I want Russell

A prospect like him doesn't come around very often.

That is why he will go in the top 5 IMO.

[SepeBucs]

My impression of Russell is that he has a great arm and that gets him in trouble sometimes. He throws into double and triple coverage. The other thing I noticed was when he was taken out of the game, he was more interested in taking off his Jersey than shaking hands with his teamates. It may be a small meaningless thing. But then I read Chris Landry's comments about him not being a leader and being aloof. Also his comments about Russell's decision making. Those are the negatives I saw. My only point is that he is a risky very high pick and not because of his physical attributes. The pass he made rolling to his right and threw it for a long touchdown was great. Not many NFL QB's can make that throw. But he still would scare me when there are more "sure picks"(if there is such a thing) at #3-4.

I noticed something that fit in this mold. On one of his passes to the corner of the endzone, the ball was a bit overthrown. Russell's first reaction was telling the WR to run faster. (He did the arm pumping motion).

He has the talent, especially if he can get a year to learn before he plays.  But before he is selected with a top 4 pick, there needs to be ALOT of looking into the intangibles like leadership.

[coopsxx]

i agree that after some research he may not be an elite leader, but to be honest neither is Manning (blaming OL, D, taking up huge cap space), or Favre (talking about Walker etc) but he is a leader figure a guy who will be a centrepreace of an offense and a guy who will give us an identity and allow guy's like Clayton and Cadilalc, who are talented but not necessariy elite guys at there position.

[cheveliar]

If he can read a defense he will be the bomb...we don't have the luxury of selecting him that high...but he's a stud for sure...

[coopsxx]

If he can read a defense he will be the bomb...we don't have the luxury of selecting him that high...but he's a stud for sure...

i guess you are referring to Gruden's situation?? because he did state quite emohatically that he will be picking the best for the team and not for 1 win or 1 season. It may well be bull, but I am sure contrary to talk radio belief the glazers have informed them not pass on a potential franchise QB in the belief that they must be a playoff team now to save there jobs, as opposed to a potentially dominant team in 2-3 years.

[Boid Fink]

JT is a stud, just as JaMarcus is a stud.  And it really does not matter who you put in there at QB right now, the Bucs need drastic imp[rovement to their O line in order to become any sort of watchable..  Davis is not going to get any better than what he is now, so it is an obvious certainty that the Bucs offense needs a new starting LT.  Not bagging on Davis too hard, but he is a backup quality guy IMO.  He is a nice story, but time to move on, FWIW.

JaMarcus will look like a dud in this offense the way it is right now.   He has one legit wideout who is going to be 36 by next season, and a runner who needs holes in order to thrive, because it is obvious he isn't a runner who generates his own yards at the point of attack, unless he has one.  But I think Caddy and Simms/GRads/McCown can be better almost immediately should they sign Thomas.  The man isn't just a one game improvement.  He is a franchise improvement.  An anchor the Bucs sorely need, and have never had.

01/04/07 – One NFL executive in attendance at the Superdome Wednesday said Russell would go no lower than 6th in the draft and as high as No.1 overall.  Quarterbacks get pushed up in the draft, he said, and Russell is likely to grade out higher than several of the quarterbacks who have already entered the NFL in recent years.  In other words. Russell’s upside is so high that few teams could consider bypassing him to fill another need.


http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/profile.php?pyid=17117


Any team without a franchise QB will find it very hard to pass on Russell, including the Buccs.

[Boid Fink]

01/04/07 – One NFL executive in attendance at the Superdome Wednesday said Russell would go no lower than 6th in the draft and as high as No.1 overall. Quarterbacks get pushed up in the draft, he said, and Russell is likely to grade out higher than several of the quarterbacks who have already entered the NFL in recent years. In other words. Russell’s upside is so high that few teams could consider bypassing him to fill another need.


http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/profile.php?pyid=17117


Any team without a franchise QB will find it very hard to pass on Russell, including the Buccs.

And what makes you think that he will thrive in a system with the tools the Bucs have in place?  It all starts up front, and at the pro-level, JaMarcus is going to need some help.  He isn't going to be called on to throw sixty yard bombs on his knees, nor will he be able to scramble for twenty yards if (when) the line breaks down at the snap.

It is like asking midgets with no vision to guard a Hope Diamond from desperate thieves...it just isn't going to work, IMO.  The Bucs need a stud tackle, Thomas is that.

[cheveliar]

JT is a stud, just as JaMarcus is a stud. And it really does not matter who you put in there at QB right now, the Bucs need drastic imp[rovement to their O line in order to become any sort of watchable.. Davis is not going to get any better than what he is now, so it is an obvious certainty that the Bucs offense needs a new starting LT. Not bagging on Davis too hard, but he is a backup quality guy IMO. He is a nice story, but time to move on, FWIW.

JaMarcus will look like a dud in this offense the way it is right now. He has one legit wideout who is going to be 36 by next season, and a runner who needs holes in order to thrive, because it is obvious he isn't a runner who generates his own yards at the point of attack, unless he has one. But I think Caddy and Simms/GRads/McCown can be better almost immediately should they sign Thomas. The man isn't just a one game improvement. He is a franchise improvement. An anchor the Bucs sorely need, and have never had.

