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alldaway

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#30 : November 11, 2008, 10:19:08 AM

I do not care if offensive talent can be developed because veterans work better with Jon's offense anyways.  What I care about is not using the existing offensive talent on the team to its maximum potential.

Give Mike Martz Dexter Jackson, Joey Galloway, Michael Bennett, Warrick Dunn, Luke McCown, etc and watch the fireworks ensue.  Red zone efficiency would improve as well as yards per pass attempt.  Is it possible the number of Int's increases under Martz?  Absoluely, but this team has an outstanding defense and would be able to pin their ears back with a lead built by the offense.  Especially if it is done consistently to the point teams have to actually prepare for a Bucs offense for once.

BuccanAy

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#31 : November 11, 2008, 10:20:36 AM

There are very few teams in the league who don't have a promsing young skill player or players.  Whether you like it or not, we are one of them.  For anybody to think Gruden and Allen have done well drafting offensive skill players is laughable.  

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#32 : November 11, 2008, 10:21:25 AM

Give Mike Martz Dexter Jackson, Joey Galloway, Michael Bennett, Warrick Dunn, Luke McCown, etc and watch the fireworks ensue. Red zone efficiency would improve as well as yards per pass attempt. Is it possible the number of Int's increases under Martz? Absoluely, but this team has an outstanding defense and would be able to pin their ears back with a lead built by the offense. Especially if it is done consistently to the point teams have to actually prepare for a Bucs offense for once.

Wow...I know you're not going to hold Mike Martz up as a shining light after that debacle last night...

Are you?

sammy8887

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#33 : November 11, 2008, 10:23:00 AM

There are very few teams in the league who don't have a promsing young skill player or players.  Whether you like it or not, we are one of them.  For anybody to think Gruden and Allen have done well drafting offensive skill players is laughable. 

If this thread is about Dexter Jackson, come out and say it...

It really makes no sense under the scope you're putting it under -- especially with Caddy about to comeback and Clayton starting to get it done...

alldaway

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#34 : November 11, 2008, 10:23:48 AM

Give Mike Martz Dexter Jackson, Joey Galloway, Michael Bennett, Warrick Dunn, Luke McCown, etc and watch the fireworks ensue. Red zone efficiency would improve as well as yards per pass attempt. Is it possible the number of Int's increases under Martz? Absoluely, but this team has an outstanding defense and would be able to pin their ears back with a lead built by the offense. Especially if it is done consistently to the point teams have to actually prepare for a Bucs offense for once.

Wow...I know you're not going to hold Mike Martz up as a shining light after that debacle last night...

Are you?

Martz would instantly make the Bucs offense far more efficient in the red zone.  I strongly believe there are lot of offensive coordinators out there that can maximize the existing talent on the team.

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#35 : November 11, 2008, 10:26:00 AM

Give Mike Martz Dexter Jackson, Joey Galloway, Michael Bennett, Warrick Dunn, Luke McCown, etc and watch the fireworks ensue. Red zone efficiency would improve as well as yards per pass attempt. Is it possible the number of Int's increases under Martz? Absoluely, but this team has an outstanding defense and would be able to pin their ears back with a lead built by the offense. Especially if it is done consistently to the point teams have to actually prepare for a Bucs offense for once.

Wow...I know you're not going to hold Mike Martz up as a shining light after that debacle last night...

Are you?

Martz would instantly make the Bucs offense far more efficient in the red zone. I strongly believe there are lot of offensive coordinators out there that can maximize the existing talent on the team.


I don't know...with the players you mentioned I'm sure you would think Vernon Davis is a stud, yet he caught his first TD pass last night...

Why is Martz not using him effectively?

alldaway

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#36 : November 11, 2008, 10:28:18 AM

Give Mike Martz Dexter Jackson, Joey Galloway, Michael Bennett, Warrick Dunn, Luke McCown, etc and watch the fireworks ensue. Red zone efficiency would improve as well as yards per pass attempt. Is it possible the number of Int's increases under Martz? Absoluely, but this team has an outstanding defense and would be able to pin their ears back with a lead built by the offense. Especially if it is done consistently to the point teams have to actually prepare for a Bucs offense for once.

