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olafberserker

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#60 : November 14, 2008, 11:14:57 PM

Oh, forget it.  I hope you guys have perfect kids, for their sakes.  Have a nice weekend, and Go Bucs!


I hope so too, but it probably won't happen.  Give me your address, when I'm tired of being a parent I'll drop them off at you house.

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#61 : November 14, 2008, 11:21:52 PM

I hope you guys have perfect kids, for their sakes. 

Are you reading what you're typing?  Only in America can someone be villified for saying that parents need to step up and be ... parents.  Unbeleivable.

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#62 : November 14, 2008, 11:24:01 PM

Here's some help for the drug addiction.


http://www.unitedwaytampabay.com/agencies_listall.asp?letter=&agencyID=35

TURBO

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#63 : November 14, 2008, 11:37:35 PM

Oh, forget it. I hope you guys have perfect kids, for their sakes. Have a nice weekend, and Go Bucs!


I hope so too, but it probably won't happen. Give me your address, when I'm tired of being a parent I'll drop them off at you house.

niiiiiiice!


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#64 : November 14, 2008, 11:50:12 PM

Wow...
As a father of 8 and 15 year old daughters, I can't believe what some people do. My oldest is my step daughter. That's a couple of words that really don't make sense to me. I knew what I was getting into and I went in with open arms. I treat her as if she were my own daughter because I want to. She's 15. She knows everything. She's farting off in school and hanging out with the wrong kids right now. Instead of me passing the buck, I am in her room, talking to her, trying to figure out what the deal is. She talks to me openly about things. It's a nice relationship to have. What makes it even better is that both my bio daughter and my<ahem... step> daughter act as if they are REAL sisters. They even do the silly crap like get matching earrings and necklaces.

Maybe it's all in how you are as a family. Things don't always go right in our home, but we always have 1 family night a week and we eat dinner at the table. Well, not every night. Dance and gymnastics classes sometimes cause us to eat on the run, but we make them a healthy dinner instead of BK or the arches. C'mon people. These are kids! They deserve better than we had. At least that's my way of thinking. If we were not fortunate to have children of our own, we would have adopted and raised them as our own. My brother did that and his son is nothing short of an awesome kid!

I'm stepping off my soap box now and I'll stop babbling

Quote from: Raheem Morris
We got to get better at doing something, and that is what we have to set our focus on and that is something to get better at. That\\\\\\\'s what we are trying to do right now.

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#65 : November 15, 2008, 10:58:18 AM

BUCFAN4LIFE = The right way to do things.

There are not 2 sides, you have your kids, raise them properly, even when it gets tough.  There is no situation on this earth that would make me give my kids up, to anyone, for any reason.

It is quite easy to see in this thread who has kids, and who doesn't.  Those without should not even comment, they just don't get it.

Anyone who disagrees with what I am saying either has no kids (and please, leave it that way), or is so far up their own liberal butt there is no hope for them.


BUCFAN4LIFE

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#66 : November 15, 2008, 07:46:42 AM

Hey Joe,

You should be happy for these people!  They are getting to exercise their liberty and rights!  Raise their own kids??  Absolutely not.  We are free to do what we want and if that means dumping off their responsibilities on others, so be it.  You are right, we don't know their situation.  But I have kids and I can tell you this; I'd live in lean-to and eat berries and wild game before I dump my children off on someone.  You don't know since you don't have kids.  But just like everything else in this country, if it doesn't please you or make you feel good, the answer is to get rid of it!  Marriage, kids, bills, etc........SEE YA!!  That is the answer we give! 
Just another liberal attitude endorsed by your truly JOE.

You don't get it Joe.  Everything is tied together.  The family is broken because we don't believe in the fairy tale God anymore and we are making our own rules!  Pray??  Forget that when we can just throw our problems on someone else.  You and your liberal buddies will never ever get it.

Bravo


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#67 : November 15, 2008, 08:23:45 AM

Do you criticizers of the dropping-off parents have teenage children? If your kids are still eight years old and perfect, you can't understand the stress of raising teens in this society in this time period. Talk to me in in seven or eight years.