If you told me that I'd be ready to fight.  How can you just say a guy won't get any better.  Look I'm all down with the critisism as I know my man hasn't played to the Pro Bowl calibar you guys want him at.  We all know I'm an oline/underdog kind of guy.  So that's where most of my passion comes from.  But I think it's just rude to limit a person with that kind comment.  It's like telling someone they can't learn or they can't improve...

"In a league where the QB position is so critical -- just ask Nick Saban – Russell is the kind of player a franchise could build around for a decade.  Quinn will be solid, no doubt.  Barring injury, however, Russell will be a superstar.  “Really, I don’t see any way the two QBs (Russell and Quinn) don’t go 1-2, its almost a lock."

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/profile.php?pyid=17117


BTW - Boid, I am on the Thomas bandwagon, always have been, BUT if Russell is there for our pick don't be shocked if we take him.

[Boid Fink]

JT is a stud, just as JaMarcus is a stud. And it really does not matter who you put in there at QB right now, the Bucs need drastic imp[rovement to their O line in order to become any sort of watchable.. Davis is not going to get any better than what he is now, so it is an obvious certainty that the Bucs offense needs a new starting LT. Not bagging on Davis too hard, but he is a backup quality guy IMO. He is a nice story, but time to move on, FWIW.

JaMarcus will look like a dud in this offense the way it is right now. He has one legit wideout who is going to be 36 by next season, and a runner who needs holes in order to thrive, because it is obvious he isn't a runner who generates his own yards at the point of attack, unless he has one. But I think Caddy and Simms/GRads/McCown can be better almost immediately should they sign Thomas. The man isn't just a one game improvement. He is a franchise improvement. An anchor the Bucs sorely need, and have never had.

If you told me that I'd be ready to fight.  How can you just say a guy won't get any better.  Look I'm all down with the critisism as I know my man hasn't played to the Pro Bowl calibar you guys want him at.  We all know I'm an oline/underdog kind of guy.  So that's where most of my passion comes from.  But I think it's just rude to limit a person with that kind comment.  It's like telling someone they can't learn or they can't improve...

It may be rude, but I am only operating under observation.  Like I said, at the start of this year, he was very emphatic on his determination to become a better baller.  Truth is, he regressed.  And that is striking (espescially in that woeful Browns game...ughh) considering he is supposed to be an "upside" guy in a sense.  I just think he has tapped out his physicality, and his mentals aren't going to get any better, I mean, what else is there to learn at this point?  Now wether he has declined in performance due to Mahan or an injured (or at least enigmatic) Buenning have anything to do with it?  I am sure.  But he just isn't "the" guy, or "the" anchor the Bucs offense need at the point of attack.  

He is just another lineman out there.

[Mohawkbucs]

I would love for the bucs to pick him up, he is big, has one hell of a arm and knows how to win big games

[flyinbuc]

The Question to me is do we need a stud to win in this league. Or do we need someone who can make plays! How many stud Qb's have won the SB? Elway? I think for this team to win in Gruden's system We really need a great Defense and a Good O line. I would be happy with addressing either line.

[stereochemistry]

I see your point Boid, but at the same time it's not impossible to believe that the team around Russell would be improved in the following years after he's drafted, just as the hope would be that the Bucs would then move on to finding a franchise QB after Joe Thomas is drafted to solidify the LT spot.

To me, if both grade out as guys you can build around for years to come, I don't think you could go wrong with either.  Whenever you have a chance to upgrade to upgrade either QB or LT, you should definitely take it...but it's not like it's an either/or choice and you can't address the other at a later date.

So it really comes down to how these two grade out at their positions: Is Joe Thomas the franchise LT that teams hold on to and never let go, thereby impossible to find on the open market?  Is JaMarcus Russell the type of QB that can be groomed and set in place to be the long term leader at QB instead of bringing in FA QB's every two to three years?

And are either so gifted that a comparable player won't be found in next year's draft, or the year after that.

I could really make a case for either player.  But if both players grade out equally high at their positions, I would probably lean towards QB longterm.  I'm still not convinced that coaching is the problem on the Oline.  A franchise LT is a luxury in this league that covers up a lot of ills, as is a franchise QB (seriously, think about how many "Franchise" LTs and QBs there really are in this league...especially in the NFC.  Trent Green misses the Pro Bowl every year, while the NFC is sending yahoos like Mike Vick and Tony Romo).  But I think a franchise QB needs a little less talent around him than a franchise LT, overall.

Though again, I would hardly be upset with either.

[coopsxx]

i like thomas but garde the position's do you really think Davis is that bad? he really isn't, he's not an elite OT by any means but he is a solid OT, he has missed one game so far for us (Thomas had a bad injury last year right?) Davis would be a much better OT with consistency at LG, a better QB and a threatening attack.

At worse Demarcus can stand in the pocket and not get killed ala Simms and Grad.

I personally thought are O line improved last year, (that aint saying much I know) but with young guys you stick with them, build consistency and lett them improve, not replace them every year.