Horrifying

[jerseybucsfan]

But he's only doing the drafting if the guys stink. When they pan out, good job (fill in the blanks).

[mjs020294]

The list didn't exactly concentrate on that, did it? What relevance does Oakland's choices have to Gruden in Tampa Bay now? ZERO. So you're playing both sides of the fence.

Actually Gruden drafting in Oakland has a HUGE bearing on his ability to evaluate and draft talent.

Point is Dungy left years ago and a lot of Muppets on these boards are still sucking on his nut sack while others just love to wallow in his failures.

[jerseybucsfan]

Gruden isn't the CURRENT coach in Oakland. Nor are we talking about the Raiders, we're talking about the Bucs. And with Al Davis, you really think Gruden had the PRIMARY say on draft picks there? Now I know you're delusional.
As for Dungy, I only relish his failures in relation to those who as you say .... his nut sack.

Dude go ahead and show the list of players that McKay/Dungy drafted--not Wyche or any of the older regime.. I'll give you Dunn.

Care to elaborate on what that list has to do with Dungy, McKay, Wyche, Leeman Bennett, Ray Perkins, or John McKay?

[olafberserker]

yet we still have winning records in 4 out of 7 and a Lombardi Trophy on his watch ... must be one helluva coach ....

[mjs020294]

Gruden isn't the CURRENT coach in Oakland. Nor are we talking about the Raiders, we're talking about the Bucs. And with Al Davis, you really think Gruden had the PRIMARY say on draft picks there? Now I know you're delusional.

So when I write my resume only my current job is relevant?  Talk about arguing for arguing sake.

Get your knee pads on, Luke has finsihed under Gruden's desk and its your turn.

[jerseybucsfan]

The list has as much to do with them as Jon Gruden if we're talking who DRAFTED the players.
But carry on the H-A-T-E, Hate.

[celler1210]

Apparently Michael Clayton finsihed with a rookie high in receptions and TDs in 2004 and was narrowly beat out by Roethlisberger for OROY and then was followed up by Caddy (with fresh knee caps) for a historic OROY performance.  Then Davin Joseph, Gaines Adams, Aqib Talib.  What wron with these first rouond picks?  How about these:

Regan Upsahw
Marcus Jones
Warrick Dunn
Reidel Anthony
Anthony McFarland
Kenyatta Walker

I told you I'd give you Dunn, but the rest are poop.  Before you say anything about Gaines, he has no inside help....Do you think that Jared Allen would be as effective without the Williams boys in the middle?  Was Simeon Rice now several years from employment was effective without Sapp?  Please use your head before spouting off shenanigans!

So when I write my resume only my current job is relevant?  Talk about arguing for arguing sake.

Get your knee pads on, Luke has finsihed under Gruden's desk and its your turn.

LMAO........ Mark, you're killin me!!!

The list has as much to do with them as Jon Gruden if we're talking who DRAFTED the players.
But carry on the H-A-T-E, Hate.

Dude, this post is about the C-U-R-R-E-N-T goings on at One Buc. Who gives a crap about what happened under the former regime? I've stated many times I love Dungy but when they gave him the boot, it was past time for him to go. Folks need to let it go already. Dude's been outta here for 7 yrs.

The last guy that didn't give Chucky what he wanted was given the boot. I refuse to believe that Allen doesn't involve Chucky's input..... no matter what PR reports.

[celler1210]

Dude go ahead and show the list of players that McKay/Dungy drafted--not Wyche or any of the older regime.. I'll give you Dunn.

Care to elaborate on what that list has to do with Dungy, McKay, Wyche, Leeman Bennett, Ray Perkins, or John McKay?

Pretty impressive with 16K posts....I'd think someone that knowledgeable about message boards would know what the post was about...It was about draft picks under Gruden so I was offering an inside glance at the Buccaneers franchise's pick before he arrived.  BTW... I've had season tickets since 1977 so even though I'm just getting used to a computer doesn't mean I don't know Buc's football.

[JavaBuc]

10 seasons worth and only 2 1st round and 2 2nd round picks?   Is that right?   How is that even possible?

[jerseybucsfan]

Given your negativity, I'm not sure ANYTHING on your resume is relevant. But getting back to the subject, we know he coached the Raiders to the AFC title game in 2000 and then the Tuck Rule Game in 2001. Are you well-versed in Oakland's draft mechanisms? Needs? Who pushed for whom in their war room?
McKay was the GM here in 2002 and 2003. We didn't have two firsts and two seconds by virtue of Parcells stiffing us and the Glazers using the picks to acquire Gruden (which worked in the short run in the form of a Super Bowl title). If we're talking development, would you have rather had two good offensive players and then a mediocre coach that didn't get us out of the first round in 2002?
We KNOW that we haven't drafted good offensive skill players going back to Dunn and even Alstott. You choose to blame Gruden. That's fine, but there's little evidence that he's the sole person to blame let alone the PRIMARY one. But you want to play that card, go ahead. PR has proven it numerous times to be erroneous.

[anterrabae33]

10 seasons worth and only 2 1st round and 2 2nd round picks? � Is that right? � How is that even possible?

The best offense is a great defense








or is it the other way around?

[celler1210]

Marquise Walker was drafted under Gruden....But he wanted Brian Westbrook and McKay wouldn't have it.  I'm thinking it's Gruden's fault and we should fire him.  Please use your head and know the facts...

[mjs020294]

Given your negativity,

I am not a negative person, quite the opposite.  I just happen to think Gruden is a little red headed turd.