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olafberserker

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#135 : January 17, 2010, 05:07:09 PM

It won't because it's about the OOC schedule.

Which is stupid, since the overall SOS is top ranked year after year.

No it's not, since everyone has to play their conference schedule

BucsBullsBolts

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#136 : January 17, 2010, 05:09:19 PM

It won't because it's about the OOC schedule.

Which is stupid, since the overall SOS is top ranked year after year.

That's because of the overrating of the conference to begin with through voodoo accounting....  8)

Biggs3535

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#137 : January 17, 2010, 05:15:38 PM

It won't because it's about the OOC schedule.

Which is stupid, since the overall SOS is top ranked year after year.

No it's not, since everyone has to play their conference schedule

Of course it is.  How tough should SEC team's schedule be?  Should they have the top 12 toughest schedules in the friggin' country every year?  Their schedules are fine.

Teams who play piss-poor in conference schedules are the ones who need to look for tough game out of conference, and SEC teams aren't in that group.


oregonbucfan

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#138 : January 17, 2010, 05:17:41 PM

It won't because it's about the OOC schedule.

Which is stupid, since the overall SOS is top ranked year after year.

and thats proved based on what? Preception?

I agree the SEC is the best conference, but perception in things like preseason top 25 rankings feed it.


Biggs3535

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#139 : January 17, 2010, 05:26:51 PM

It won't because it's about the OOC schedule.

Which is stupid, since the overall SOS is top ranked year after year.

and thats proved based on what? Preception?

I agree the SEC is the best conference, but perception in things like preseason top 25 rankings feed it.

It's not proved by perception, but a mathematical formula.  Perception and preseason rankings has squat to do with it.


olafberserker

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#140 : January 17, 2010, 05:40:57 PM

It won't because it's about the OOC schedule.

Which is stupid, since the overall SOS is top ranked year after year.

No it's not, since everyone has to play their conference schedule

Of course it is. How tough should SEC team's schedule be? Should they have the top 12 toughest schedules in the friggin' country every year? Their schedules are fine.

Teams who play piss-poor in conference schedules are the ones who need to look for tough game out of conference, and SEC teams aren't in that group.

I'll try again.  The discussion is about OOC schedule.  You want to ride the "our conference is tough" wave, then go ahead.

Biggs3535

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#141 : January 17, 2010, 05:45:11 PM

It won't because it's about the OOC schedule.

Which is stupid, since the overall SOS is top ranked year after year.

No it's not, since everyone has to play their conference schedule

Of course it is. How tough should SEC team's schedule be? Should they have the top 12 toughest schedules in the friggin' country every year? Their schedules are fine.

Teams who play piss-poor in conference schedules are the ones who need to look for tough game out of conference, and SEC teams aren't in that group.

I'll try again.  The discussion is about OOC schedule.  You want to ride the "our conference is tough" wave, then go ahead.

And I'll try again.  What does OOC schedule matter when the overall schedule is tough?  It doesn't.  A tough schedule is a tough schedule, whether it comes from in conference or OOC games.


olafberserker

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#142 : January 17, 2010, 06:16:45 PM

It won't because it's about the OOC schedule.

Which is stupid, since the overall SOS is top ranked year after year.

No it's not, since everyone has to play their conference schedule

Of course it is. How tough should SEC team's schedule be? Should they have the top 12 toughest schedules in the friggin' country every year? Their schedules are fine.

Teams who play piss-poor in conference schedules are the ones who need to look for tough game out of conference, and SEC teams aren't in that group.

I'll try again. The discussion is about OOC schedule. You want to ride the "our conference is tough" wave, then go ahead.

And I'll try again. What does OOC schedule matter when the overall schedule is tough? It doesn't. A tough schedule is a tough schedule, whether it comes from in conference or OOC games.

because the discussion is about OOC schedule not SOS .... oh brother

Biggs3535

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#143 : January 17, 2010, 06:23:27 PM

So even though teams overall schedule is tougher than damn near ever other team in the country, people still piss and moan over a select few games?  Sounds like sour grapes to me, or folks just like to b!tch over nothing.

