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sammy8887

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: January 19, 2009, 10:53:37 AM

Didn't see this posted anywhere...P. Yasinskas seemed to have a pretty good read on the situation...


That's the bio, but here's the stuff that goes deeper than that. Morris was going to be a head coach in this league someday. Coaches who've worked with him rave about him and players who play for him do it even more vocally.

This guy is a true players' coach. He's also going to be a true fans' coach, but it might take a while to get to know him. All indications are Tampa Bay fans are going to love Morris.

That's something that couldn't be said about Gruden. His act had worn thin in Tampa and fell apart completely when the Bucs lost their last four games to finish 9-7 and out of the playoffs. Tampa Bay fans were outraged.

The Glazers, known for their quiet and calm, apparently were outraged as well. They took their time (three weeks) and did their homework. These guys are sharp and they talked to players and assistant coaches. Word is, Gruden didn't get glowing reviews. I think that was Jeff Garcia I saw doing cartwheels up and down Dale Mabry Highway when the firing was announced.

Part of Gruden's problem might have been that he was a bit of a showman and people stopped buying that when he didn't win a playoff game after the Super Bowl. They also stopped buying it when, year after year, Gruden and Allen just patched together the Bucs without anything that looked remotely close to a long-term plan.

That's why Gruden and Allen are gone and Morris and Dominik are getting promoted. The Bucs once ran Dungy out of town because he couldn't win the big one. They also watched as Tomlin, Smith and Marinelli worked as Tampa Bay assistants and left for head jobs and, for the most part, great success.

Maybe the Glazers looked at the Bill Cowhers and Mike Shanahans of the world before making their decision and realized what they had in their own backyard. They had a future star in Morris and the anti-Allen in Dominik, who at least has social skills.  Dominik also has a strong reputation as a personnel evaluator.

And maybe the Glazers looked around the league and saw men such as Atlanta's Mike Smith and Baltimore's John Harbaugh having success in their first seasons as head coaches on any level.

The Gruden-Allen era in Tampa Bay is over. The Morris-Dominik era is about to start. Give credit to the Glazers for keeping an open mind on this and not just going out and hiring the biggest name. That worked briefly with Gruden, but there didn't seem to be any real direction for this franchise in the last few years.

You'll hear a lot more about Morris and Dominik once the Bucs make this official, and I'm guessing they'll sound more like Dungy and former general manager Rich McKay than like Gruden and Allen. They may or may not bring instant success.

But Morris and Dominik may get a honeymoon period that had long ago expired on Gruden and Allen, and fans may have to be a little patient in the growing process.

I'm guessing Tampa Bay fans won't mind because they'll have a coach and general manager who actually are following a plan.


http://myespn.go.com/blogs/nfcsouth/0-7-102/Morris--Dominik-will-at-least-bring-a-plan-to-Bucs.html



That's a big part of the reason Gruden is gone, despite the fact the Glazers are on the hook to him and Allen for about $25 million. Sources said the Glazers talked with some players and assistant coaches to see how Gruden was viewed and the results weren't pretty. That helped in the decision-making.

Morris is gregarious and well respected in the locker room.

...

Some other random notes and observations about the hiring of Morris and Dominik:

Wide receiver Antonio Bryant didn't want Gruden fired, but he ended up getting the best remaining outcome. Bryant is scheduled to become a free agent next month.
"I'm definitely looking forward to working with Raheem Morris as the Buccaneers' head coach,'' Bryant said in a statement released by the team.

That's a pretty strong comment for a guy who could have a big payday if he makes it to the open market. But a source close to Bryant said the chances of him re-signing with the Bucs are good. Bryant spent the 2007 season out of football due to some personal problems. The Bucs were the only team willing to give him a chance this season and the results were positive.

The source said Bryant is reluctant to go to a team where he would have to prove himself to a new coach all over again. He and Morris have a good relationship and Bryant wouldn't have to start from scratch.


http://myespn.go.com/blogs/nfcsouth/0-7-108/Bucs-taking-calculated-risk-with-Morris.html



This wasn't something that was decided on the spur of the moment. Fact is, the Glazers, who operate in their own very tight little circle, made this decision over the course of almost three weeks and they had their plan all in place when they made the move.

There was no blowup with Gruden. If you want the real reasons Gruden was fired, they're simple. Start with the team's collapse in the last four games of the 2008 season. Throw in the fact that this team really didn't have any direction or long-term plan. And finish it up with Gruden's players and some of his assistant coaches not doing him any favors and simply telling the truth when the Glazers polled them about what was going on.

Again, this wasn't some verbal fight in the heat of the moment. This was a cold, calculated move by the Glazers, and it was based on Gruden's body of work and where the team stood.


http://myespn.go.com/blogs/nfcsouth/0-7-110/Tampa-Bay-s-shakeup-result-of-long--calculated-process.html

dalbuc

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#1 : January 19, 2009, 11:00:10 AM

The thing is that there had to be come precipitating event between the end of the season and the firing. Cold and calculating is one thing but 3 weeks is too long.