Wow...I know you're not going to hold Mike Martz up as a shining light after that debacle last night...

Are you?

Martz would instantly make the Bucs offense far more efficient in the red zone. I strongly believe there are lot of offensive coordinators out there that can maximize the existing talent on the team.


I don't know...with the players you mentioned I'm sure you would think Vernon Davis is a stud, yet he caught his first TD pass last night...

Why is Martz not using him effectively?

Vernon Davis has not been a stud for any of the offensive coordinators in San Francisco.

Try again.


bradentonian

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#37 : November 11, 2008, 10:30:14 AM

But the thing is, does all the blame rest on Gruden for not developing a skill position player?  I feel like the rest of the coaching staff (QB coaches, RB coaches, etc.) has to take some of the blame as well.  

Very fair, but Gruden has had opportunities to replace his staff and has stuck with "his guys".  


jerseybucsfan

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#38 : November 11, 2008, 10:30:48 AM

Wow, you put Allen in there. I'm impressed. So you're down to half of it being Gruden's fault. Nice!
However, they have drafted very well in EVERY other area: pretty good on offensive linemen (Joseph, Sears), extremely good on defense ...
So it's laughable that you isolate the problem like this because we all KNOW it's the team weakness, so why belabor it? To take a cheapshot of course.
Had they the same perspective as yourself, they would have drafted totally by NEED and not best player available. Maybe they take Vincent Jackson (WR) instead of Barrett Ruud in the second round in 2005. Maybe they skip Joseph and go for Santonio Holmes in the first round in 2006. Or maybe they forget that Cadillac Williams was just All-Rookie RB in 2005 and pick Maurice Jones-Drew and not Jeremy Trueblood in Round 2 of 2006.
There are also few teams who have drafted as many quality players elsewhere.

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BuccanAy

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#39 : November 11, 2008, 10:31:48 AM

This thread is about 6years worth of poor offensive draft picks at the skill positions.  Very straight-forward.  No hidden agenda.  Why can't we seem to draft quality WR's, RB, or QB's or TE's.  Very simple question.  Or are they quality picks that we just can't get the most out of.  Either we're missing badly on our picks or we can't seem to develop them.  It seems to me, it's the latter.  If you honestly feel this is not a problem, then OK.  It seems to me this is a big problem.  

jerseybucsfan

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#40 : November 11, 2008, 10:32:15 AM

Oh so he's a lousy play caller, megalomaniac and guilty of cronyism too, eh? Are we talking about Gruden or the outgoing president?

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alldaway

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#41 : November 11, 2008, 10:32:20 AM

But the thing is, does all the blame rest on Gruden for not developing a skill position player?  I feel like the rest of the coaching staff (QB coaches, RB coaches, etc.) has to take some of the blame as well. 

Very fair, but Gruden has had opportunities to replace his staff and has stuck with "his guys". 

They had a chance to bring in a fresh face as the offensive line (or even retain Kromer)coach.  Right now we are seeing the up/down play by the offensive line when it should be firing on all cylinders.  I hope they are able to finish strong as the regular season winds down.




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#42 : November 11, 2008, 10:33:43 AM

MARTZ? FB DIVE from the 3? LOL. What is SF's record? How has thier pass pro been? Spread em out and get your QB killed. Yeah, bring in Martz.

jerseybucsfan

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#43 : November 11, 2008, 10:35:16 AM

Yeah, we should have drafted Tony Romo, like Dallas. Oh wait. Undrafted FA! Sorry. Or drafted TO. Nevermind.
So a FA pickup or unsigned pickup doesn't count. Smart! When Earnest Graham kicks Atlanta's or Carolina's butts, let's give the wins back cos he wasn't drafted!

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alldaway

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#44 : November 11, 2008, 10:35:25 AM

I would take Martz any day over Gruden as an OC.

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