe

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#55 : November 04, 2008, 09:43:24 PM

another useless thread.
ronde thought he fumbled he ball so he stepped up and made a bad decision. kiffin did pull him on 3rd downs half the time because the way he's been playing. but you don't bench a future HOF because he's having a below average year. whats wrong with you?
how about the halftime adjustments he made and only gave up 3 points in the second half. how about the fact we've been a top 10 defense 12 out the last 13 years. and PPG was 15 before the sart of that game. if you did not know, thats 2nd in the league. do your homework before you post.

and people blame gruden because our offense NEVER scores in the first half. we finally get our TD's in the 4th about 75% of the time.

Haven't we led at the half of almost every game this year?  We MUST have scored SOME points in the first half to do that.

.....just my opinion

bucjoe

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#56 : November 04, 2008, 09:32:22 PM

I agree with your premise Unk, I just think some posters are taking it too far.

The defense was NOT "destroyed".  It was for the first quarter and 1/2.  Despite being humiliated, pushed around, had their faces pushed into the dirt, they shook themselves, dusted themselves off, dug in and stopped K.C. for the last 2 1/2 quarters, allowing them just 3 points, which allowed the offense and ST to do some work and pull the game out.

The offense, despite slashing their own wrists repeatedly, they put up over 400 yards of offense, tied the score in the last 19 seconds, took the OT KO, and went the length of the field to score and put it away.

Looking at the ENTIRE game, I thought the Bucs were very impressive. 

They have NEVER come back from 21 points behind in franchise history.

Do they have work to do?  Absolutely!

.....just my opinion

Uncle Stan

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#57 : November 05, 2008, 08:56:50 AM

Bucjoe,

Of the 9 games, we were ahead at halftime in 6. Tied at Denver (Loss). Behind at Dallas (4-loss). Behind at KC (11-win).  FWIW ahead by 3 at NOLA and lost.

We scored 113 points and gave 69.  (Without KC 100/45)

Week

1   10-7 NO
2   17-3 ATL
3   14-9 CHI
4   13-7 GB
5   6-6   DEN
6   17-3 CAR
7   17-0 SEA
8   6-10 DAL
9   13-24 KC

Learn to disagree without being disagreeable-Ronald Reagan circa 1981

loweredexpectations

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#58 : November 05, 2008, 09:32:57 AM

albeit this must be true. the only games we did score in the first half was when griese was in, except that seattle game. in NO offense didn't score 'til the 4th, in den didn't score 'til the 4th, in KC  didn't score 'til 4th, in DAL we didn't even score. just cause we lead doesn't mean the offense moved the ball. i was simply stating that is why gruden is always scrutinized compared to monte. do i get a pass now guys?

and as far as i can remember this has been an ongoing problem. i can't ever seem to not focus on it. either way. i think we have a great team this year and couldn't be more excited.
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