Strike 1 is no playoff wins since 2002
Strike 2 was the December collapse

There had to be a strike 3 between the Oakland game and now because the lag is just way too over the top for "careful" consideration. It might not have been that day but something, the week before for example, caused them to re-evaluate

All posts are opinions in case you are too stupid to figure that out on your own without me saying it over and over.

sammy8887

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#2 : January 19, 2009, 11:02:20 AM

The thing is that there had to be come precipitating event between the end of the season and the firing. Cold and calculating is one thing but 3 weeks is too long.

Strike 1 is no playoff wins since 2002
Strike 2 was the December collapse

There had to be a strike 3 between the Oakland game and now because the lag is just way too over the top for "careful" consideration. It might not have been that day but something, the week before for example, caused them to re-evaluate


I think the "strike 3" is spelled out in all three of those articles...

GameTime

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#3 : January 19, 2009, 11:03:55 AM

pretty good read to me.

\"Lets put the O back in Country\"

keeponbucn

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#4 : January 19, 2009, 11:15:42 AM

The thing is that there had to be come precipitating event between the end of the season and the firing. Cold and calculating is one thing but 3 weeks is too long.

Strike 1 is no playoff wins since 2002
Strike 2 was the December collapse

There had to be a strike 3 between the Oakland game and now because the lag is just way too over the top for "careful" consideration. It might not have been that day but something, the week before for example, caused them to re-evaluate


3 had to be after speaking to players and assistant coaches.

I agree with most of these articles, Gruden's message wore thin and it was time for a change. The Glazers know what they're doing, if all reports within OBP were positive of Gruden this might not have happened.

Can we win a damn playoff game now? Damn it's been too long

jerseybucsfan

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#5 : January 19, 2009, 11:20:57 AM

It's been posted multiple times.
And what exactly does this prove? That players won't back a guy after they went from 9-3 to 9-7? That a guy who is among the league's best known coaches, who has gotten a lot of publicity from things he cannot control (the nickname, his looks, etc.) is not loved by underachievers who don't get attention?
I would think the best way to assess these types of things would be through time and AFTER, not at the low point of your regime. I'm not talking a week or a month, but we obviously didn't have that type of time.
What I find interesting is this: 1. So many who had agendas had Gruden were given such a voice. The guys who had time (Keyshawn, King, etc.) were guys not likely to change their voice given the circumstances of their departure, 2. The numbers are painted one way. All numbers begin with ''Since the Super Bowl season...''  Wins and losses are a bit deceiving in this case. Were the Bucs were really good for two seasons (2002 and 2005), mediocre to good twice (2007 and 2008), definitely mediocre (2003) and then awful (2004 and 2006).
Understand the pattern Gruden had to follow: 1. Piece together several players to FINISH a Super Bowl run. This was no small feat given where the Bucs were when they lost 31-9 in Philly in the 2001 playoffs. They were NOT a championship team.
2. Keep the team together (2003) probably a year longer than they should have. This was Mistake No. 1. Rebuilding should have begun immediately but you don't tear apart a championship team. As it was, fans would be impatient that we began it as soon as we did (see reactions involving Lynch, Alstott, Rice, etc.)
3. Decide to try and rebuild or reload. With the media hitting hard the Bucs not making the playoffs in 2003 and already saying the bloom was off the rose, Gruden was put in a lose-lose situation: if he decided to reload, it wouldn't be the best long-term solution. Rebuild and he'd be changing plan midstream (one again beyond his control when he came in). So this was Mistake No. 2. 2005 would prove reloading WAS a good option (as the team went 11-5; a lot of the championship players still had something left), but given his bad cap shape Allen should have tried to clean it up immediately.
4. Not being more aggressive in FA last winter. This was all on Allen. Mistake No. 3. After an injury-riddled 2006, the Bucs should have addressed the QB situation long term in the 2007 draft. They did not. They should have addressed it in the 2008 draft. Again, they did not. They let a lot of negativity swirl around Plummer, Simms, Favre, Garcia, Griese. The Bucs weren't ''collecting'' QBs; they simply couldn't get the one they wanted and yet made it a very low priority.
Look at the way they reconstructed the Oline or the secondary. So it CAN be done. But you usually can't go far in this league without a quality QB in this league. You usually go 9-7 if you're good and have a losing season if you don't. And the same will hold true for Morris, regardless of his popularity or anything else.
Understand that the Bucs have won the South in three of seven seasons. The league average on winning divisions is 25 percent. That's 42.9 percent. Instead the emphasis was put on not winning playoff games (and the teams that have). The Bucs have gone 33-31 over the last four seasons, which sounds mediocre. But the numbers are thrown off a bit: 11-5, 4-12, 9-7, 9-7. Two division titles are in there and three winning seasons.
Bottom line is you paint it the way you want to paint it. I hope Raheem has circumstances go his way moreso than his predecessor.