 Many public schools are absolute jokes, and the kids can just skip or leave anytime anyway. Parents living in poor neighborhoods with no family to back them up have it very tough. There are gangs and drug dealers luring their children, and once the kid gets addicted to meth, crack, pain pills, liquor, or whatever else, the parents can't reach them anymore. If they don't have decent health insurance, they can't get the kid rehab or mental health services. Plus the parents are probably working two crappy jobs to make ends meet and are exhausted.

I am lucky enough to live in a nice neighborhood with a support system, and still know parents who have 'lost' their kids to drugs, stripping, stealing, jail, etc. One seventeen-year old boy died overdosed on a **CENSORED**tail of prescription drugs. These are normal parents who work hard and love their children.

I have two teenagers, the older of which will be twenty this month. My husband and I always try to be there to listen to them, to understand and guide them, and so far the kids, while not perfect, are doing well. The stresses are there for them, though. It's not like when we were teens. It's really not. So don't judge these parents; while some are probably irresponsible idiots, some are no doubt desperately trying to save their child's life.

I have a teenage boy and a 8 y/o. It started long long ago that I started raising them (day 1). Both attend public school. Both are straight A student's. I have 2 jobs and work 60hrs a week most weeks. And I regularly put God, discipline, and my love into them. Teenagers are a challenge. But if you started parenting from day 1 teenagers are no different, just a lot more hormones and bad attitude that needs to be redirected. You become a cop in your home. My teen is so scared of drugs after what i have shown him I doubt he would even try. He may try beer or alcohol. But he knows he better not let me find him. There are signs when kids are going bad. Any good parent should be able to recognize those signs. If not drug test them- they sell the kits over the counter now. I have done it for piece of mind. My teen dares me to check. He knows I raised him well. For some there is tragedy of a single mistake. Thats why I pray everyday for the hedge of protection around my boys. It's gotten me this far. The key is keep them on a short leash and guide them. No matter how much they buck you they know deep down you are right and they will follow that path.

Its all about sacrifice- and I personally would sacrifice to the ends of the earth for my two boys. I took my oldest boy out of a bad relationship and got custody at 6 months old. I raised him working nights 70hrs a week back then and finishing college during the day. My Mom stayed some nights with him when she could. The others I had a great Nanny where I dropped him after I put him down for the night (she wasn't cheap but was worth it). But I made sure that Boy woke to my face each morning and went to bed under my touch. It was a battle to make ends meet and be there for him to raise him. All the while I made it- far less sleep than any human should deal with but he was well worth it. I would nap when he napped. I did both a bachelors and a masters under that stress because I knew thats what it would take to give him more than I had- which was a lot. And low and behold it paid off - I was able to afford a beautiful home in the best public school district in Pinellas.  We met my beautiful wife who gladly took us on a package deal and now he has  alittle brother as well. Who by the grace of God is a well rounded good kid as well who has been raised the same way. Hard nosed but true with God, Love, and Discipline. Luckily that masters education affords me to work two jobs still but allowed my wife to finish her masters and now she works part time but our finances are sufficient enough that someone is always hopme when the boys are out of school. I will continue to pray and do my part as a parent. It is the hardest and most rewarding job on Earth.

I am not oblivious to the obvious struggles of some, but to say teenagers are even harder is not true. The hard part is done if you raised them right. It's all about listening, keeping strict guidelines and tabs, and guiding them through a rough time. You just have to be their rock. They can be emotional azzes and thats when you have to bring them back down to Earth and guide them.

I find no faults in those that have no other choices in life than to give them up for life or death as they see it. But for me that would never be an option at all unless their impending deaths depended on it- because I would easily give my life for theirs....  But many of these stories are parents simply copping out.


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#68 : November 15, 2008, 09:59:10 AM

BucsGuru, BUCFAN4LIFE

Both of your posts are what it's all about. Eating berries and wild game. Working 60 or 70 hours a week. Good parenting. Being involved in their personal lives. That's what it's all about. If that's what it takes, so be it. If you don't have to work those long hours and you can afford the special things, GREAT! We take all our extra money and dump it into classes for them. Jazz, Tap, Gymnastics, Hip Hop, you name it. We're trying to find a way to budget out another $250 a month for them to take karate classes. Why? For discipline first and protection second.