SOS takes into account all games played, in conference or out of it.  Overall SOS is a helluva lot more important than OOC schedule.


BucsBullsBolts

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#144 : January 17, 2010, 08:21:52 PM

It won't because it's about the OOC schedule.

Which is stupid, since the overall SOS is top ranked year after year.

and thats proved based on what? Preception?

I agree the SEC is the best conference, but perception in things like preseason top 25 rankings feed it.

It's not proved by perception, but a mathematical formula.  Perception and preseason rankings has squat to do with it.

Mathematical formula based on what ..... what starting point? Are you saying it treats every FBS team as equals at the beginning of the season?

oregonbucfan

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#145 : January 17, 2010, 08:28:08 PM

So even though teams overall schedule is tougher than damn near ever other team in the country, people still piss and moan over a select few games?  Sounds like sour grapes to me, or folks just like to b!tch over nothing.

SOS takes into account all games played, in conference or out of it.  Overall SOS is a helluva lot more important than OOC schedule.


OOC is a huge factor how good you are. See how you play against other styles of teams etc. When you play Jackcrack Univ and than conference play all you see is how good X team is against Y team who all play in the same conference you dont know how good you really are compared to other teams.

Its not the SEC fault its the medias fault.


Biggs3535

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#146 : January 17, 2010, 08:28:17 PM

Mathematical formula based on what ..... what starting point? Are you saying it treats every FBS team as equals at the beginning of the season?

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/sagarin/fbt09.htm

Quote
The SCHEDULE ratings represent what the rating would have to be for a
hypothetical team to have a mathematical expectation of winning precisely 50%
of their games against the schedule played by the team in question in the games
that it has played so far.  The schedule difficulty of each given game takes
into account the rating of the opponent and the location of the game. This
is the same concept that is used in computing the WIN50% conference ratings.



Biggs3535

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#147 : January 17, 2010, 08:37:12 PM

OOC is a huge factor how good you are.

No, it's not.  There are good teams, National Championship winning teams, with cakewalk OOC schedules.

OOC play is important for teams in weak conferences, so those teams have weak schedules.  If a team has a strong schedule within their conference, OOC are meaningless.

What BCS team had the toughest OOC schedule?  What team had the weakest?  Convince me of how important it is.


BucsBullsBolts

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#148 : January 17, 2010, 08:42:08 PM

Mathematical formula based on what ..... what starting point? Are you saying it treats every FBS team as equals at the beginning of the season?

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/sagarin/fbt09.htm

Quote
The SCHEDULE ratings represent what the rating would have to be for a
hypothetical team to have a mathematical expectation of winning precisely 50%
of their games against the schedule played by the team in question in the games
that it has played so far.  The schedule difficulty of each given game takes
into account the rating of the opponent and the location of the game. This
is the same concept that is used in computing the WIN50% conference ratings.


I think this is more important in regards to my question:

Quote
For the first few weeks of the season, the starting ratings have weight
in the process(BAYESIAN), but once the teams are all CONNECTED, then
the starting ratings are no longer used and all teams are started equal
and the ELO CHESS is then done in an UNBIASED manner from that point on.
RATING and PREDICTOR are now unbiased and the ELO-CHESS is now unbiased.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
In ELO CHESS, only winning and losing matters; the score margin is of no consequence,
which makes it very "politically correct".  However it is less accurate in its predictions for
upcoming games than is the PURE POINTS, in which the score margin is the only thing that matters.
PURE POINTS is also known as PREDICTOR, BALLANTINE, RHEINGOLD, WHITE OWL and is the best single PREDICTOR
of future games.  The ELO CHESS will be utilized by the Bowl Championship Series(BCS).
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The overall RATING is a synthesis of the two diametrical opposites, ELO CHESS and PURE POINTS (PREDICTOR).


but I unabashedly admit that I have no freaking clue what it means .... It'd be great if they had some kind of examples.

Biggs3535

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#149 : January 17, 2010, 08:51:45 PM

I think that second part you quoted is the about the actual rating of the teams, not the SOS rating.

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