In Verner We Trust

jerseybucsfan

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#6 : January 19, 2009, 11:22:18 AM

KEEP, your last line ''Can we win a playoff game...'' is going to be a HUGE challenge for Raheem because frankly I don't think the talent matches up.
The fans need to give Raheem time to BUILD the right way. Impatience can be counterproductive.

In Verner We Trust

sammy8887

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#7 : January 19, 2009, 11:22:44 AM

Bottom line is you paint it the way you want to paint it. I hope Raheem has circumstances go his way moreso than his predecessor.

Sure, but let's be honest Jersey...you're painting it like Gruden's agent would...

acacius

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#8 : January 19, 2009, 11:23:12 AM

Can we win a damn playoff game now? Damn it's been too long

I'd settle for seeing the team with a solid direction.  This is the NFL, so who knows, but I'm not really expecting the team to come out next year and tear things up.  We still have a brutal schedule, and aren't going to have a roster that's overflowing with top-notch talent.

tajik_buc

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#9 : January 19, 2009, 11:23:27 AM

"They also watched as Tomlin, Smith and Marinelli worked as Tampa Bay assistants and left for head jobs and, for the most part, great success."

This made me laugh out loud.  Mentioning the coach who went 0-16 and using "great success" in the same line!  Love Marinelli for his time here, but that is just too damn funny.

"And maybe the Glazers looked around the league and saw men such as Atlanta's Mike Smith and Baltimore's John Harbaugh having success in their first seasons as head coaches on any level."

Yep

"...I'm guessing they'll sound more like Dungy and former general manager Rich McKay than like Gruden and Allen."

Dungy yes, but god no, not like Richie.

sammy8887

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#10 : January 19, 2009, 11:28:12 AM

"They also watched as Tomlin, Smith and Marinelli worked as Tampa Bay assistants and left for head jobs and, for the most part, great success."

This made me laugh out loud.  Mentioning the coach who went 0-16 and using "great success" in the same line!  Love Marinelli for his time here, but that is just too damn funny.

That's why he had to include "for the most part"...2 out of 3 can be viewed as "for the most part"...

jerseybucsfan

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#11 : January 19, 2009, 11:31:52 AM

Not really, sammy. Winning breeds the DEMAND for more winning.
Dungy wore out his welcome too here and he was a ''nice guy.'' Both are strong coaches with completely different approaches.
The approach will always be second guessed later by those who want to blame someone else for their failings. One can re-invent things however they like.
However, what I found incredible were the similarities of the Dungy and Gruden meltdowns.
Rewind to late 2001: Bucs win huge game vs. NO. Did we see Dungy's firing coming after that game? Then big win vs. defending champion Ravens? Again, no. But the way we lost to Philly in Week 17 set the stage for the humiliating loss in the playoffs and a feeling of fear, hopelessness.
With the Bucs, at 9-3, no one saw it coming. The defensive performance on MNF at Carolina was nothing like we had ever seen from this defense and the Kiffin announcement could not have come at a worse time. Then too Garcia's injury couldn't have come at a worse time. Atlanta was ripe for the picking. Ryan wasn't all that confident himself. And yet we couldn't get it done. I think the letdown at that juncture was very similar to the end of 2000; in a span of six days, a division title and 2 was in sight. Within two games, it was not only gone, but now the playoffs were in jeopardy. And SD's resurgence couldn't come at a worse time, which led to losing an Oakland game that NEVER would have been lost under any other circumstances (young QB finally putting it together vs. scared team in freefall).
This is NOT to say Gruden should not have been fired. It happens, you accept the consequences. But much of the perception has been recreated to take the heat off the MANY who failed to make this happen.

In Verner We Trust

jerseybucsfan

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#12 : January 19, 2009, 11:32:50 AM

Acacius, no you won't. Fans use ''solid direction'' as a smokescreen for younger. If younger doesn't pan out quickly, you throw the new guy under the bus just like the old guy.
So PLEASE be patient.

In Verner We Trust

tajik_buc

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#13 : January 19, 2009, 11:35:29 AM

"They also watched as Tomlin, Smith and Marinelli worked as Tampa Bay assistants and left for head jobs and, for the most part, great success."

This made me laugh out loud.  Mentioning the coach who went 0-16 and using "great success" in the same line!  Love Marinelli for his time here, but that is just too damn funny.

That's why he had to include "for the most part"...2 out of 3 can be viewed as "for the most part"...

Just seems his article would have seemed better off if he had just left the last part of that sentence off.  If he had, then the first part would have been an undisputable fact.  Just how it struck me

cyberdude557

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#14 : January 19, 2009, 11:40:14 AM

Morris wont be successful unless the Glazers are willing to spend money. The draft is only one part of the offseason. You can't build a competitive team JUST through the draft. You use the draft to get depth, the future, and develop a core. You cant use the draft to fill holes. That won't work. You use the free agency to fill holes and stack up playmakers.

They know if they start the year 2-6, they are in trouble. If Morris seems to be a bust, the chants for Bill Cowher will start by week 10.

The expectations wont be any different. Even Dominik said "we are not rebuilding."
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