BUCFAN4LIFE said it best in this line
"It is the hardest and most rewarding job on Earth."

Well said, and I know your kids appreciate your efforts each and every day.

Quote from: Raheem Morris
We got to get better at doing something, and that is what we have to set our focus on and that is something to get better at. That\\\\\\\'s what we are trying to do right now.

John Galt?

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#69 : November 15, 2008, 10:23:12 AM

Great so dump them on the front step of your hospital. Unbelievable. What they should do is be parents.

Especially since that is what they SIGNED UP FOR. Literally, this lady signed up and applied to become a parent.

THE 18 YEAR OLD WAS ADOPTED!

In my mind, that is even worse. She didn't have a kid because of a careless night of fun, faulty BC, or someother unplanned event. She knowingly and willfully signed up to be an adoptive parent. Now she wants to bail on the situation.

The article doesn't state if she was the permanent parent or a foster parent. But isn't it interesting that most foster parents get govt. aid/support for foster kids UNTIL THEY TURN 18.

I  don't know this lady's situation of circumstance so I won't judge her. But doesn't most child support/aid end when the kid turns 18.

Things that make you go hmmmmmmmmmmm.


ufojoe

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#70 : November 15, 2008, 10:33:59 AM

I  don't know this lady's situation of circumstance so I won't judge her. But doesn't most child support/aid end when the kid turns 18.

Things that make you go hmmmmmmmmmmm.

Some of these parents probably deserve jail time for what they have done. But I'd still like to hear
more about what happened in each situation.


TURBO

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#71 : November 15, 2008, 11:19:51 AM


A little more info. on how the Nebraska system works...

http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1858355,00.html

I think that unless you play professional football, you shouldn't be posting on the Red or Insider's Board.

LOL.



and if you think that equates to raising children, then I can see why you can't relate to the seriousness of this thread...


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#72 : November 15, 2008, 02:45:24 PM

Great so dump them on the front step of your hospital.  Unbelievable.  What they should do is be parents.
OK, say your 15-year old daughter is anorexic.  She won't eat, and if you force her to, she just throws it up.  She cuts herself with anything handy--knives, paper clips, pencils, etc.  She also does meth to get skinnier.  She states that her goal in life is to be a stripper.  When she falls unconscious (again) due to her starvation and self-abuse, you bring her to the ER (again.)  They give her some fluids and some potassium since her heart rate is about 40.  Then you go home with her.  What do you do?  You have no money, your health insurance mental health provision is 30 days in-house treatment, but you already used that up on her last January.  How do you parent this child?  Life is not black and white.

You take her to the ER. The ER doc or provider evaluates her. Sees shes a cutter and at risk to her self. Sees the multiple admits and realizes this kid is at risk. He/ She Baker Acts her. Admits her medically until she clears. Orders psych consult. Social services now involved. Insurance is gone now. Local social services sees this, long term placement needed. Parents agreeable. Social Services realizes the parents fears and sees the risks as documented by the ER reports. Refer to family courts for immediate long term 120 days treatment commitment order. Child placed via Directions for Mental Health or PEMHS into the PACES program which is state federally and donation funded. Child gets care she needs. Parents get the help they need. Parents may also be ordered to take parenting classes. Girl gets much needed counseling, is started on medications to balance her, and after 6 months of intensive therapy she is well on the road to recovery. Weekly parenting has taught the parents what to look for, how to treat, how to deal with their daughter, and when to look for help again. Now 16 year old girl is doing well in school, taking her medications, is at a healthy weight, and is able to relate to her parents after counseling taught them.

Sure the system can be a long drawn out process, but isn't that 15 year old girl worth it. Obviously some don't think so and they drop them off at the ER and sign their rights away.

It isn't always balck and white, true. But it is where your priorities are. The services are available, you know as a RN that the services are there- you just have to fight like hell to get them. But in a pinch like your scenario where there is iminent risk no provider will turn that child away. And any judge in this land would commit her. Once it is a court order the state takes over the costs. To me any 15y/o kid is worth that cost.


ufojoe

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#73 : November 15, 2008, 05:55:10 PM

You take her to the ER. The ER doc or provider evaluates her. Sees shes a cutter and at risk to her self. Sees the multiple admits and realizes this kid is at risk. He/ She Baker Acts her. Admits her medically until she clears. Orders psych consult. Social services now involved. Insurance is gone now. Local social services sees this, long term placement needed. Parents agreeable. Social Services realizes the parents fears and sees the risks as documented by the ER reports. Refer to family courts for immediate long term 120 days treatment commitment order. Child placed via Directions for Mental Health or PEMHS into the PACES program which is state federally and donation funded. Child gets care she needs. Parents get the help they need. Parents may also be ordered to take parenting classes. Girl gets much needed counseling, is started on medications to balance her, and after 6 months of intensive therapy she is well on the road to recovery. Weekly parenting has taught the parents what to look for, how to treat, how to deal with their daughter, and when to look for help again. Now 16 year old girl is doing well in school, taking her medications, is at a healthy weight, and is able to relate to her parents after counseling taught them.

Sure the system can be a long drawn out process, but isn't that 15 year old girl worth it. Obviously some don't think so and they drop them off at the ER and sign their rights away.

It isn't always balck and white, true. But it is where your priorities are. The services are available, you know as a RN that the services are there- you just have to fight like hell to get them. But in a pinch like your scenario where there is iminent risk no provider will turn that child away. And any judge in this land would commit her. Once it is a court order the state takes over the costs. To me any 15y/o kid is worth that cost.

If the parent is thinking clearly, there is no way they would give up their child like that. But stress and depression can
make a person do some bad things. How many of us can relate to the person who tries to commit suicide, knowing
that their loved ones are going to find their body? Do you think the person is thinking straight when they are about
to end it all and put their loved ones through that? Do you think the parents are thinking straight when they abandon
their child?

Some just might be selfish, bad parents. But, like I said, unless we're in their shoes and feeling what they're feeling
at the time, it's hard to know what to think. I just think that in some situation, people snap. Look at Susan Smith.
Does anybody really think she was in a normal state of mind when she killed her kids?

More from another Time article...

http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1859405,00.html?iid=tsmodule

"These parents had to be totally overwhelmed to do something like this," says Rev. Steven Boes, president of Boys Town - the original safe haven of Father Flanagan fame, which happens to be headquartered in Omaha. Once upon a time, Depression-battered parents would buy bus fare for their children and hand them a sign, "Take Me to Boys Town." Their counterparts today "are parents who have tried to navigate the system for years and this is their last resort; these are parents who ran out of patience too darn fast and gave up too early, and everything in between," says Father Boes.

For each abandonment, there are just as many parents who arrive at the safe haven but, in the end, don't carry through, says Courtney Anderson of the Immanuel Medical Center in Omaha. As a medical social worker, she has been on duty in the ER when some of the abandonments unfolded. "Some parents want us to threaten the child - they feel that would set them straight." Some parents cry; others are merely angry. Some children begin to cry when they figure out what's going on, says Anderson, while others are hardened veterans of the foster care system and "are used to these ups and downs."

Five of the children abandoned in Nebraska have been from out of state, but most are local. A majority of the children are older than 13 and have a history of being treated for mental health issues. Nearly every abandoned child came from a single-parent household. In September, one father walked into a hospital and left nine children, ages one to 17. He reportedly told hospital workers he'd been overwhelmed since his wife died a few days after their youngest was born.

Boes says one root of the abandonment problem is that there is simply not enough help for parents in crisis. In Nebraska, for instance, there are only six child psychiatrists in the entire state, he says. "It's a national problem... insurance often won't pay after six visits - so if the kid's not fixed, you're out of luck. States have a jumble of services. It's a puzzle with missing pieces."

Boes says the parents who are leaving kids shouldn't be demonized. "Father Flanagan said it: he learned there was no such thing as a bad boy. And I have come to believe there is no such thing as a bad family." There is a 12-year-old girl at Boys Town now, he says, who desperately wants to see her mother, the same mother who broke the girl's arm and used to hold her down and burn her with cigarettes. "Why, I wonder? But if she can see something good there, surely there is good in all families."

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